I know now that Teddy will protect me

oriondw · Oct 30, 2005

014509Bo said:

First I haven't read all the posts

But, I want to stress that if you are going in a public area where there may be bikers or joggers they have all the rights over a dog owner. If your dog had made contact with the skin of this person, or if this jogger considered your dog to be a threat by the way he was attacked he is in the perfect legal right to do so. If someone broke into my home and my dog attacked and harmed the robber. that robber could sue me.
One thing bad for pittie owners, this attack will probably be blamed on pits and will put another scar against their name. That man will probably not know the dog was a coon hound mix, just a pit mix.
I'm sure the jogger who was attacked is going to be talking and very upset by the ordeal. The jogger was in the right, the dog owner is in the wrong. As the owner of the dog (btw, this dog would never pass a CGC test) the dog owner should have gained instant control over the dog and moved off the path to allow the jogger to pass. This is why people want to ban breeds, its because of people who own dogs that are out of control. No dog should ever lunge at another person. For a person who was intending on hurting a person, they are looking for vulnerable people. There is no need to protect yourself with a personal protection dog. People who want to rape, attack, rob etc will not pick a person that has a dog, even a lap dog as it would attract too much attention.
This is the reason people want to ban certain breeds. If a person gets attacked while jogging (and in their perfect legal right to be jogging in the area, while with the dog owner it is a previlidge not a right to be in that area). We can thank people like this who do not have properly trained and controlled dog
Once my sister was waiting at a red light, her passenger door was not locked and her Doberman was laying on the sit beside her. A man came running over and opened the door and was about to jump inside. The Dobe sat up, but, made no attempt to attack. The man jumped back out and took off. This was a case were the dog was well trained and able to control itself. This Dobe also passed her CGC title easily as she reacted to situations but collected her self easily.

Didn't mean to sound harsh. Just a reality break

Most people work with their dogs and have control of their dogs. You also can prove how much control you have by getting your dog CGC titled to show that it can tolerate these situations. It takes socialization etc. When you have breeds that have the potential to attack then you take more care and either avoid situations or you work with the dog to desensitize it to these situations.

Few things..

1. I already stated the law in Florida, alot of states have similar laws. And it is on her side.

2. Bikes by law are required to be on the road and not on a pedestrian sidewalk. So if a dog attacks a bike rider who was on a sidewalk it is the bikers fault... again by law.

keyodie · Oct 30, 2005

You know what? Let's just read the posts before we start telling sparks that her dog is vicious.

sparks19 said:

Wow, what a mean dog.

Dreeza · Oct 30, 2005

sparks,

i think what teddy did was VERY VERY noble, and actually, even further proves that he is a people lover...the fact that you screamed, and were very obviously scared definately affected him...he obviously got scared too, and probably even more so when he realized you were scared too! It seems like he didnt wanna have to hurt him at all, so he just tried blocking him, and im sure, when you were telling the jogger to stop, you were not calm about it (assumption, but thats what i am getting out of your posts) which makes sense anyways...so teddy musta been like whoa, something id definately NOT right about this guy...

the fact that teddy did not bite him, just restrained him is very important here...poor doggy was probably so torn between emotions, lol...he was prob like 'ooh, person, want to play...but my owner is scared!!!" i honestly didnt realize that a dog can display that much self control in a situation like that.

and, yes, the jogger probably was a very nice person, and had he been a dog hater, may have done something, but regardless...the jogger recognized he was at fault, and was totally unharmed...probably very aware that he coulda been a complete a** and taken action against teddy

anyways, just wanted to put my opinion in here! and give teddy a big treat for me!!

Ash47 · Oct 30, 2005

When a dog wants to inflict true harm or draw blood, it knows how to do so. Teddy knew when to stop and was just protecting his owner. Plus, if they were on the dog side of the walking path, then it puts the fault on the jogger.

Julie · Oct 30, 2005

Why Not? You are being very forward with your views, you should have read the posts!

Where did you get that information???

If someone broke into my house and my dogs attacked him/her, great. Cause if not he/she would have a hole in them big enough to see thru!!!!!!!!!! Anyone can sue anyone, but that does not mean it will fly!!!!!!!!

