Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by avaloncoolies, Jan 4, 2013.
I think the colors may be throwing us off because most (all?) of the C/Koolies on Chaz are merle.
No, there's been a red on here, too, and it's very distinct. Kelpies are here, too, and they look very different from the K/Coolies. These dogs have completely different structure, though, so it's odd.
Well you have to remember that all the koolies on here sre from the same breeder except Rue if my memory serves me right. So their structure is going to look pretty similar.
The red coolie on here if from my breeding ...the red boy is Tamlyn and he is from my girl Mindi (red tri in pic with puppy above) and my boy Gunnah...
Australia is a LARGE country, VERY large country, with alot of variety as to terrain, weather patterns, elevations etc....coastlines, mountains, deserts, the bush all make for different needs...longer coats, shorter coats, higher endurance, more "backing" ability etc...being bred best worker to best worker for the job at hand has lead to many different looks, some taller, some smaller, pricked ears, floppy ears....heavier dogs, lighter on their feet dogs...so much variety...i love that about them...so much choice to fall in love with.
Their variety keeps them healthy, interesting, fun to look at....coolies are like a box of chocolates, you never know what your gonna get...lol...and yes very good question...why would we want them all to look the same...
My coolies come from 2 different kennels in Aus., they are active in not breeding merle to merle so solid coolies are "normal"...I think people on Chaz are simply not used to seeing solid coolies, and I personally do not find them to look anything like a BC...not at all...not in looks, not in personality and certainly not in working style. Pics make that hard to experience though...please if anyone doubt my coolies are coolies, kennel name is Coolibah and Borahview they can be found...with some looking (not as out there as some)
Fair enough. But if it is a breed, and not a herding mix type, then you think you'd see some about of consistency. Sort of like Sibes vs Alaskans, I guess. Even though C/Koolies are supposed to honestly be a breed, so that shouldn't be an issue.
So, yeah. It's confusing. Hopefully the more we learn, the more we'll understand.
Australia is a continent, not a country, which explains the variety
I really like the look of the solid colours...
There is a continent Australia AND a country Australia. (ETA: Although I've seen some people say the continent is more correctly called Australasia.)
A country that happens to span a continent YES!!! LOL
And really it was not soooo looong ago that they were just that...herding mix type...only 120 years ago these guys were a combination of different breeds with some dingo thrown in there (working bitch in heat outside in the outback...here come a dingo...voila)...
Think about the 1000 years history herding breeds have in England or Europe in general and then Aus. history doesnt even start until mid 1800Ã¨s really, anything before that was prison records from The Queen...these guys have been bred pure for a long time now so they are their own breed...people have travelled long and far to safeguard this breed over the last 60 years
Aren't they North Australia/South Australia?
My friend in Australia may just be insane. Cause I did ask before posting. :rofl1:
Pretty sure it's just Australia.
Now as for working style...they are laid back, perfect for ranching or in cutblocks, very much like collies, smooth or rough for that matter...kelpies like to drop the head, and i have a few coolies that do but most are straight up workers...eyes out is never a problem for them, therefor working stock without too much predotory feel, makes for smoother moving...I have dogs that love ranch work but not so much trial work, and then i have dogs that work great for both but do better for ranch work because getting the job done fast is not necesarily a priority for them. I like that for ranch work, who wants to be stressed and pressured when doing morning or evening chores...not me...lol
So for trial work i train dogs with more eye and crawl for more speed.
The ease in training i think is what sets them apart from other breeds, they do not lock on so are more influenceable during the training moments, they are more laid back so are not looking to rush sheep past, thru or over you lol...and they are independent so do amazing with more europeing style herding, perimeter work more less, like the old fashion GSD...they will work a ditch line for grazing without fences with little to no direction at all
They look different from the Toolalla lined dogs here and they look different from Rue as well, but I don't really think Avalon's dogs look like Border Collies. And they definitely do not act like Border Collies. So while some people might think they look similar, that's where the resemblance stops. They did remind my mom and I a little bit of ACDs in looks here and there depending on the angle/what they were doing, but again, they didn't act like an ACD. Well, I shouldn't say 'they'. Mainly just her girl reminded us of one. Movement wise they were much more upright (kind of pranced actually) though, loose eyed and while seriously focused on the game they were playing, they also came across rather goofy and just all around fun-loving. And suuuuper cuddly and friendly with people they just met. Based on how C/Koolies were described to me by a bunch of different people with dogs from all different lines before I met two, they pretty well behaved/acted as I expected and certainly came across as all Coolie to me.
C/Koolies vary a ton in looks, as was said, but that doesn't make them any less C/Koolie. When I was looking I came across some that reminded me of huge Cattledogs and honestly are not aesthetically pleasing dogs at all to me (they were very blocky/stocky and like 50lbs+), some that were small and stockier with a short but thick double coat (like Avalon's), some that were finer boned and short coated (not smooth, but lacking a thick undercoat) and smaller (like the Toolalla dogs on Chaz and Rue), some that had flopped/rose ears, some with prick ears, long haired ones, slightly different head shapes etc. Different lines have different looks to them, seemingly based on their region and also the breeder's preferences. But along with such variety, I could still tell that the vast majority were undoubtedly C/Koolies, and even with the variety, many breeders do have similar looking dogs, whether lines are shared or not.
Uh, no, LOL. South Australia is a territory, but there's... five territories? Six? And another is Northern Territory but not "North Australia." Queensland. ffffff that's all I can remember.
Well I know there's at least a South Australia. Because I accidentally wrote the "South" when sending the person a card, and the card got sent back to me.
yah, I just checked. I just assumed it was North... cause there's South and Western, but apparently it's not.
Do we really need to hash out geography here? lol
But that's a territory or a state, not a country. That's like saying it's insert-fifty-states-here instead of United States.
To be fair, I have an AKC recognized breed that varies a great deal in looks. I get a bit tired of people coming up to me at shows and saying "The people involved in this breed need to look at their standard, there's no way these dogs could all be correct. None of them look the same at all!". Breeds don't have to be identical cookie cutters to be a breed. With working bred dogs, you'll find personal preferences can factor in even more. This breeder likes small, slick coated dogs for where they live but that one likes more substantial, thick coated dogs for their purposes. It isn't terribly hard to select for different coats or builds within a population.
Toolalla lines do not "make up the breed"...they are stunning dogs absolutly, but there are many other coolie breeders out there...and they all have stunning dogs...that yes do all have different looks, personality and skills. There is something there for everyone. I am thrilled to offer a "different side" of coolies for everyone to get to know
Would you mind elaborating on that? I like BCs a lot but have some sticking points with them. Koolies in a lot of ways seem to 'fix' some of the sticking points but I am always looking for more input.
Heck I get that even in papillons, which I do think are pretty standardized. I've gotten many questions online and off wondering why my dogs all look so different and which is 'right'. They really all are. Variety is not a bad thing. BCs vary just as much if not more than koolies looks wise. Aussies also vary a ton in looks.
You can find a BC that looks like an Aussie. An Aussie that looks like a BC. An English shepherd that looks like an Aussie or a BC. Or a Welsh sheepdog that looks like a BC. Or a koolie that looks like a BC.
There's some overlap looks-wise in many of these breeds and varying types.