Disenchanted with Rescue

Whisper · May 15, 2007

I'm so sorry, Herschel. What a sweet, beautiful pup.
I want to go to a rescue, pound or shelter. I know I take care of my dogs very well and they have great lives but I'm afraid of falling in love with a dog and then being let down by a rescue or shelter like so many people have.

I can't think of a reason I would be turned down but I'm sure there is one. maybe because, like Grace, I am a minor and still the primary care giver of the dogs. I've wanted to go to the pound anyway because there they are PTS when the majority of shelters here are no kill.

I'm very glad shelters and rescues are so very careful, I know I would definitely be. I just feel sad seeing so many people offering wonderful homes and getting turned down.

Sweet72947 · May 15, 2007

Our rescue doesn't turn people down for not having a fenced yard. In fact, the main deal-breaker is if someone plans to leave their dogs alone in the yard while they are not home. I think one of the reasons for that is how many dogs know how to escape. An old dog who was being fostered hopped his fence about three months ago and hasn't been found yet. There have been no sightings in about two months.

And minors adopting dogs?? I don't know of ANYWHERE that will adopt a dog to anybody under 18. Even the pound, who only has you sign an agreement that you will take care of the pet or return it to them, and has no other requirements for adoption, won't adopt an animal to anybody under 18. Your parents have to adopt it for you.

On the rescue's premises, nobody under 18 can even WALK a dog due to insurance reasons. Did you know that BY LAW a person under 18 can't be held responsible for the care of a pet? If a 17 yr old neglects an animal, his parents get charged. I'm not sure if that's the law in every state, but its the law here, and in a bunch of other places.

Whisper · May 15, 2007

I don't know if the underage was directed at me. My mom takes care of the dogs, too. When I'm not there she feeds them and spends time with them, pays for their food and vet care. I'm the one who walks, trains,buys things for them, etc. etc. We both take care of them but they are "my" dogs even though legally they are hers. Of course she would be the one really adopting them.

Aussie Red · May 15, 2007

Ok I understand some tension towards rescues I really do but you have to understand this too. When we pick up a dog it usually needs to be vetted right away and then temperament tested etc. Rescue workers have no idea if the person giving up the dog is honest about it. Although rescues get some donations believe me they do not cover the costs. Much of the cost is out of pocket on the part of the rescuer. Now take that and add a dose of compassion for the animal being rescued and that the rescuer spends a great deal of time with said animal they do tend to bond. I personally know that it is impossible to keep all the dogs rescued but love them which makes it a bit hard to say good bye. But that is what you do. Now after you have invested your time, money and feelings to this dog are you going to place it in a home that you are uncertain about ? An ACD would clear a 4 foot fence in a single bound so does that mean you would be a bad owner ? no. What it means is I do not know you and my guidelines are a fence the animal can not jump over.
Would I place an ACD into a home with some one who has little or no knowledge of the breed just because you say you are a good owner ? No. Most of the rescued ACDs have already been with owners who did not know the breed and have been handled badly already and come with issues that only a veteran owner may be better qualified in handling and making a better life for the dog as well as a better dog.
You must understand how many bad owners up to no good come to get a rottie or pit and try their best to pass these guidelines as well.Always remember this we don't know you. If you are sincere maybe help the rescue and get to know them and they you then they would not blink an eye as to you being a good owner. It is a tough business and there is a lot of pain involved with it. Rescues are not perfect but thank God they are out there. Pounds give a set amount of time for the animal to be adopted and it is put down rescues deplete their funds hanging on until the ideal home is found.

Whisper · May 15, 2007

That's a great post, Aussie. It makes a lot of sense and offers a lot on insight.
I am definitely going to be involved with rescue and I'm going to start volunteering at the shelter now that I am old enough.

RD · May 15, 2007

Yeah, Sweet, I know that. My parents always applied to adopt dogs, but I filled out the rest of the applications. *shrug*

I know all too well how difficult rescue is, I never disputed that. I just wish that people would find the time to get to know the people with imperfect applications too, because they might be a great home for the dog in question. Limited time on the part of the rescuer is understandable. I just get frustrated when I see rescue people getting angry at those who buy from breeders rather than rescue, and telling them just how many dogs they have rescued and how many unwanted dogs of _____ breed are out there. The guilt-tripping really pisses me off. The people being preached at might have actually wanted to rescue at some point, but it can be impossibly tough if nobody (including the person doing the preaching) will give them a chance.