Maybe in your world...........A dog that can think for himself is one that might save your life. The dog that needs a command and sits there watching you get stabbed or grabbed is not one for me. You can call it whatever you want.

No, the dogs are not out of control, it is the owners that are out of control. They raise dogs to attack and fight and think it is funny. You my dear are out of line!!!!

Where did you get that information from????????????????????????????????????

You are just full of it.....

doberkim · Oct 30, 2005

keyodie said:

it has to do with the post right before mine, which addresses this very issue. it also has to do with people comparing an outright threat to their life and safety, with a jogger who is not acting aggressively and threatening the owner.

how a dog reacts to an actual real and present danger, or a threat of one, is much different. if my dog felt that a child who was running erratically on a path was worthy of caution, would i be justified because i was startled?

i think some of you are pretty cavalier about what would happen if your dog did bite - maybe you arent aware of the implications of even the THREAT of a lawsuit can do to your homeowners insurance, what can be done to the dog, etc. its incredibly difficult to pursue the train of thought that a dog bite was justified even if its on your own property, and i know many people that have had dog bites on their property still be sued and still be found guilty - even when the dog was "protecting".

in some states, no matter what the situation is, the owner is ALWAYS responsible for the dogs bite, no matter what justification is used. unlike people, its presumed guilty until proven innocent in the dog world. is it fair, no, but thats the way it is.

i have no problem with a dog protecting its owner, and i have had my own dog feel it was necessary. but they were true dangers, and its unacceptable for my dog to act that way towards innocent people for no other reason than me being startled.

oc_spirit · Oct 30, 2005

Alright I'm a fence sitter here LOL I can see where the impression lies that Teddy was doing a good deed, however in my eyes, if it was OC it would not be a good deed at all! Huskies are bred to be independent, this means they take cues from team mates and especially their owners, however they evaluate situations and then act out on their own accord. This means that if I react afraid to something OC will pick up that cue and become on alert, however before reacting he will scout the situation and figure out for himself whether defence is needed or not, and then react as he sees just. This is a well-balanced dog IMO and how dogs should be trained though it is very hard to achieve and takes many hour of commitment to get there (some dogs just never GET IT because they react too strongly to their owner's emotions - not always a bad thing). How do I know OC's like this? Because it's already been put through unintentional testing! Oh ya and I wanted to add, no dog should ever attack someone until the other person makes a clear offensive first (this is more than just a surprise and advance!).

So here are my experiences with OC:

Late night walking, we were passing the KFC and two people were fighting with other gathered around watching. Already my nerves were on edge and so were OC's because he sensed my uneasiness AND the mixed feelings of the crowd. One fighter pushed the other towards me and they stumbled back in my direction. This scared me and shocked OC as he wasn't expecting it. He let out an immediate growl and placed himself between me and the fighters and crowd. The person kinda stumbled around a bit, at times coming towards us and spewing out "choice" words but not once did OC do anything more than emit a low, warning growl even though there were times the fighter was within snapping distance and they were saying things like "What the **** you looking at? Do you wanna fight me too? C'mon!" He knew things were wrong but I stayed calm and likewise, so did he. Had that fighter physically done something to me I have full confidence he would've then reacted physically himself. With a short "C'mon OC on-by" he ceased growling and kept walking regardless of the fighter still yelling at us.

Another time again we were walking late at night (I love night walks!) and we were passing the tavern when suddenly a drunkard stumbled out. I yelled/screamed "OH MY GOD!!!" since he totally surprised me and then he started stumbling my way saying things like "C'mere pretty lady, lets go back to my place!" I was so scared!!! OC read this and again placed himself giving audible growls which stopped the drunkard and made him stumble off in the other direction. As soon as the drunkard ceased advancement OC ceased offensiveness and proceeded to pee on a post LOL

