how would you like to be put in a crate??? please educate me

puppylover2007 · Oct 7, 2007

So, here is the real question. We've all explained why our dogs are inside and crated. What dog do you have that would rather live alone? How much time are you actually going to be there outside with it?[/QUOTE]

i have explained several times why i choose to have an outdoor dog, but *sigh* i will do it again.. here we go...

i was raised on a farm from birth and always had outdoor dogs, we had a very large farm where they lived loved and learned alot about there surroundings, some even had their pups outside, they were every bit of the family as the rest of the farm animals, they got love, attention and most of the freedom to play at will, now, of course if the weather dropped to low they would come in and be able to stay warm, but 90% of the time they were outdoors... i have also stated that i beleive that dogs should be outdoor based on the room they need, ( ie a smaller dog may not need as much as space as a larger breed) i futher stated that based on breed, some could handle cold weather or the "elements" because they have a thicker coat. i also mentioned that outdoors dogs get alot of attention ( please read my post of what my dog gets and has), i never said that crating was wrong, i was makig a statement in the form of a question and wondered why people would do that, my topic heading also says "EDUCATE ME"!! i just think that everyone on here thinks that outdoor dogs are mistreated and not loved. i never said indoor dogs were mistreated, what i said was that they need to be able to have freedom, but alas no one wants to see that.. finally i gave up on even trying to prove outdoor dogs are just as loved as indoor dogs..

did anyone read the post i put up about "dangers for indoor dogs"??? if gave out some real information, some of which i did not even know, yet, it seems that you all ignore that as well... so, i give up, my pup will be an outdoor dog because when he is indoors he is not happy, but, when outdoors, you can see him happy and free spirited, but, i guess you guys will never see that.

Plushie · Oct 7, 2007

So if I put my sister's chihuahua outside in a snowstorm it will survive?

When I was little we lived on a HUGE farm aswell. Our dogs went everywhere with us, the only dog that stayed outside 24/7 was a german shepherd with some behavioural problems - we found him as a very aggresive stray and as long as he had room to roam he'd leave the other dogs alone.

I can garantee you my dogs feel safe in my house. No matter how small or how big it is, they have me around them and that's all they care about. Dogs love humans - if I put Jack outside all day, he'd wait by the door all day long without moving a muscle, expecting me to let him back inside. Then night would go by, and he'd lose trust in me. THATS what makes a dog feel like home isn't safe. The fact they can't trust their loved ones.

Tankstar · Oct 7, 2007

yea there are dangers indoors, offcourse the dangers in dors are alot less when put next tot he dangers out doors, for the outdoors you simply can not make it as safe as indoors (No bear is coming inside, no neighboor is coming inside with antifreeze, no blizzered is coming inside, no posinous snake is coming indoorrs, no rabbid racoon is coming in side)

Simple reason I do not have a out door dog. He would not like to be a out door dog. As son as he is put outside he is back t the door waiting to be in. If I go out int he back yard with him, then he will stay out happily, as soonas I go to go back in doors, he will be right behind me. Plain and simple he wants to be with me. I simply do not belive in out door dogs. There was a time and need for it, but for the most part there is not much need for a ou door dog. offcourse there is always exceptions to the rule. Working dogs for one. Dogs are plain and simple pack animals, they are not solitary creatures.

Whisper · Oct 7, 2007

Actually you said outdoor dogs were far more cherished than our poor inside dogs. Having an inside dog does not mean that they don't get out to get exercise and fresh air, as many posters pointed out already.

Plushie · Oct 7, 2007

I'm going to post this - PuppyLover, I'm not taking sides, and I probably sounded very obnoxious in my last post. I personally am against outdoor dogs, despite the fact I live with big outdoor dogs like my huskies and my mom's rottie. That doesn't mean I'm cruel, it doesn't mean my dogs are getting any less of an life than an outdoor life. Things have changed since you were little, I'm sure - same for me. On my farm, we didn't have to worry about people shooting our dogs thinking they were deer or something, or having our dogs stolen right out of our yards.

