Update on Bush Admin. Regulation--Ladies, read this
- Thread starter Lilavati
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I guarantee there are doctors out there who would not perform it or who would think that the miscarriage was God's way of punishing the mother or some such. There is always someone stupid enough. I saw a quote on one forum that said, "Most afflictions like this [mental disabilities] are caused by sins committed while still inside the womb."
Translation: A woman who has a VALID reason.. well, she can be excused.
But those fscking whores who wont stop having sex JUST to have expensive, painful abortions for fun all the time who "just don't want to have babies" (because, like srsly, we all know if you have the money for one you are under moral obligation to have it, and very few women who don't want to have babies have legitimate reasons not to want one, and as we all know bystanders are the people who should be determining whose abortion is legitimate and whose is not) are wrong and EVIL and MURDERERS.
As for those dirt rotten little sluts who dare to prevent unwanted pregnancies? How dare they. I am indignant that they exist. Get them barefoot and pregnant ASAP, or tell the little hoes to buy a dildo. But dildos are probably evil, too, what am I saying!? They ought to have some self control and RESIST using dildos, too. I can't even IMAGINE what this world is coming to.. WOMEN!?!? With SEX DRIVES!?!? *heart attack*
But those fscking whores who wont stop having sex JUST to have expensive, painful abortions for fun all the time who "just don't want to have babies" (because, like srsly, we all know if you have the money for one you are under moral obligation to have it, and very few women who don't want to have babies have legitimate reasons not to want one, and as we all know bystanders are the people who should be determining whose abortion is legitimate and whose is not) are wrong and EVIL and MURDERERS.
As for those dirt rotten little sluts who dare to prevent unwanted pregnancies? How dare they. I am indignant that they exist. Get them barefoot and pregnant ASAP, or tell the little hoes to buy a dildo. But dildos are probably evil, too, what am I saying!? They ought to have some self control and RESIST using dildos, too. I can't even IMAGINE what this world is coming to.. WOMEN!?!? With SEX DRIVES!?!? *heart attack*
Actually, the pill has many uses other than as a pregnancy preventative. I have PCOS and I was on it for years to help with all the cysts and to prevent them from rupturing (which is very painful!).
And I also consider myself to be very conservative. But I also am a realist. And I would much prefer that birth control (pills, shots, condoms) be available to anyone and everyone who chooses to use them. IMO it's a much better alternative than having an abortion and throwing fetuses away like garbage.
And I also consider myself to be very conservative. But I also am a realist. And I would much prefer that birth control (pills, shots, condoms) be available to anyone and everyone who chooses to use them. IMO it's a much better alternative than having an abortion and throwing fetuses away like garbage.
Oh, that was a widespread belief at one point. If there's something wrong with the baby, its because the mother sinned. If there's something wrong the baby its because the father sinned. If there's something wrong with the baby, a witch must have put a curse on it. Going back a bit further, Mothers who had deformed babies occasionally found themselves burned at the stake, too, on the theory that they had an affair with a demon. Mroe recently, mothers were blamed for all sorts of problems caused by them doing something wrong, see, for example, autism.
I don't see where anyone called anyone else "sluts" and "whores."
I don't agree with abortions being used as a birth control method. Period. My view won't change.
But don't paint me with a brush that I make ignorant statements such as the ones you seem to think we are saying.
All I'm saying is that pregnancy can be prevented. Nothing more, nothing less.
wow, a little heavy with the insults huh???
BC is available, there are thousands of places you can get it, and if you go to a Walgreens and the pharmacist doesn't want to give it to you, you can be sure that their other one probably will. They aren't affecting your health care. Now if they weren't giving you your inhaler when you were having an asthma attack, yes they're endangering your life.
and where can I pick some up at, the local pharmacy??
and please people when you try and insult another's intelligence just try to get your words spelled correctly. It kind of takes away the effect when you try to insult someone and you can't spell it correctly
uhh, yeah. and I already addressed that point, twice. When pregnancy becomes a danger to the mother is one thing, performing elective abortions are quite another.