I've never found a shelter that was super picky about who the dogs went to. They do background checks to make sure there have been no reports of animal neglect or abuse, and that's that. I'm sure some dogs go to less than satisfactory homes but at least most are loved, even if they don't ever have a yard to run in.

bubbatd · May 15, 2007

I can see both sides .... having been on both sides . But I do agree that some"issues " go too far . Being in Golden rescue , I consider the dog's best interest is having someone at home all the time . Yet , some go to a working family because of a fenced in yard .

Herschel · May 15, 2007

Aussie Red said:

Ok I understand some tension towards rescues I really do but you have to understand this too. When we pick up a dog it usually needs to be vetted right away and then temperament tested etc. Rescue workers have no idea if the person giving up the dog is honest about it. Although rescues get some donations believe me they do not cover the costs. Much of the cost is out of pocket on the part of the rescuer. Now take that and add a dose of compassion for the animal being rescued and that the rescuer spends a great deal of time with said animal they do tend to bond. I personally know that it is impossible to keep all the dogs rescued but love them which makes it a bit hard to say good bye. But that is what you do. Now after you have invested your time, money and feelings to this dog are you going to place it in a home that you are uncertain about ? An ACD would clear a 4 foot fence in a single bound so does that mean you would be a bad owner ? no. What it means is I do not know you and my guidelines are a fence the animal can not jump over.
Would I place an ACD into a home with some one who has little or no knowledge of the breed just because you say you are a good owner ? No. Most of the rescued ACDs have already been with owners who did not know the breed and have been handled badly already and come with issues that only a veteran owner may be better qualified in handling and making a better life for the dog as well as a better dog.
You must understand how many bad owners up to no good come to get a rottie or pit and try their best to pass these guidelines as well.Always remember this we don't know you. If you are sincere maybe help the rescue and get to know them and they you then they would not blink an eye as to you being a good owner. It is a tough business and there is a lot of pain involved with it. Rescues are not perfect but thank God they are out there. Pounds give a set amount of time for the animal to be adopted and it is put down rescues deplete their funds hanging on until the ideal home is found.

I understand that people should be properly screened and they need to have a working knowledge of the breed of interest.

However, I am already approved by two major Border Collie rescues. Their applications aren't a joke. The MWBCRs application took me over an hour and it even requires a $10 processing fee.

http://www.mwbcr.org/adoptapp.htm

If the MWBCR and the MidAmerica Border Collie Rescue see me as fit for adoption, then what difference does a fenced yard make?

squirtsmom · May 15, 2007

I tried to adopt a beautiful pit bull from a shelter, and because i didn't have a fenced in yard, didn't get the dog. We have a 10x10 pen next to the house they go in for short periods, and that didn't even count.

Herschel · May 15, 2007

squirtsmom said:

Did they euthanize the dog instead of adopting it to you? I'm sure a lot of bully breeds meet that fate.

jess2416 · May 15, 2007

I was approved and then got called back the next day (after I spend a whole day visiting with the dog and the foster mom, and making plans for me to come and get him) and was told that I couldn't adopt him....that was at least a year ago....and he is STILL in foster care...
http://search.petfinder.com/petnote/displaypet.cgi?petid=4676567

Aussie Red · May 15, 2007

Herschel said:

