Cropping and docking illegal in New York
- Thread starter YodelDogs
- Start date
And I oppose cutting out a dog's reproductive system to make it easier and more appealing to pet owners..
But I don't run around having a freak out that it shouldn't be done. I agree it's personal choice. Yet all of the anti- crop dock people can't seem to take the same stand point and mind their own business.
But I don't run around having a freak out that it shouldn't be done. I agree it's personal choice. Yet all of the anti- crop dock people can't seem to take the same stand point and mind their own business.
This is as ridiculous an argument as the "slippery slope" is, in my opinion. There is ALWAYS a bigger issue. We shouldn't worry about cropping/docking because there are kicking their dogs. We shouldn't worry about people kicking their dogs because there are puppy mills. We shouldn't worry about puppy mills because there are people fighting wars. We shouldn't worry about the wars because there are children working in sweatshops. But that's not important either, because other children are being forced into prostitution.
And so on, and so forth.
To someone passionate about it, cropping/docking is a totally valid cause to campaign for/against.
That said, I find it cruel and completely unnecessary, and if I ever had a chance to vote on it, I would outlaw it.
And so on, and so forth.
To someone passionate about it, cropping/docking is a totally valid cause to campaign for/against.
That said, I find it cruel and completely unnecessary, and if I ever had a chance to vote on it, I would outlaw it.
I find it beautiful and a very minor surgery, when done by someone who knows what they're doing. My real-life experiences with the procedure have molded my opinion on it.
I do wonder how many people who vehemently oppose it have seen a truly talented cropping vet crop a litter of puppies, and have witnessed the recovery. I'd venture to say few to none.
This conversation is really pointless - it won't convince either side.
I do wonder how many people who vehemently oppose it have seen a truly talented cropping vet crop a litter of puppies, and have witnessed the recovery. I'd venture to say few to none.
This conversation is really pointless - it won't convince either side.
I would love to hear those that are against it who have been around for it to be done. Those who are against it have you seen it done? Have you been around pups who have just had it done? Or are you just listening to those who want it banned?
I don't have an opinion on cropping really. I haven't been around. Its done under anaesthesia so I don't think its likely painful. I have been around for docking and I can say for certain that docked JRTs don't have any long term issues with being docked. I have been around injured puppies... I know how hurting puppies act. They don't act in pain after its done. I have had animals with amputations.. I see the pain and issues from that.. I have never seen a docked dog act that way. Microchipping seems to distress the pups more than docking!! I don't see people screaming that we shouldn't microchip!
JRTs are some of the most agile dogs out there. I can tell you it does not affect balance! Tailed JRTs are not more co ordinated or balanced that docked JRTs. (conformation has a much larger impact than amount of tail) Tailed JRTs are not any better at dog-dog communication than tailed JRTs.
I have to say that all the 'issues' docked dogs are supposed to have is pretty laughable.. just like most things put out by ARistas. Its just sad that people buy into it because it 'sounds logical' even though there isn't any truth to it.
And I have stated before.. at 3 days I can't tell you what pups might grow up to hunt, so you want to risk working dogs because ARistas have brainwashed you that its "BAD"?
I don't have an opinion on cropping really. I haven't been around. Its done under anaesthesia so I don't think its likely painful. I have been around for docking and I can say for certain that docked JRTs don't have any long term issues with being docked. I have been around injured puppies... I know how hurting puppies act. They don't act in pain after its done. I have had animals with amputations.. I see the pain and issues from that.. I have never seen a docked dog act that way. Microchipping seems to distress the pups more than docking!! I don't see people screaming that we shouldn't microchip!
JRTs are some of the most agile dogs out there. I can tell you it does not affect balance! Tailed JRTs are not more co ordinated or balanced that docked JRTs. (conformation has a much larger impact than amount of tail) Tailed JRTs are not any better at dog-dog communication than tailed JRTs.
I have to say that all the 'issues' docked dogs are supposed to have is pretty laughable.. just like most things put out by ARistas. Its just sad that people buy into it because it 'sounds logical' even though there isn't any truth to it.
And I have stated before.. at 3 days I can't tell you what pups might grow up to hunt, so you want to risk working dogs because ARistas have brainwashed you that its "BAD"?
News - Front Page: Dog breeders bark at tail-docking ban
Here is an article from out local news. I am pretty furious about this because I WILL ensure my GSP is half docked, as per standard. I do not need torn tail ends when I am hunting in dense scrub!