Having babies might be "natural" but it sure as hell isn't easy.
Birth control is used for SO MUCH MORE THAN JUST NOT HAVING BABIES. I was on it for years to try and control my PMS...my hormones were so out of whack during that time that I became paranoid, suicidal, cramps out the wazoo and bled for almost a week. BC helped to regulate things so I could actually function during that time and life was fabulous. As I've aged and matured and apparently taught my body what it's like to stay sane for entire months instead of just a couple of weeks at a time, I've been ok off of it.
We have members on here with PCOS, something else that is easier to control with a regulated dose of hormones, commonly known as BIRTH CONTROL. Some women really shouldn't have children for health reasons but it is more detrimental to their health to have a hysterectomy, so they go with birth control. Others shouldn't have them because of where they are in life, whether financially, mentally or the sort of relationship they're in. Why should "your" reservations about doing YOUR JOB interfere with their lives and wellbeing?
I've gone to Planned Parenthood before to try and get cheap pills...*snort* I had to make an appointment, could not be more than 2 minutes late checking in or they wouldn't let me in, was required to dump my purse so a security guard could paw through it, then submit to a wanding and pat down. It was my good fortune for the day that I didn't have to go through any protestors. Now, I'm a pretty solid, secure in myself type of person and even *I* was freaked out by all that. Can you truly suggest that someone who has just been raped should have to go through something like that? Oh and because I had a job, low-paying as it was with no insurance, the pills were twice what I had been paying at Walgreens.
Not everyone knows how to research and with people allowing their morals to extend to how a PHONE BOOK is put together..it gets even tougher. We had an issue here not too long ago where some anti-choicers got a job with Yellow Pages and deliberately did not include phone numbers for abortion services or put down wrong numbers. The local news stations had to give out the amended numbers on a newscast one night, hope everyone was listening with a pen and paper ready. So doing your own research only works when you have proper resources.
I don't think this is Trojan Horse legislation, I know it is. I know that this is yet one more of those little "It's for the children, think of the children!" steps that has become such an absurdly successful marketing campaign for everything lately. DNR--gone! Think of how sad the children will be to lose that person! Birthcontrol--gone! Think of how the sad the children will be to not be fertilized!
Hope that makes sense, haven't gotten through more than a couple sips of coffee yet.
Birth control is used for SO MUCH MORE THAN JUST NOT HAVING BABIES. I was on it for years to try and control my PMS...my hormones were so out of whack during that time that I became paranoid, suicidal, cramps out the wazoo and bled for almost a week. BC helped to regulate things so I could actually function during that time and life was fabulous. As I've aged and matured and apparently taught my body what it's like to stay sane for entire months instead of just a couple of weeks at a time, I've been ok off of it.
We have members on here with PCOS, something else that is easier to control with a regulated dose of hormones, commonly known as BIRTH CONTROL. Some women really shouldn't have children for health reasons but it is more detrimental to their health to have a hysterectomy, so they go with birth control. Others shouldn't have them because of where they are in life, whether financially, mentally or the sort of relationship they're in. Why should "your" reservations about doing YOUR JOB interfere with their lives and wellbeing?
I've gone to Planned Parenthood before to try and get cheap pills...*snort* I had to make an appointment, could not be more than 2 minutes late checking in or they wouldn't let me in, was required to dump my purse so a security guard could paw through it, then submit to a wanding and pat down. It was my good fortune for the day that I didn't have to go through any protestors. Now, I'm a pretty solid, secure in myself type of person and even *I* was freaked out by all that. Can you truly suggest that someone who has just been raped should have to go through something like that? Oh and because I had a job, low-paying as it was with no insurance, the pills were twice what I had been paying at Walgreens.
Not everyone knows how to research and with people allowing their morals to extend to how a PHONE BOOK is put together..it gets even tougher. We had an issue here not too long ago where some anti-choicers got a job with Yellow Pages and deliberately did not include phone numbers for abortion services or put down wrong numbers. The local news stations had to give out the amended numbers on a newscast one night, hope everyone was listening with a pen and paper ready. So doing your own research only works when you have proper resources.