Once more at night I was cutting through a parking lot and as I rounded a building I found myself smack dab in the middle of a biker gang chilling. My heart was pounding so fast as I could see some of them reaching for their guns/knives since I surprised them and they had no idea who I was. Upon seeing OC for some reason it relaxed them and they proceeded to coo over him (REALLY wierd!) and began playing with him. I was stilled scared stiff as I could see their guns and knives and such poking out from under leather vests and holsters but OC knew these guys were not a threat and happily basked in their pats and fun wrestle matches paying no attention to me still breaching the shakes feeling totally uncomfortable in the middle of all these 6' something men weighing in at least 250Lbs with weapons and lil ol 5'4" me weighing only 170Lbs (at that time- now down to 151Lbs woot!) and my best defence being a dog. LOL

My last story takes place in the daytime (finally LOL). I was at an outdoor fight rehersal so I brought OC along with me and tied him to a tree with is long tie-out while I did what I had to do for rehersal. When Chad and I had to fight we decided to do it over by OC since our fight was with fisticuffs (no weapons) and so there was really no reason to stick to the designated fight ring since there was no risk of impaling some random person. We already knew our fight really well so we were going full speed with zaa (adding grunts and other such noises to make it sound as real as it looks) so essentially it really did look like i was getting the crap beaten out of me. What did OC do the whole time? Lay in the nice cool shade with the goofiest smile on his face watching everyone run around and play (AKA fight) and then roll over on his back hoping for belly rubs anytime someone came over to him to say hi. No attempts at saving me what so ever. Why? He knew I was perfectly fine and Chad wasn't really hurting me at all. This was even doubley confirmed when after the fight Chad then went over to OC and had a good ol wrestling match with OC that ended in them laying in the grass together and almost falling asleep! For the record, OC had never met Chad in his life!

This is what I call, a well-balanced dog! An evaluator befor a reactor!

sparks19 · Oct 30, 2005

Well Teddy has experienced situations where he has seen me "fighting" with people. Like my little brother whom he had only just met. We wrestle all the time cause he thinks he can beat me but he really can't. TEddy doesn't care. He actually LOVES men. I don't know what it is but the bigger the better for him lol. he loves to hug and cuddle men. However, everyone is blaming the reaction on the dog and the way he was or wasn't trained. If only you really knew me and knew what a spaz I was in scary situations. I am one of those people that you would likely have to smack in an emergency situation to stop me from running around like a chicken with my head cut off.

Teddy is really a big chicken. He is not quick to attack like everyone would like to think. He is only a year old and in the world of fight or flight he is always the flight. Tonight a little shih tzu came after him growling and threatening to nip and Teddy ran away with his tail between his legs. Don't think that this is characteristic. THAT is the worst part about this whole thing. Everyone acts like its something he does to anyone and anything that gets in his way. I honestly see your points of view but some of you are honestly reading a little too much into this whole thing.

CanadianK9 · Oct 31, 2005

keyodie said:

Because my dog has been trained properly and very well, and knows how to assess situations properly. Might I ad she has been in situations where people come out of nowhere or that startle us etc and she has not reacted to the extent that spark's did. Mine knows when to react and how to go about it.

I never said that she is a bad owner or its a bad dog she has, I just merely pointed out that if she is going to condone the dogs actions, to get the proper training and make sure both know how to handle it. Otherwise discourage the behaviour.

oriondw · Oct 31, 2005

CanadianK9 said:

You're so full of it, its just pouring out of your ears.

Im so glad I dont own a dog like yours...

Let me say this again.

If I told someone approaching me to stop a number of times, especially if I screamed at them... and they DIDNT.... they are a fair game. I would go into fight mode myself and my dog would feel it.

Anyone dumb enough to charge a dog when the owner is yelling for them to stop should check their head out.

So you're happy with your spineless dog that wouldnt attack anything, great, but please dont put down other trainers and their dogs because of what YOU think is appropriate or not.

Also, just so you know... you CANT train out dogs natural incstincts, if a dog is worth anything, it will protect the owner and if it doesnt its a poor specimen.

Luckily when I yell stop people stop.

CanadianK9 · Oct 31, 2005

oriondw said:

lol, I think you may have misconcieved something, because I never put anyone down, as for my dog, if I was in TRUE trouble she would probobly tear their head off.