Things have changed, and so have people. I'm pretty sure you mad at some people who just bombard you with rude messages, etc. about having your dogs outside. If I could go back in time to when I was 7, I'd have my dogs outside all the time. I'd feel safe. But my dogs now would not feel outside without me. Especially Jack - the poor old guy has been through too much and now he's finally getting real people interaction would kill him to lose it (though I'm certain Jack's case is no where near similar to your dogs). People have different opinions, and that's that.

Punkygirl0101 · Oct 7, 2007

Yes..the DID, DOGS ARE DOMESTICATED NOW. You are referring to WILD animals, dogs are NOT wild animals.

If you actually listened to other people, our dogs get outside run time which mean hiking, dog parks,parks,running WITH humans. Because our dogs spend time indoors they are not loved....(There should be a question mark but my keyboard is broken and it doesn't work.)

Oh yes a dog thrown in a backyard all day with nothing to do is completely loved, much more than inside dogs who have a structured life filled with activities and human companionship. *Rolls eyes*. You obviously don't know much about dogs.

My best friend's brother in law has a huge pit bull. He lives outside..Chained. Gets absolutely no human interaction..Gets fed every now in then. He must me much happier than my dogs.

NOBODY SAID THAT. Our indoor dogs get plenty of outside time. You seem to be thinking nobody's dogs go outside lol. What everyone is trying to say is our dogs are inside at night, when we are not home, and when weather permits it. nobody is saying lock your dog in a room indoors, that is just as bad as locking your dog outside.

coming from someone who locks their dogs outside...
Dogs are not put in crates to save furniture..They are put in crates for their SAFETY.

You don't see any reason because YOUR dog lives outside, therefore you don't have any of the problems our loved indoor dogs have.

Kind of like you being onsided about inside dogs, that DOOOOO go outside equally as much as they are inside.
I find it funny that everyone else here, who are huge dog lovers, disagree with you. My dog loving friends disagree with you as well, as will Vets,dog trainers,dog rescuers..Etc. The only people who do agree with you are people who get large dogs to throw in their backyards for "Protection".

I like how you speak for him..How would you know..Outdoor dogs don't get very much human interaction unless you are outside at 3 o clock in the morning when hes alone, in the cold. My poor abused indoor dogs are in a warm home, STILL with their humans, and pack of dogs.

Our inside dogs are with us almost 24 hours a day..Even when we are sleeping in the "den", where your outdoor dog is alone for the entire night, and longer considering I doubt you spend your time outside with him all day..So our dogs are getting a lot more human contact then I see an outdoor dog getting.

Crating aside, since I have stated my dogs are not crated..Are you STILL against inside dogs (question mark should be there)'

Because I have a dog door, and my dogs can choose..and do you know where they are most of the time..INSIDE! When they do go outside its to bark at squirrels or people passing by the fence, or when I go outside...Other then that my poor neglected inside dogs choose to be inside with me most of the day.

That still continues to not make any sense. Clearly outdoor dogs are alone most of the time. Are you trying to say a dog outside alone gets more attention then a dog that follows its owner around, and is everywhere its owner is. (Again with the q mark).

Thats because YOU are not listening. EVERYONE already stated indoor dogs get a LOT of outdoor time.

Maxy24 · Oct 7, 2007

If your dog honestly wants to live outside I'm OK with it as long as the dog is able to handle the elements, has food water and shelter and has the CHOICE to come inside when he wants. Then you will truly know which he prefers, a dog door will tell you that. People who force the dog to live outside than say the dog loves this life and would never have it any other way, well I just don't believe them. If the dog has the choice between in and out and chooses not to ever come in then I will believe them.

Plushie · Oct 7, 2007

Maxy24 said:

Hmmm... I agree.

Install a dog door in your house. Dogs like human contact. My dogs are with me all the time, and they feel safe. They're on my bed, in my closet, practically everywhere in my house. If I left the back door open all day, maybe my mom's lab would go outside for half an hour to try and bug the squirrel that lives in my backyard, and the other dogs would just relieve themselves and come back in.

