Cockapoo's
- Thread starter aivzdog
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I wasn't trying to start an arguement, I was trying to prevent one. Your original post made it sound like it was the dog being mixed that "made you want to puke". Sorry if I misunderstood but you might have been a little clearer on what you meant.
And of course you can state your opinion but the thread was about what people thought about cockapoos, not what they think about breeding dog mixes. By the way, people have been breeding "cockapoos" for a very long time now so it's kind of hard NOT to call them what they've been called for years. And yes, I know it isn't a breed.
Pam
And of course you can state your opinion but the thread was about what people thought about cockapoos, not what they think about breeding dog mixes. By the way, people have been breeding "cockapoos" for a very long time now so it's kind of hard NOT to call them what they've been called for years. And yes, I know it isn't a breed.
Pam
When you ask what people think about Cocker Spaniel x Poodle crosses or any other of the currently trendy Poodle mixes, it goes without say that opinions and thoughts on the breeding of them is going to come up.
Name wise I can't bring myself to even type in these "designer mutt" names, having a few byb and pm'ers calling a mix some cutesy name does not make a breed name...
These same designer mixes that people are flocking to buy because they are "new, rare, trendy, ect...breeds" are the same mixes that have been filling shelters, rescues, pounds, and humane societies for years...they are the same dogs that the same exact people wanting a "designer mix" will roll their eyes at when you suggest getting one from rescue will roll their eyes at and say "But that's a mutt..I want a purebred"...It's almost like tell someone there is the exact cross they want awaiting a home at a shelter and they don't want it because its a mix breed...but take that same exact mix, strap a cutesy name on it along with a hefty price tag and the same individual that sneered and turned their nose up at it before will run to purchase it because they think they are getting something "rare or new".
Most of us here know cutesy name or not these designer mixes are just that...designer mixes but for John Q potential dog owner out there giving a breed a name...legitimate or not...makes them feel like a particular mix is now a breed...
First let's discuss the big "selling point" in the Poodle mixes..."Poodles don't shed so these mixes are great for people with allergies"...entirely untrue...Poodles do shed (perhaps not as much as some breeds but they shed nontheless) and even if they did not shed there is no guarantee that cross breeding them would make it so their offspring did not shed...On to the allergies..it is not dog fur that agitates allergies so the so called "no shed" factor really holds no bearings..Poodles are thought to be "hypo-allergenic" but they can still bother sensitive individuals...It is not uncommon to see Poodles that have been given up due to allergies.
Temperament is another...Breeders of these designer mixes will say that you get the temperament of X breed...even in the most careful breeding temperament can not always be 100% guaranteed...Genetics are a gamble and they become even more of a gamble when you take dogs with unknown history and breed them...The breeders of these mixes are not using excellent representatives of these breeds to cross, they are using whatever intact dogs they can purchase and come across...Reputable breeders do not sell to individuals that plan on cross breeding, so where do the dogs the breeders of mixes come from? Most of them come from Backyard Breeders...temperament is already compromised.
Health...Another selling point in these designer mixes is because they are mixed they are healthier and not prone to as many genetic diseases as purebreds are...I have yet to see any hardcore evidence behind this however I do know that Dr George Padgett (a leading authority on canine genetics) has the opinion that mixed breeds are prone to more genetic ailments...now when it comes to health whose opinion can be trusted?...Designer mutt breeders who base their breeding on flawed logic and probably know no more of canine genetics than a typical pet owner or are you going to trust someone that is highly respected in the field?
It's not the mixes itself that are disliked or frowned upon..it's the breeders of them and the intentional breeding of mixes that those of us seriously involved in the canine fancy frown upon...There are enough problems maintaining responsibilility for the breeds that are already recognized until this is no longer a problem the world does not need any "new breeds" to worry about.
Name wise I can't bring myself to even type in these "designer mutt" names, having a few byb and pm'ers calling a mix some cutesy name does not make a breed name...
These same designer mixes that people are flocking to buy because they are "new, rare, trendy, ect...breeds" are the same mixes that have been filling shelters, rescues, pounds, and humane societies for years...they are the same dogs that the same exact people wanting a "designer mix" will roll their eyes at when you suggest getting one from rescue will roll their eyes at and say "But that's a mutt..I want a purebred"...It's almost like tell someone there is the exact cross they want awaiting a home at a shelter and they don't want it because its a mix breed...but take that same exact mix, strap a cutesy name on it along with a hefty price tag and the same individual that sneered and turned their nose up at it before will run to purchase it because they think they are getting something "rare or new".