I don't think this is Trojan Horse legislation, I know it is. I know that this is yet one more of those little "It's for the children, think of the children!" steps that has become such an absurdly successful marketing campaign for everything lately. DNR--gone! Think of how sad the children will be to lose that person! Birthcontrol--gone! Think of how the sad the children will be to not be fertilized!
Hope that makes sense, haven't gotten through more than a couple sips of coffee yet.
I think someone needs to take a minute and get their emotions in check
The TRANSLATION is: when their is a medical necessity it is ok
when it is a matter of convenience it should be ok for a doc to opt out of performing any treatment, and it is well within the legal right of a doc to do so. Just because I treat a whole gamut of NMS issues and you come to me with a strained rotator cuff and I learn it's because you like to beat your dog with that arm, I can refuse to see you. Even if I've been treating you for years prior for other things. It is not considered patient abandonment unless I refuse to refer you somewhere else.
*scritches the Nolusaurus* Deep breath, use your words. 
She wasn't terrible far off though. You'll hear the same phrases all dressed up in fancy language used, with the same excuses. It really does boil down to the fact that we still can't get over the idea that women not only have their own sex drives, but that it doesn't only extend to getting knocked up. The Double Standard is still alive and well in the 21st century.
She wasn't terrible far off though. You'll hear the same phrases all dressed up in fancy language used, with the same excuses. It really does boil down to the fact that we still can't get over the idea that women not only have their own sex drives, but that it doesn't only extend to getting knocked up. The Double Standard is still alive and well in the 21st century.
Yep. In this case he was trying to blame the girl for committing sins while in the womb, however THAT would even work.
Awesome, now she's not only a "sinner", but is not even human?? Awesome.
Anyway, that's why I'm very leery about doctors/nurses going solely off of their own beliefs. Among other things, I think it would open the way to Scientologists purposely becoming pharmacists and then refusing to give ANY prescription drugs out.
Awesome, now she's not only a "sinner", but is not even human?? Awesome.
Anyway, that's why I'm very leery about doctors/nurses going solely off of their own beliefs. Among other things, I think it would open the way to Scientologists purposely becoming pharmacists and then refusing to give ANY prescription drugs out.
I couldn't agree more Coop.
It's your right to choose what you do with your body.... just as it is other peoples right to choose what they do with their body and mind IE: not performing a procedure that they find morally reprehensible. Sorry you can't just shut off your morals and beliefs like a light. If you can... then they aren't really your morals... they are just there at your convenience.
And as mentioned before... I sure as hell wouldn't want someone performing an abortion on me who hated the idea. Yeah... I would rather they say "sorry I won't do it" rather than start the procedure on me and not be able to put their feelings aside.
there are Dr's offices who won't prescribe certain medications... haven't heard anyone complain about that. There are pharmacies (mostly mom and pop type places) that won't fill certain prescriptions... no one complains about that. IMO it is their right to choose what they sell and don't sell because after all... they will be on the hook if you screw up your meds or something happens.
I don't agree with the whole thing about not giving you info on where you can go to get what you need. However, I don't know about you but I sure don't get that info from the local hospital. I get it from a Dr's office.
Seems to me that the whole "Find another job" frame of mind is only going to result in more unemployed people. So because they don't want to do one little procedure they shouldn't be able to help the millions of other people that come into the hospital? the medical field is already hurting to qualified nurses and Dr's... lets not chase the ones we have away. So one nurse doesn't want to participate in an abortion. Walk down to the nurses stand and grab the next nurse that will.
I know I wouldn't want a Dr or Nurse that resented the procedure be forced to perform it on MY body.
I do think not providing any information on where you can go is a little over the top.