If your dog stays outside and doesn't want to be with you, I'll be OK with it.

ihartgonzo · Oct 7, 2007

How would you like to be a puppy... sitting outside alone, for hours upon hours, left to entertain yourself and get into GOD-knows-what, wondering where your family is, in the dark, in the rain, and in the cold? And that is every single day of your life. It sounds pretty sad to me.

I would much rather be a puppy sitting in a nice, comfy crate indoors with a raw meaty bone and a stuffed Kong; completely SAFE from the hazards of the house & the outdoors. I rarely if ever crate my dogs now, but I did when they were young and not yet trustworthy, and they both to this day love sleeping in their crates with the door open. I think to understand the magic of crates, one first has to understand basic canine behavior.

mrose_s · Oct 7, 2007

I personally disagree with this, while a greyhound or a great dane can live happily in an apartment so long as they are given their daily walks, a smaller dog like a border collie, kelpie or even a JRT would not do as well in this environment.

smkie · Oct 7, 2007

well i think my dogs if asked would say this is how it ought to be and with that said, i think we will all go to bed

One bed where Mary will snore and keep my feet warm and vic will be tucked in with his sheet just the way he likes it. Life is too short for anything else.

Saintgirl · Oct 7, 2007

False. According to you my Saint should be an outdoor dog. Your 80lb at maturity dog is TINY compared to my 190lb drooling beast. But right at this moment he is sitting on his own couch, chewing on his raw bone, and had refused the chance to come outside while I had the other two out for a quick romp. Yup, he is big, and he is more than capable of weathering the outdoor elements, but, and any reputable Saint breeder will tell you- they are not outdoor dogs-they need to be with their people. Saints can quickly become destructive and territorial when they are left outside without their people.

What I think you are missing here is that indoor dogs have a little more freedom than strictly outdoor dogs. They have the freedom to be indoors OR outdoors.

I know that I wasn't ignoring it, I already knew all of those dangers. And this is yet another reason that crates make wonderful training tools!

If you want to have an outdoor dog, fine. Maybe alot of us disagree with the idea, but that doesn't make us any less of dog owners because we choose to keep our dogs inside. I think that is the part that had my hackles raised, I am a responsible dog owner who always considers the best options for my dogs and I am not restricting my dogs freedom in anyway!

Beanie · Oct 7, 2007

Can I just ask a completely honest question here?

PuppyLover... why is it that you can cry and complain that we are all being so mean and horrible to you because we disagree with keeping dogs outside...
and yet in the same breath, you keep telling us how awful and cruel it is to crate a dog. You tell us our dogs are unloved. You tell us clearly we don't care enough to train our dogs, that we just shove them into a cage because we don't care enough to put the time and effort into training them to maintain behaviours when we aren't there to enforce it. You tell us that our dogs don't get to go outside except to pee.

Please, PuppyLover. Tell me why you expect us to see "your" side when you yourself refuse to see "our" side.

(edited because I can't spell.)

doberkim · Oct 7, 2007

I just tried to make Rah an outdoor dog. He was outside for 4 minutes when he realized he was alone, and then stood at the door barking for almost 10 straight minutes until I let him in.

I tried it with Tyler. Instead of barking, Tyler scratches at the door.

If I left them out there, I am sure they would eventually stop. But their preferences are clear...

Samantha's pet · Oct 7, 2007

puppylover2007 said:

That is basically what you said.

puppylover2007 said:

Make up your mind.

puppylover2007 said:

You may as well have.

First of all it is rude and just ignorant to say that outdoor dogs are more loved and cherished. Who are you to say how much someone loves and cherishes their dog? You dont know! I dont think I know how much you love your dog based on where you keep him. People can love their dog more than you do and raise them differently than you do. You could say you dont think they are treated as good but you cant say how much someone cares about their dog. You have no idea. We care about our dogs so much we want them to be with us all the time when we are inside and when we are outside. I only go outside for my dog's sake and I come in when she indicates that she is done playing and is too dang hot to stay out any longer.