You are right, you cant train out a dogs natural instincts but you can show it when it is appropriate to exibit certain behaviours. Just because mine knows how to properly handle a situation doesnt make it spinless and worthless, it actually makes it more valuable.

And as far as it goes, the only person who has even begun to try to put down anyone is you, I haven't said anything of the sort.

oriondw · Oct 31, 2005

CanadianK9 said:

Right... And saying multiple times how your dog is so much better trained and how it acts so much nicer and how you're such a better trainer, while the others persons dog is untrained agressive dog?

If thats not a superiority complex I dont know what is.

Puckstop31 · Oct 31, 2005

CanadianK9 said:

He would NOT be the only one....

Just because it was not your INTENT, does not mean you did not do it. But I know how things work in people LIKE YOURS world. It is ALWAYS somebody elses fault.

gaddylovesdogs · Oct 31, 2005

My sister told me these two stories....she was out with Colby, our terrier mix (she's actually quite large). There was this man there and Colby started growling at him and wouldn't let him near my sister...he was a drug addict. Another time, Colby started growling and barking at a different man. Once the man left, my sister's friend said, "She has a good reason to be protective - he's a drunk and he beats his wife." Now I know that most likely, if those men tried to come near my sister, Colby would try to bite them. And that's what I think she should do if we are around anyone dangerous. That's her job and that's what I wan't her to do.

And don't go telling me my dog is a vicious beast, she isn't trained, I'm a horrible owner

. You don't know my dog, I do.

Puckstop31 · Oct 31, 2005

For those of you who do not know, I am Tanya's (Sparks19) husband. With that, I shall try to respond to all of this in one post.

It never ceases to amaze me how ARROGANT some people can be. From ONE post, we have people telling my wife that a.) she is a bad pet owner and b.) my beloved pet, Teddy, is a bad dog.

Words cannot describe the pride and love I feel for Teddy after hearing about this. Yesterday, I got to see the actual place (this is key, CanadianK9, you know FACTS. I know, how dare I let facts get in the way of your grandly crafted delusion.) where it happened. There is NO WAY that guy was JUST out jogging. If he was coming down the path at that point, you naysayers might have a bit of a point. But, if I was there and he came running out of the bush from where he did, he would (in canada) have a broken nose and a new appreciation for pain. IN the US, he would have been staring down the barrell of a Sig Sauer P226 in .40 caliber.

My dog protected my wife when he had too. I can think of nothing more nobel in a family pet. If that makes him a bad dog, I hope ALL my future pets are JUST as bad. I would go to jail for Teddy. I would hurt other people before I let anything happen to him.

I could go on and on but Tanya's friends took care of business for me. THANK YOU ALL.

Orion, sir, please never again let us bicker about the dumb crap that we have. You kinda took a leading role in the defence of my wife and pet. I was wrong about you I think. For that I am am truly sorry.

It never ceases to amaze me how arrogant and IGNORANT some pet people can be.

BTW, we passed about 10 REAL joggers yesterday in the same area. Teddy barely paid them any attention. I can see, how he could have seen that as a real threat. I would have. (I am a 12 year Army veteran and have been in combat multiple times, I can determine when a threat is real or not.)

Your turn....

andy. · Oct 31, 2005

Well-done Teddy!! I think he was very far from in the wrong, if anything I think he showed Tremendous restraint, with this guy in the bushes and just next to a jogging path it doesn’t sound like he was just jogging at all, thank go you don’t have one of these overly trained robot dogs who would have just come and sat by you while you were mugged or raped, lets get things in to perspective here guys teddy repeated tried to stop him, sparks was telling him to stop, all that teddy eventually did was restrain him using his clothing, I think this is about the perfect balance between over aggression and just not responding when he thought that him owner needed help, I think the people saying the dog was in the wrong either love to argue…. I’m wearing a white shirt!, anybody want to tell me its black?? lol, just jumped to conclusions and now don’t want to acknowledge that they are wrong OR if they actually do think that the great teddy (who deserves a medal btw) was in the wrong and -- ***edited this bit out lol!