What bothers me about that is that it is the standard shelter app' It said nothing about doing a home visit. This is where most rescues would make a difference. We do home visits and follow ups so this is more of a shelter type adoption agreement you filled out. They unfortunately adopt to anyone and sadly many of these dogs do come back and in worse shape then when they left. Each time one is returned it puts it closer to the PTS list as unadoptable.
I am sure that you can see why we take a bit more caution in just where these guys are placed.
Let me say this 5 months ago Leid animal shelter here in Las Vegas put down well over 1200 animals due to the fact that they got an infestation of Parvo, Distemper and Feline Lukemia and decided they were not going to spend the monies to treat the animals just put them down. Ok fair enough what the heck the shelter will be full again in two weeks so no big deal. Well that number would have been much higher had it not been for the people who really do care. You could have added over 400 more dogs to that death toll. People who rescue came in and took every dog they could who was not severely ill at that time and got them to vets many out of their own wallets and on treatments. They are fed premium dog foods which are never donated either. Some dogs going to rescues come from all over the country to reach the rescue. Are you willing to pay the cost of transport ? I am involved with several nationwide rescue network and trust me if I pick up a dog and have to transport the dog two hundred miles I eat the cost of doing so. Am I so wrong to demand that said dog be in a fenced yard to insure that he not get loose and have to go to a shelter or be hit by a car ? You are going to pay $200.00 for a dog who may have well cost the ones who rescued that dog into the thousands. I wish everyone would spend just a few months as a rescue worker not shelter worker and see how many man hours go into getting these guys and how high the cost but more importantly the love that goes into it is truly over whelming.
Do you have any idea the numbers of dogs pulled daily from shelters to become bait for a fight dog ? Any idea how many are a moment of sympathy pull only to get a home where they become a pain in the Arse and are further abused ? Any idea how many are returned to the shelters because the owners let them wander off again ? How many go to homes where they live with bad teeth, heart desiese, Lyme desiese. Heartworms and the like and are said to be loved yet live a life of pain ? No not all people who go to shelters to get a dog know how to care for it because after all it is only a dog. So please excuse us who take the time from our daily lives to set up transport of a dog in need and get it to the right place for help and then spend more of our time getting it to the vet and paying for it's bills and feeding it and training it and loving it and then being selective as to where it goes. There are some rescues out there that I personally do not recommend but overall I have nothing but admiration for anyone who is willing to go that extra mile for a dog. It is what I do and I have sure put a lot of my time and money to saving them and will continue to do so. I hope this is not coming off as rude because it is not meant to be by any means. I just want people who don't know how much goes into a rescue to be aware of it. Tessa knows for sure how we can get a transport arranged and the new owner is not out a dime for that just the ones who transport are. Senior knows because she is out the costs of vetting and keeping them. Please do not judge rescues to harshly before taking a walk in our daily world and see what we do and what we go through. This is by the way one of the dogs doomed to die at the Lied Animal Shelter mass put down.

Am I sorry that a home other then mine was unsuitable ? No. She has many issues that would have made adoption to just anyone wrong. She has some major health issues and some behavior issues but overall is a great little baby that deserved better then a needle or a owner who was not going to step up to the plate. I have countless hours invested into her and she is turning around into the sweet girl I knew she would be. Please give rescues a bit of a break Herschel. They need people to try to understand their mission not bash it. Go help out and you will see what I am saying.

RD · May 15, 2007

Joyce, I've never started a rescue so I don't know what goes into it, but I have volunteered and I know it's a lot of work. It's a lot of work no matter what... I admire what rescuers do, but the dogs still need to be adopted, no matter how much money has gone into them. They still need homes. Cases like that sweet boy Jess was trying to adopt just make me so sad because that dog could've had a good, loving home for a YEAR -- but didn't, because people were too stubborn to consider it. So what if it isn't perfect? People aren't perfect, and dogs aren't perfect. Granted, some dogs have issues that would require them to have a fenced yard, or a home with no kids or other pets, but come on, this pup in Herschel's case could have adapted beautifully to living without a yard. Why don't people take that into consideration? Does the rescue even stop to think that when you turn a Border collie loose in a backyard, it isn't doing anything differently than it would do in the house? What a Border Collie needs is interaction with people, not a fence around a piece of land. A backyard doesn't equal more attention or stimulation, it's just an outdoor spot where the dog can be turned out and ignored.

In the case of someone who can't adopt from rescue due to things like having no yard, would you recommend that they just give up on rescue and buy from a breeder? Seems kind of backwards to me.

Melissa_W · May 15, 2007

RD said:

Joyce, I've never started a rescue so I don't know what goes into it, but I have volunteered and I know it's a lot of work. It's a lot of work no matter what... I admire what rescuers do, but the dogs still need to be adopted, no matter how much money has gone into them. They still need homes. Cases like that sweet boy Jess was trying to adopt just make me so sad because that dog could've had a good, loving home for a YEAR -- but didn't, because people were too stubborn to consider it. So what if it isn't perfect? People aren't perfect, and dogs aren't perfect. Granted, some dogs have issues that would require them to have a fenced yard, or a home with no kids or other pets, but come on, this pup in Herschel's case could have adapted beautifully to living without a yard. Why don't people take that into consideration? Does the rescue even stop to think that when you turn a Border collie loose in a backyard, it isn't doing anything differently than it would do in the house? What a Border Collie needs is interaction with people, not a fence around a piece of land. A backyard doesn't equal more attention or stimulation, it's just an outdoor spot where the dog can be turned out and ignored.