You said "educate me" but you appeared to be sarcastic. You didnt really want our reasons b/c you shot them all down. I do crate my dog when I am not home. I live in a rent house and I do choose to live here to some degree. When I was looking for a place to live I had a dog in mind. I chose a house rather than an apartment in a decent neighborhood w/ lots of room. I couldn't find a place w/ a fenced yard but even if I had I wouldnt have let her stay out when I was not home. I do not totally trust anyone. Especially the kids around here. Since It is a rent house I couldnt put up a fence if I wanted to. So the back yard isnt an option. As for closing off a room well all the bedrooms are carpeted and she has accidents from time to time. The bathrooms have too many toxic things she could get into. There is no where to put her until she is potty trained and trustworthy. She still chew some things she isnt supposed to. We do train her not to chew certain things but that takes time. Where do I put her in the meantime? She is still a puppy. If I were to have a room to close off then she would use one side to potty on and not ever make an effort to hold it. Then she would never be potty trained and I would always have to keep her in a room closed off and keep a strict eye on her. This way she will eventually be totally potty trained and trustworthy alone and have the complete run of the house when I am gone. Plus she loves her crate. She is a hound mix and according to you she should be outside but that would never happen. It is so hot outside in the summer and right now. She doesnt enjoy being outdoors for very long periods. The winters are too cold and somtimes it snows. Also the other day I went to visit my parents and they have a fenced yard and my dog was playing w/ their dog outside. We went in to visit, leaving the dogs out to play for a little while, and she sat at the door barking for 10 min straight until i let her in so there goes your theory that my dog WANTS to be outside all the time. My dog WANTS to be w/ me all the time. If your puppy is inside w/ you now and you try to restrict him to outdoor only later he may not like that.

I do not think people w/ outdoor dogs are awful and if you give them the proper amount of attention and let them stay inside when weather is bad i dont see anything horrible about it. I just wouldnt do it b/c I do not trust people and it isnt what MY dog WANTS. If yours does great. But you were trying to imply that crating dogs is awful. It isnt terrible either. It is just what must be done for a certain amount of time until the dog can be left alone. Puppies will chew on EVERYTHING for a while I dont care what you train them not to do. They only understand so much at a certain age.

Of course crating your dog isnt ideal. Neither is putting them outside alone. In a perfect world everyplace would be a dog friendly place and we could take them everywhere we go all the time but that isnt going to happen so we must settle for the BEST less than perfect solution to keep the dog safe and everybody happy.

IliamnasQuest · Oct 8, 2007

Nearly 20 years of experience teaching hundreds and hundreds of dogs and their owners has convinced me that, overall, dogs that have the best homes with are the most loved live indoors. There ARE legitimate reasons for keeping a dog outside, but I haven't heard any of them from "puppylover" - all I hear is excuses.

By the way, if a person spends "15 hours" a day outside with their dog, and 8 hours sleeping, that gives them 1 hour indoors. Does anyone really believe that claptrap? It's about as believeable as "outdoor dogs are loved more" (yeah, that's why we see so many outdoor dogs that are starved, dehydrated and frostbit up here) and "outdoor dogs are better trained" (completely false generalization, many if not most people put their dogs out because they don't want to take the time to properly train them to live indoors).

I spent the weekend at a dog show 150 miles away. Luckily my adult dogs are well trained, indoor dogs and were no problem in the motel room. The pup, on the other hand, is not quite four months old. I hauled an ex-pen in and set it up on a blanket, and she spent a good part of her time confined over the weekend. Was it cruel? Well, I could have left her at a boarding kennel where she'd have been scared and confused in a concrete run, surrounded by other barking dogs. Or I could have left her with someone who believed in tossing dogs outside and she could have been scared, alone and cold outdoors somewhere. Or I could have let her run around the motel room, chew on things, pee and poop wherever. Instead I acted like a responsible owner, took the trouble to haul in the pen (a PITA, believe me), walked her frequently, let her play with the other dogs after every walk, and she did great. I was worn out, but she did great .. *L*