(calmed down a bit)***

CanadianK9 · Oct 31, 2005

Puckstop31 said:

If something similar happened my case it would be MY fault for not getting the proper supervision and/or training for it. You seem to be under the false impression that I blame something on someone, in fact if you look its actually quite the opposite, I am not blaming anyone for anything if you read the posts correctly.

Just for the record the only thing I had said and tried to point out is that

The dog is being protectional in a situation that is not harmful, I am sure they were startled but that is not a reason to go attacking people.

I never stated that it was eithers fault, nor mine because I had nothing to do with the incident, I actually gave her advice on what to do if she chooses to condone the behaviour; which is seek proper instruction and training on the subject of protectional issues.

I never said that I was worse or better in any form, In fact it was actually brought up by somebody else what would happen with my dog in the same instance, I told them that she would react differently because I seeked proper training and instruction there was no claim of being better at all.

You seem to be convinced that I think that she is bad owner, or that its a bad dog, Actually I think quite differently, I think that you 2 are good owners and that your dog is a good dog, I just mentioned that if the behaviour is going to exibited and be rewarded for such protectional behaviours that the dog and the owner know how to handle it.

It is because I want to see you guys happy and healthy with your dog that I relay the advice of seeking proper instruction, The last thing we would want to hear is that you had to be fined or that Teddy had to be quarentined or destroyed because of a misconception.

So rather than immediately taking the defensive and calling us arrogant and some of the other comments made, try to understand that not everyone that is replying is trying to put you down a peg or calling you bad in any way. Nobody ever wants to see something terrible happen because of a mistake or misunderstanding.

Whether you take the advice or not is your choice. I just dont want to see a nice person and fellow dog enthusiasts be taken action to for something that they did not mean to happen or that happened because they failed to inquire about what to do.

However you feel is how you feel,and nothing is going to change that, But I sincerely hope that you make a correct choice in at least understanding the behaviours and applying an approprite reaction to it.

I am sorry that you think we are trying to insult you, but that is truly NOT the case.

And with that I say good-day to you and hope you the best.

Dreeza · Oct 31, 2005

CanadianK9 said:

how do you know that she really wasnt in TRUE trouble?? the fact that the guy came outta nowhere is just shady to me...and the fact that he didnt listen makes him even more suspicious...teddy may have been the only thing that kept the situation turning into one of "TRUE trouble" ...i guess next time sparks should make sure teddy doesnt react until it is for certain that the guy is gonna hold a gun to her head and rape her???? i mean...i know that situation is very drastic, but at the same time, no one will ever know if the jogger was just an innocent jogger, or really did have some bad intentions. I am assuming you are a guy...if not, id be surprised...but if you are, then you will never know the feeling of a guy coming out of nowhere, when you are in a place that you may not easily be able to call for help...

i think you are very wrong in implying that teddy did not handle himself properly in that situation...when i read the post, i was just in awe at how he reacted..i thought it was absolutely amazing...maybe i have a bias towards him, lol, all the stories i read about him make me crack up...he sounds like SUCH an awesome pet!!! but anyways, teddy stories always make me smile...and this one just amazed me

plus, i dont see how anyone can predict how their dog will react in a situation...for example, (prob not the best, cause oakley isnt the best trained dog) oakley ALWAYS gets excited and happy when he sees people...out of the 100s we have probably come across, there has been ONE and ONLY ONE guy he reacted to...he tensed up, and kinda growled...and then i quickly crossed the street, and he stopped....this guy looked like a complete crack addict, and prob was...ANYWAYS, my point it, i think even the BEST trained dogs are not 100% predictable, so i dont think it is fair for you to assume that your dog could properly handle the situation

oriondw · Oct 31, 2005

Bottom line, he did what he should have done and dont let anyone tell you otherwise!

Whitedobelover · Oct 31, 2005

i agree with you orion... absolutely correct

I know now that Teddy will protect me

user not active

Keyozilla

Active Member

Taco Dog

I am back again.

Naturally Natural

Snow Girl

I'd rather be at Disney

Active Member

user not active

Active Member

user not active

Super-Genius

no touchy

Super-Genius

New Member

Active Member

Active Member

user not active

Whitedobelover

Guest