It's your right to choose what you do with your body.... just as it is other peoples right to choose what they do with their body and mind IE: not performing a procedure that they find morally reprehensible. Sorry you can't just shut off your morals and beliefs like a light. If you can... then they aren't really your morals... they are just there at your convenience.
And as mentioned before... I sure as hell wouldn't want someone performing an abortion on me who hated the idea. Yeah... I would rather they say "sorry I won't do it" rather than start the procedure on me and not be able to put their feelings aside.
there are Dr's offices who won't prescribe certain medications... haven't heard anyone complain about that. There are pharmacies (mostly mom and pop type places) that won't fill certain prescriptions... no one complains about that. IMO it is their right to choose what they sell and don't sell because after all... they will be on the hook if you screw up your meds or something happens.
I don't agree with the whole thing about not giving you info on where you can go to get what you need. However, I don't know about you but I sure don't get that info from the local hospital. I get it from a Dr's office.
Seems to me that the whole "Find another job" frame of mind is only going to result in more unemployed people. So because they don't want to do one little procedure they shouldn't be able to help the millions of other people that come into the hospital? the medical field is already hurting to qualified nurses and Dr's... lets not chase the ones we have away. So one nurse doesn't want to participate in an abortion. Walk down to the nurses stand and grab the next nurse that will.
I know I wouldn't want a Dr or Nurse that resented the procedure be forced to perform it on MY body.
I do think not providing any information on where you can go is a little over the top.
http://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2008pres/08/20080821reg.pdf
Here is the actual regulation. It deals, for the moment, with "any abortion or sterilization" and not end of life or perscription, though I suspect it is a Trojan horse for those. It no longer explicitly defines birth control as abortion, but it certain leaves that interpretation open. Most notably, not only can you not fire someone for refusing to perform these acts, you can't refuse to hire them either. It also talks about some of the federal programs that give aid to hospitals . . . and you'll see why I said that ending those programs would be a problem.
On the other hand, if you are having trouble sleeping, I admit reading Federal Regulations is a great cure.
Here is the actual regulation. It deals, for the moment, with "any abortion or sterilization" and not end of life or perscription, though I suspect it is a Trojan horse for those. It no longer explicitly defines birth control as abortion, but it certain leaves that interpretation open. Most notably, not only can you not fire someone for refusing to perform these acts, you can't refuse to hire them either. It also talks about some of the federal programs that give aid to hospitals . . . and you'll see why I said that ending those programs would be a problem.
On the other hand, if you are having trouble sleeping, I admit reading Federal Regulations is a great cure.
I find it very contradicting when we are soooooooooooo adamant about our freedom, and use personal freedom to explain lots of things (Oh, he or she has the right to do this and that, even when it goes against social norm etc.. ) - but when it comes to excercise their personal freedom (doctors & nurses in this case) in the name of FAITH to NOT having anything to do with ending or preventing a life, they're being cricticized.
Why?
Why?
News of this legislation bothered me this morning as well. Mainly because I see it as a slippery slope. Sure, there are plenty of physicians out there who will not refuse healthcare based on their own moral opinions, but that isn't the point. As many of you mentioned (emphatically) upthread, if they didn't want to do the job, they shouldn't have become a doctor.
Frankly, the number of unwanted children who end up in state custody, as a juvenile delinquent, or born with birth defects due to an irresponsible mother is staggering. What some people see as the most "natural, beautiful thing" in the world, others see differently. People are entitled to believe what they want to believe, but the moment their morals end up in my pants is the day they need to back up.
Now then, legislation to require all those moral-pushers to adopt a child currently in the system (and all the baggage that comes with him or her) is a law I might be in favor of.
Frankly, the number of unwanted children who end up in state custody, as a juvenile delinquent, or born with birth defects due to an irresponsible mother is staggering. What some people see as the most "natural, beautiful thing" in the world, others see differently. People are entitled to believe what they want to believe, but the moment their morals end up in my pants is the day they need to back up.
Now then, legislation to require all those moral-pushers to adopt a child currently in the system (and all the baggage that comes with him or her) is a law I might be in favor of.