Here is an article from out local news. I am pretty furious about this because I WILL ensure my GSP is half docked, as per standard. I do not need torn tail ends when I am hunting in dense scrub!
If your hunting in dense scrub be prepared for alot more then a torn tail.
Besides i have had a pointer or pointer mix for the last 20 years that I have run in brush, heavy brush once a week or so. NEver have we had a tail injury. Thorns, scratchs, cut pads, scraps, but the tail has remained unscathed. THe tail on a german shorthair pointer is silly, wimpy, and i believe that is why they cut it off. IT's just not elegant. THe only tail injuries i have seen were obtained by wagging hard in a chain link run.
Besides i have had a pointer or pointer mix for the last 20 years that I have run in brush, heavy brush once a week or so. NEver have we had a tail injury. Thorns, scratchs, cut pads, scraps, but the tail has remained unscathed. THe tail on a german shorthair pointer is silly, wimpy, and i believe that is why they cut it off. IT's just not elegant. THe only tail injuries i have seen were obtained by wagging hard in a chain link run.
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Some participants in this discussion have painted everyone who is against docking/cropping as if they are ignorant and misinformed, or an Animal Rights Crazy.
The fact is, if you care about the health and well being of your dog more than the way they look. you will not dock/crop.
This is fact. This is not my uninformed opinion.
This is the opinion of the American Veteranary Medical Association.
The AVMA is not a weird Animal Rights Group.
The AVMA is the single organization that certifies ALL veteranary schools in the United States.
If your vet does cropping, that is their right, but they are acting against AVMA standards.
The AVMA does not take positions on procedures that are not backed by solid scientific evidence. (for example, they have not taken any stand against force feeding ducks to make foir gras because their is not enough scientific evidence that it does significant harm or causes pain).
You can read about their position on the risks of cropping/docking on their site here:
AVMA opposes cosmetic ear cropping, tail docking of dogs - December 15, 2008
I am sure their are many things worst done to animals and people than docking/cropping.
The fact that cosmetic cropping has more risks than benefits does not mean their should be a law against it.
It also does also not mean that it is the right thing to do.
The fact is, if you care about the health and well being of your dog more than the way they look. you will not dock/crop.
This is fact. This is not my uninformed opinion.
This is the opinion of the American Veteranary Medical Association.
The AVMA is not a weird Animal Rights Group.
The AVMA is the single organization that certifies ALL veteranary schools in the United States.
If your vet does cropping, that is their right, but they are acting against AVMA standards.
The AVMA does not take positions on procedures that are not backed by solid scientific evidence. (for example, they have not taken any stand against force feeding ducks to make foir gras because their is not enough scientific evidence that it does significant harm or causes pain).
You can read about their position on the risks of cropping/docking on their site here:
AVMA opposes cosmetic ear cropping, tail docking of dogs - December 15, 2008
I am sure their are many things worst done to animals and people than docking/cropping.
The fact that cosmetic cropping has more risks than benefits does not mean their should be a law against it.
It also does also not mean that it is the right thing to do.
R
It is also a fact that sexual neutering of dogs has a much greater detrimental effect to overall health and longevity than any minor alteration surgery such as docking or cropping. I still say if they want to outlaw surgical alteration of dogs, it should therefore include ALL surgical alterations, ESPECIALLY those with life long health and behavior effect such as surgical gonadectomy.
When last were you in South Africa? Reason I ask, is that this ain't no sissy scrub. This is a hard land, much harder then a chainlink fence let me tell you that. If a GSP is left with a long tail and works in this scrub, it is loosing its tail. Have you ever heard of Acacia Thorns?
Acacia karroo (Sweet thorn)
Tell me that won't rip a tail? I have hunted with these dogs, and yes, they come back bloody, ripped up, but those heal far better then a tail wound that is notoriously difficult to repair.
Acacia karroo (Sweet thorn)
Tell me that won't rip a tail? I have hunted with these dogs, and yes, they come back bloody, ripped up, but those heal far better then a tail wound that is notoriously difficult to repair.
We have thorns that are inches long and grow in clusters all down the trunk. If it is that bad your dog is going to impale his chest, legs, and most of all underbelly first before you get to the tail. NOt sure i would take a dog out into scrub as bad as you describe. Especially when they run without reason which is what pointers do. You will need a shield for the chest especially. VIctor has come in looking like someone went after him with a wire brush from stem to stern. I am forever picking raspberry thorns out of his head and sides but i dont' think i have ever removed one from his tail. IF yours is worse then ours, then i just wouldn't do it. Your dog might lose an eye.