Most of us here know cutesy name or not these designer mixes are just that...designer mixes but for John Q potential dog owner out there giving a breed a name...legitimate or not...makes them feel like a particular mix is now a breed...
First let's discuss the big "selling point" in the Poodle mixes..."Poodles don't shed so these mixes are great for people with allergies"...entirely untrue...Poodles do shed (perhaps not as much as some breeds but they shed nontheless) and even if they did not shed there is no guarantee that cross breeding them would make it so their offspring did not shed...On to the allergies..it is not dog fur that agitates allergies so the so called "no shed" factor really holds no bearings..Poodles are thought to be "hypo-allergenic" but they can still bother sensitive individuals...It is not uncommon to see Poodles that have been given up due to allergies.
Temperament is another...Breeders of these designer mixes will say that you get the temperament of X breed...even in the most careful breeding temperament can not always be 100% guaranteed...Genetics are a gamble and they become even more of a gamble when you take dogs with unknown history and breed them...The breeders of these mixes are not using excellent representatives of these breeds to cross, they are using whatever intact dogs they can purchase and come across...Reputable breeders do not sell to individuals that plan on cross breeding, so where do the dogs the breeders of mixes come from? Most of them come from Backyard Breeders...temperament is already compromised.
Health...Another selling point in these designer mixes is because they are mixed they are healthier and not prone to as many genetic diseases as purebreds are...I have yet to see any hardcore evidence behind this however I do know that Dr George Padgett (a leading authority on canine genetics) has the opinion that mixed breeds are prone to more genetic ailments...now when it comes to health whose opinion can be trusted?...Designer mutt breeders who base their breeding on flawed logic and probably know no more of canine genetics than a typical pet owner or are you going to trust someone that is highly respected in the field?
It's not the mixes itself that are disliked or frowned upon..it's the breeders of them and the intentional breeding of mixes that those of us seriously involved in the canine fancy frown upon...There are enough problems maintaining responsibilility for the breeds that are already recognized until this is no longer a problem the world does not need any "new breeds" to worry about.
This is very true. I've run into this myself. I've given my own dog a "designer" breed name... which is something I made up on the fly one time when someone asked me what he was I looked them dead in the eye and said "Mongolian Poochie Dog."
They immediately asked me where they could get one? Who was my breeder?
I replied "He's ultra rare... he's the only one and he's neutered!"
People get confused as to why I would do that - the neutering of an "ultra rare" breed. I enjoy their confusion in my own malicious ways.
All in all good points and a good post!
They immediately asked me where they could get one? Who was my breeder?
I replied "He's ultra rare... he's the only one and he's neutered!"
People get confused as to why I would do that - the neutering of an "ultra rare" breed. I enjoy their confusion in my own malicious ways.
All in all good points and a good post!
Unfortunatly 99.9% (these are my own made up statistics lol) breeders who breed designer dogs don't use AKC 'champions', they don't care about AKC at all. From experiance I'd say they get purebreds from BYB and mix and match however they like, or whatever's bringing in the money.
That's very funny. My mom did that once when I was about 6 or 7. Someone asked us what kind of dog our 57 heinz was... and she replied "a rare Irish Border Retriever" lol it was the first time I'd ever heard my mom "lie" and it was such a big deal
That's very funny. My mom did that once when I was about 6 or 7. Someone asked us what kind of dog our 57 heinz was... and she replied "a rare Irish Border Retriever" lol
it was the first time I'd ever heard my mom "lie" and it was such a big deal Poodles are great for people with Allergies, my daughter cant have any other dog other than a poodle or poodle mixed with another breed that doesnt shed, neither can my nephew he has severe allergies but they just got a Maltipoo and he is fine with that breed as poodles and maltese dont shed. Some of the poodle mixes like cockerpoo and golden doodle etc of course cant claim to be hypo allergenic because one of the breeds they are crossed with does shed.
When I took my Maltipoo to the vet he said that she will be way less hyper than my poodle because cross breeds tend to be a bit more layed back than purebreeds, and she is, compared to my poodle and my mums poodle.