I hope no one is taking the nonsense being spouted by the outdoor person seriously. It's obvious she's not seeing the logic of why dogs are happy indoors. Do some dogs like to live outside? Yes, I suppose so. I raised a dog outside some 20+ years ago and he liked being out and was restless indoors. BUT - if I'd raised him indoors where he was an active part of my life, I have no doubt that he would have had a more interesting and enjoyable life. I wouldn't do that again. The companion dogs we have these days are not the wild creatures of the past. Nearly all dogs prefer to be with their people and that means inside. They want to be near you when you're on the computer. They want to be sleeping by (or on .. *L*) your bed. They become more socially adept when they're properly handled as indoor pets. And I don't know ANY outdoor dog that spends as much time with their human as my dogs do with me. I work at home, I take dogs with me when I run errands, etc. Khana and Trick are with me pretty much 24 hours a day. How much better could it get??

Melanie and the gang in Alaska

Bahamutt99 · Oct 8, 2007

I read in the Dog IQ Test book that dogs who live indoors are generally smarter than outdoor dogs. They get to observe the family at length, they learn words that most people aren't even aware they've picked up. They know where the food is kept, where the bathtub is, where the bedroom is, so on and so forth. They are just more well-rounded, mentally, socially, psychologically, than a dog who is kept outside away from the pack much of the time.

I think it'd be interesting to start a poll of everyone here who has a titled dog, and see if their dog learned what they needed to know to get there by being kept outdoors predominantly.

That said, to use my favorite Star Wars quote, "Only a Sith deals in absolutes." There is no absolute right or wrong, only choices that make just a wee bit more sense than others.

ihartgonzo · Oct 8, 2007

I agree with all of the above replies... : D

And, I wanted to add that, if I were to leave my dogs outside 24/7, they would absolutely NOT get the exercise they need to stay happy. Gonzo is a super active dog, but when he's outside, he will sniff around and maybe rassle with Fozzie for 15 minutes... but then he comes to the door and would sit there all day were he an "outside dog".

They are "inside dogs", and spend 80% of their time inside, but I spend 1-2 hours a day just exercising them at an off-leash park. Gonzo would become VERY unhappy left outside to entertain himself all the time... and I'm positive he would resort to destroying things, digging, and becoming an escape artist to entertain himself, because he is very smart.

goldiefur · Oct 8, 2007

I could not imagine sitting inside and watching my babies locked out.

When I was a kid we had German Shepherds and they were outside dogs and it was horrible!

They wanted to come in sooooo bad but my parents said they were to big and they had to be outside dogs. Well now my parents have even changed their tunes and they have all of their BIG dogs living inside 24/7 I can remember the GS having ticks and my mom would have to get them off of them. This was way before Frontline or anything like that was out. Back then when fleas and ticks got bad the poor dogs would have to go get dipped.:yikes: It makes me sick when I think all of those years they could have been inside with us. I can still see them sitting at that glass door wanting to come in.

MoonStr80 · Oct 8, 2007

This is my 2 cent for this topic

I see many of us has told you many times how they feel about dogs being left outdoors etc

Dogs are not wolves they're domestic pet dogs! I'm not about to lecture you about why you should never leave your dog outside

Farmer or not. I think it's irresponsible, meaningless & what not ridiculous to have a outside dogs, the only reason "why" ppl keep their dogs outdoors are one thing to keep intruder off of their property.

Here is Chopper lounging in her crate

This is a dog room that my sister made up for the dogs, it's like their comfort spot where they eat & kept while my sister & brother in law leave for work

Chopper again!

Other half of the room

how would you like to be put in a crate??? please educate me

New Member

Husky Mom

~Lisa~

Kaleidoscopic Eye

Husky Mom

New Member

Active Member

Husky Mom

and Fozzie B!

BusterLove

pointer/labrador/terrier

New Member

Clicker Cult Coordinator

Naturally Natural

New Member

Loves off-leash training!

Dafuq?

and Fozzie B!

New Member

Obessed with Dogs