Update on Bush Admin. Regulation--Ladies, read this
- Thread starter Lilavati
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I know for me personally..........I wouldn't want to be forced into doing things I find morally wrong at my place of employment.
I can see their point. I am sure there are plenty of doctors, nurses, workers in general who will fill the void. They are just requiring federally funded places to provide options for the people who DON'T want to participate in certain procedures.
I can see their point. I am sure there are plenty of doctors, nurses, workers in general who will fill the void. They are just requiring federally funded places to provide options for the people who DON'T want to participate in certain procedures.
Okay, LADIES: Here is what I found.
Hillary's petition - go sign. http://www.hillpac.com/action/hhspetition/
I also found this: https://secure.prochoiceamerica.org/site/Advocacy?cmd=display&page=UserAction&id=3253
However, I apparently suck at searching the net, I am sure you all can find better. But for now that's what I know we can do..
Hillary's petition - go sign. http://www.hillpac.com/action/hhspetition/
I also found this: https://secure.prochoiceamerica.org/site/Advocacy?cmd=display&page=UserAction&id=3253
However, I apparently suck at searching the net, I am sure you all can find better. But for now that's what I know we can do..
Then I am going to suggest a downright radical thing here.
I suggest that Hypothetical Coop who wishes to be able to legally withhold birth control pills, Plan B emergency contraception and other forms of contraception, and explicitly allows workers to withhold information about such services and refuse to refer patients elsewhere get another job. You know, one where Hypothetical Cooper's job is not, actually to provide health care to real people who desperately need it. I suggest she gets a job somewhere where her "morals" do not interfere with her work. Period.
You know why? Because her "morals" should not be interfering with my health. Period.
And, btw, I don't call those 'morals in action'... I call that control. If anyone here doesn't see it that way, read the italicized sentence again.
I suggest that Hypothetical Coop who wishes to be able to legally withhold birth control pills, Plan B emergency contraception and other forms of contraception, and explicitly allows workers to withhold information about such services and refuse to refer patients elsewhere get another job. You know, one where Hypothetical Cooper's job is not, actually to provide health care to real people who desperately need it. I suggest she gets a job somewhere where her "morals" do not interfere with her work. Period.
You know why? Because her "morals" should not be interfering with my health. Period.
And, btw, I don't call those 'morals in action'... I call that control. If anyone here doesn't see it that way, read the italicized sentence again.
Well I am not too concerned either. I would rather someone not do a procedure ( especially involving surgery) if they did not want too. I would rather know that up front.
/edit added- to tell a true situation, when my grandmother was dying from altizmers, there was one nurse in her ward she was in at the hospital that did not believe in the DNR. It was my grandmothers wish, our acceptance but when her shift was on, literally someone in my family would stay at the hospital as the nurse was forced to be her nurse although she stated her beliefs in the "morality" of this action.
/edit added- to tell a true situation, when my grandmother was dying from altizmers, there was one nurse in her ward she was in at the hospital that did not believe in the DNR. It was my grandmothers wish, our acceptance but when her shift was on, literally someone in my family would stay at the hospital as the nurse was forced to be her nurse although she stated her beliefs in the "morality" of this action.
It doesn't bother me a bit that people have a right to refuse to do something morally repugnant (though refusing to give birth control . . . why are you a health care professional then?). But refusing to refer, or provide information is WAY out of line. You won't do it? Fine, who will. Give me the phone number. I would never ask, or expect to ask, someone morally opposed to do an abortion. But refusing to provide services (including services that are much less morally questionable to most people) AND refusing to tell you were you can go, or tell you about your options . . . that's very disturbing.
Also, federal funding means ANY federal funding . . . and most healthcare places recieve at least SOME federal funding.
Also, federal funding means ANY federal funding . . . and most healthcare places recieve at least SOME federal funding.
And why on earth should a member of your family want to do that? Because someone would violate your grandmother's wishes by enforcing her own beliefs on your grandmother and your family? Frankly, that's outrageous. And that's what this regulation would allow. Don't believe in DNR? Then don't get a job at a hospital. Get a job as a private nurse, or a whole bunch of you should get together and make your own hospital where everyone knows they don't do these things. But a family should NOT have to act as nurses to make sure someone with a DNR order is not ressuciated, especially if they are PAYING to have somone in the hospital. That's nuts.
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Just curious...does a vasectomy fall into the birth control category and if so, why not? The only purpose for it is to cease the release of sperm, right?
I have to agree with Nolu - no one is forcing people to take jobs doing something they are opposed to. If you don't like your job, fine, but don't force your morals into MY health care.
I have to agree with Nolu - no one is forcing people to take jobs doing something they are opposed to. If you don't like your job, fine, but don't force your morals into MY health care.
Oh, it's more than nuts. It's presumption on the part of the health care worker (I refuse to call someone like that a professional - it's an insult to the real professionals) to the point of hubris, and it is symptomatic of the mindset that was creeping but is now out in the open, that we should abrogate all of our rights and personal responsibilities to someone/something who "knows what is best for us."
That, I find, chilling.
I'm afraid this is Trojan Horse legislation.
That, I find, chilling.
I'm afraid this is Trojan Horse legislation.