In the case of someone who can't adopt from rescue due to things like having no yard, would you recommend that they just give up on rescue and buy from a breeder? Seems kind of backwards to me.

:hail: :hail:

And I am so sorry about Charlie, Jess. That is such a shame.

bubbatd · May 15, 2007

When I adopted Ollie from HS through Petfinder , all I took with me was the adoption sheet filled out . I got him that night ! Maybe my answer to where will your dog sleep did the trick ! With me , of course !

Herschel · May 15, 2007

Aussie Red said:

This is exactly the stuff that I'm talking about. You started out by bashing the MWBCR without knowing anything about them, and then you talked your organization up.

Did you even read this? You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about but you are sure they will "adopt out to anyone." This comes no where near a shelter type adoption agreement. Which shelters require group reviews, 3 reference interviews, and a home visit?

MWBCR said:

It took me about a month to get approved by them and I didn't even get the dog that I wanted. That was last October. Its still a sore spot. I spent hours writing, talking on the phone, and reading--but according to you, anyone could get approved.

I am involved in rescue. I'm supposedly receiving my first foster dog this weekend, but as always, I have a feeling it isn't going to happen. These things have an odd tendency of falling apart at the last minute. A woman around here that has been heavily involved in rescue for 20 years warned me that it is just part of the process and it happens all too often.

You're basically saying that those of us that didn't get dogs from rescues, those of us that are responsible, caring dog owners, weren't worthy. That hurts. That is the reason that I'm so disenchanted with rescues.

Its fine to weed out people that don't deserve dogs, but are you sure you aren't taking things a bit too far? Of course you don't think so.

Jynx · May 15, 2007

I can also see both sides of the fence having been there.

The "mission" of rescue is to place a dog in the best suitable home for the rest of that dogs life.

The rescues I've been involved with, one requires a fenced yard, but if it's a "senior" dog the fenced yard requirement is waived, (dog must be on a leash at all times outside), which doesn't make much sense to me. I would "think" a senior dog would be safer in a fenced yard but I don't make the "rules"

The other works on a case by case basis, but "prefers" a fenced yard. It won't put you higher on the adoption list IF you have a fenced yard, it's just preferred.

I do think alot of really good homes are overlooked because they lack a fenced yard which is really unfortunate.

I also think alot of "adopters" expect immediate results from rescues. They don't understand the majority of it is volunteer, which takes it more time than one's own family life usually, and these volunteers do have a life other than rescue.

There are many many rescues that are highly dedicated (ARPH to name one)
but it can be frustrating for those really good homes to fall thru the bureaucratic crack so to speak.

Ok just some ramblings
diane

Psyfalcon · May 15, 2007

While I agree that Rescues do need to take care with who they adopt to, by the time its easier to go find a good breeder, in another state perhaps, rather than rescue a local dog, something may have gone wrong in the process.

There are a couple rescues here that list all dogs on petfinder as no small children. A few are very against adopting to a home with any child under 12!

Fences. We have a rather large fenced yard, but Buster could very well get more exercise and stimulation out on walks. He probably would, except I have not had him out too much, as he has been having foot and dog issues.

While it would be unreasonable for most people to walk, rollerblade or bike their cattle dog or BC 3-5 miles daily, or more, some people are willing to do so. They should be allowed to, rather than be turned down for no fenced yards. We also have fenced dog parks and a few fields that allow dogs.

When I got Buster, the rescue refused to talk to me since I lived at home. While I fully understand talking to my parents, but I was treated like I was 5 (I'm 22), basically. For all followups, they went to my mom, who then went to me, back and forth. Even then my mom had to spend hours on the phone with the rescue before we got him. It would have been a lot easier to to get a byb GSD or lab.. which there are plenty of!

jess2416 · May 15, 2007

Herschel said:

I agree ^^ (shocking I know

right Herschel

)I felt, and still on some days feel that way...and it does hurt....

I couldnt tell you how many nights I cried over that....

and the only thing that, the rescues that are being that way is going to accomplish, is having people start lying on their applications....

I know I will probably NEVER try to get a dog from a rescue, spca, or whatever again....my next dog will either be from a breeder or the local animal control...I would rather save a dog from dying ,one that only has 3 days to live, than one that is able to be in foster care all its life, anyway...

Herschel · May 15, 2007

If Jess and I agree on something that means we're definitely on to something.

I've already talked to a few reputable Border Collie breeders and they've been so much easier to deal with than rescues.

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