But its true what the previous poster said I think this thread was started just for an opinion on cockerpoo's not the whole breeding issue.
When I took my Maltipoo to the vet he said that she will be way less hyper than my poodle because cross breeds tend to be a bit more layed back than purebreeds, and she is, compared to my poodle and my mums poodle.
But its true what the previous poster said I think this thread was started just for an opinion on cockerpoo's not the whole breeding issue.
Non-shedding is a myth. All dogs shed. Poodles don't actually "drop" the hair off their body as Labs and Chihuahuas do. The hair that sheds just tangles in with the curly hair of the Poodle. No dog is shedless. Unless of course it is a hairless dog.
Also, I don't understand the statement that "crossbreeds are more laid back than purebreeds." So does this mean that a Golden Retriever/Poodle mix is more laid back than say, a St. Bernard? I would like to see the studies that that comment was derived from.
Also, I don't understand the statement that "crossbreeds are more laid back than purebreeds." So does this mean that a Golden Retriever/Poodle mix is more laid back than say, a St. Bernard? I would like to see the studies that that comment was derived from.
Well I dont know I brush my poodle every day and dont get any hair out, unless he has a big knot. Im fifty years old and have had poodles all my life, if they do shed like you proclaim it must be such a small amount because I have never found any hair lying around. Its the dander from dog and cats skin that some people are allergic too.
I dont think my vet has published any studies yet but I will ask him, he was just making a statement, he can do that cant he, he has seen alot of poodles and crosses in his career I think he may know a little about dogs, but I will check in with him and double check because I know on this forum you have to been right on.
I dont think my vet has published any studies yet but I will ask him, he was just making a statement, he can do that cant he, he has seen alot of poodles and crosses in his career I think he may know a little about dogs, but I will check in with him and double check because I know on this forum you have to been right on.
You know, I'm curious about what people are allergic to when they are allergic to dogs. I know that for cats, it's not the hair itself, but the saliva they leave on the hair (it's what my doc told me). The funny thing is that when I was really allergic to dogs (I still am, just not as much), it's short haired dogs that were the worst for me. Just wondering, for all I know it's something else than the shedding or not that makes poodles hypo-allergenic.
My daughter is allergic to cats and dogs, we have a cat and she doesnt have that short of a coat, but she is not allergic to it. My other daughters friend bought her cat over for the day while they were in the process of moving and my daughter could not even be in the same room with it she was so allergic. The cats had exactly the same length coats and looked pretty identical, it is very weird.
We have always stuck with poodles and she has been fine with them and now the maltipoo who she is not allergic too either. Her Aunt has a lab and she starts rubbing her eyes and sneezing as soon as she sees it.
We have always stuck with poodles and she has been fine with them and now the maltipoo who she is not allergic too either. Her Aunt has a lab and she starts rubbing her eyes and sneezing as soon as she sees it.
I am deathly allergic to cats. I have severe asthma and just being in a room with certain cats (no breed difference) can cause me severe problems. I've been able to live with two mutt cats that I didn't have reactions to. I'm also allergic to most all dogs, althought not to the same extent as I am to cats (hence why I keep a dog and not a cat, although a cat would be easier for me to find an apt for).
However! I have also built up a considerable tolerance to my own dog, but it took me about 3 months to do it. Prior to achieving it, if he licked me I would break out into a rash. I still have issues when handling other dogs - regardless of coat. I have to always wash my hands and keep them away from my face if I pet a strange dog while I am out.
My own asthma seems to be getting worse as I grow older...
Anyway point is your daughter may have a tolerance built up to your particular cat. And she may be more tolerant of poodle mixes because that's what she is being raised with.
The same was true of me, I was raised with a poodle mix as a kid and thus had no problems with other poodle mixes. Anytime I get a new dog I have to go through the tolerance building period... which can last anywhere from 3 - 6 months. I was also raised with horses, but because I haven't been around them regularily in 10 years I have lost my tolerance. I now go into a barn and start to wheeze right away.
*shrugs*
However! I have also built up a considerable tolerance to my own dog, but it took me about 3 months to do it. Prior to achieving it, if he licked me I would break out into a rash. I still have issues when handling other dogs - regardless of coat. I have to always wash my hands and keep them away from my face if I pet a strange dog while I am out.