I truly do fail to see the problem. YOU don't want to do the procedure, give BC pills, or share information about who will or whatever else I am looking for? OK fine, I am an educated adult, I can find my OWN provider who will.
Come on girls...........we aren't living in the dark ages where information is not readily available. I just about GUARANTEE that if/when this becomes an issue you will have places ADVERTISING IN BOLD that they provide X,Y, and Z.........there will be no problems in finding what you want or need.
Not only do I find it more than fair not to force people into doing procedures they find morally wrong............I find it preposterous that you would say "find another job" to a doctor or nurse who did not want to participate in abortions or BC if they felt it was wrong. I am sure they became a doctor or nurse for MANY other reasons besides those, and helping people in a way they find morally right is a good thing.
Honestly, I know of many vets who don't participate in cropping, docking, or putting to sleep an animal they don't agree should be PTS. They don't need to find another job..........it's their right as a professional to refuse those services. The only difference is they are NOT federally funded.
I am all for BC and I am sure sometime (very soon) my daughters will be on it. I am also for letting woman CHOOSE what to do with their body.
I don't see how you can be for the right to choose.............but be against others choosing NOT to participate.
Come on girls...........we aren't living in the dark ages where information is not readily available. I just about GUARANTEE that if/when this becomes an issue you will have places ADVERTISING IN BOLD that they provide X,Y, and Z.........there will be no problems in finding what you want or need.
Not only do I find it more than fair not to force people into doing procedures they find morally wrong............I find it preposterous that you would say "find another job" to a doctor or nurse who did not want to participate in abortions or BC if they felt it was wrong. I am sure they became a doctor or nurse for MANY other reasons besides those, and helping people in a way they find morally right is a good thing.
Honestly, I know of many vets who don't participate in cropping, docking, or putting to sleep an animal they don't agree should be PTS. They don't need to find another job..........it's their right as a professional to refuse those services. The only difference is they are NOT federally funded.
I am all for BC and I am sure sometime (very soon) my daughters will be on it. I am also for letting woman CHOOSE what to do with their body.
I don't see how you can be for the right to choose.............but be against others choosing NOT to participate.
I ran this by my mom, who is a retired RN - and about as conservative as they come (Faux news, Bill O'Reilly, Nancy Grace, the whole muck pit) - and even she was appalled at the idea of this legislation and what it portends.
Of course, she also had to stand by while a frail, 80+ year old man dying with Alzheimer's was being beaten on the chest and shocked to try to resusitate him because the doctor in charge refused to allow the legal DNR order to be honored. All this while the man's wife was sitting out in the hallway having to endure.
It's not just about birth control and abortions - it's about human dignity and the right to determine our own path.
Should the health care worker be able to not participate in procedures they find morally repugnant without repercussion? Sure. But, as my mom pointed out, OB/GYN practices don't just suddenly decide to start performing abortions. You know when you interview for the job just what kind of practice it is. You know, as a pharmacist, that if you take a job with a large chain pharmacy there is a 100% chance that you're going to be dispensing all sorts of birth control. Anyone who takes a job like that knows, and to take the job, THEN say, "oh, I'm morally against that" took the job under false pretenses and they either need to suck it up or find other employment.
This issue is one of the major flaws of having federal funding in private industry.
Of course, she also had to stand by while a frail, 80+ year old man dying with Alzheimer's was being beaten on the chest and shocked to try to resusitate him because the doctor in charge refused to allow the legal DNR order to be honored. All this while the man's wife was sitting out in the hallway having to endure.
It's not just about birth control and abortions - it's about human dignity and the right to determine our own path.
Should the health care worker be able to not participate in procedures they find morally repugnant without repercussion? Sure. But, as my mom pointed out, OB/GYN practices don't just suddenly decide to start performing abortions. You know when you interview for the job just what kind of practice it is. You know, as a pharmacist, that if you take a job with a large chain pharmacy there is a 100% chance that you're going to be dispensing all sorts of birth control. Anyone who takes a job like that knows, and to take the job, THEN say, "oh, I'm morally against that" took the job under false pretenses and they either need to suck it up or find other employment.
This issue is one of the major flaws of having federal funding in private industry.
1. As true for the workers who do not wish to participate.
2. I agree with your mom. Hence I don't think this bush proposal is all that big of a deal. I think it's one more way to say "Hey you........look over there real quick" Anytime the heat is on for other areas of screw up, the current administration (whichever it may be at the time) pulls out the old abortion card (or anything having the slightest affiliation with it) to make everyone look somewhere else and get fired up. And it never fails to work
Does anyone REALLY think abortions will ever be outlawed? I don't. We can't even pay/cover all the children being born NOW, let alone take away BC or ban abortions once more............it's a scare tactic IMO.
3. Could not agree more emphatically.
2. I agree with your mom. Hence I don't think this bush proposal is all that big of a deal. I think it's one more way to say "Hey you........look over there real quick" Anytime the heat is on for other areas of screw up, the current administration (whichever it may be at the time) pulls out the old abortion card (or anything having the slightest affiliation with it) to make everyone look somewhere else and get fired up. And it never fails to work
Does anyone REALLY think abortions will ever be outlawed? I don't. We can't even pay/cover all the children being born NOW, let alone take away BC or ban abortions once more............it's a scare tactic IMO.
3. Could not agree more emphatically.