My own asthma seems to be getting worse as I grow older...
Anyway point is your daughter may have a tolerance built up to your particular cat. And she may be more tolerant of poodle mixes because that's what she is being raised with.
The same was true of me, I was raised with a poodle mix as a kid and thus had no problems with other poodle mixes. Anytime I get a new dog I have to go through the tolerance building period... which can last anywhere from 3 - 6 months. I was also raised with horses, but because I haven't been around them regularily in 10 years I have lost my tolerance. I now go into a barn and start to wheeze right away.
*shrugs*
You got it totally right Mojo. Allergic people can build up a tolerance to their own pet, it just takes a few months. I know that I always end up sniffling when I see other dogs or cats, but I'm ok with mine. Same with the dogs. Another reason why I still want pets
Horses are the worst... They give me REALLY bad asthma. Rabbits are pretty bad also.
Horses are the worst... They give me REALLY bad asthma. Rabbits are pretty bad also.
i never get involved in these arguments, they come up so often.
all dogs are unique, have there own personalities and gorgeous in their own way.
personally since i've never had a pedigree YET, mix's are gorgeous.
i just have one question (don't want any yells about this)
where do the mixed dogs bred by breeders go?
we all love dogs and everyone says not to buy from mix breeders, but if we don't those dogs will just end up in a rescue or die.
i'm going to the animal shelter first, and then if theirs nothing there i will be getting a purebred border collie pup off a mate at school.
P.S for all you mix breeder haters, i personally think that the labradoodle is at risk of becoming a recognised breed, theres even at
www.labradoodle.com (they are gorgeous though!, LOL!)
this site has even got a history and a standard for labradoodles.
all dogs are unique, have there own personalities and gorgeous in their own way.
personally since i've never had a pedigree YET, mix's are gorgeous.
i just have one question (don't want any yells about this)
where do the mixed dogs bred by breeders go?
we all love dogs and everyone says not to buy from mix breeders, but if we don't those dogs will just end up in a rescue or die.
i'm going to the animal shelter first, and then if theirs nothing there i will be getting a purebred border collie pup off a mate at school.
P.S for all you mix breeder haters, i personally think that the labradoodle is at risk of becoming a recognised breed, theres even at
www.labradoodle.com (they are gorgeous though!, LOL!)
this site has even got a history and a standard for labradoodles.
You got the reasoning all wrong. Yes, if the mixed breed puppies can't be sold the breeder will take them to a shelter, but he will also stop breeding because he won't make any money out of it. For every puppy that is bought 'so that the poor dog doesn't go to the shelter', 6 more are born, because the breeder will keep breeding. Bottom line, don't encourage breeders to keep breeding by giving them your money.
About the labradoodle, as they say in that site, the project was closed, and I doubt that just because a few breeders still breed them it will be a recognized breed. Especially as the breeders that made this site are obviously only in for the money when you see how many litters they get every year! 8 litters in two months?? Puppy mill. Those guys don't even care about giving any care to the puppies. So you might want to look for sites a bit more objective than that one.
About the labradoodle, as they say in that site, the project was closed, and I doubt that just because a few breeders still breed them it will be a recognized breed. Especially as the breeders that made this site are obviously only in for the money when you see how many litters they get every year! 8 litters in two months?? Puppy mill. Those guys don't even care about giving any care to the puppies. So you might want to look for sites a bit more objective than that one.
Fran, actually Tegan Park and also Rutland Manor (http://www.rutlandmanor.com/Site/Home.aspx) are definitely not puppy mills. They are one of the few dedicated breeders who actually don't just cross labs and poodles to make F1 crosses but are working on establishing a breed that breeds true. They are honest people dedicated to what they are doing, and are involved in serious research.
Yes, it's a fairly large kennel, but they are certainly not just producing puppies for making a quick buck.
Yes, it's a fairly large kennel, but they are certainly not just producing puppies for making a quick buck.
Yes, they may be working to make a standard by breeding labradoodles with each other instead of just poodles with labs, but I just don't trust any breeder that has 4 litters a month. It's hard to believe that they really do it for the love of labradoodles when they make so much money every month! Plus they ship. So much for breeders that care for their dogs IMO.
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Of course you are entitled to your opinion, Fran, but I really have to disagree here. There are so many things that are not just either black or white.
Rutland Manor for example feeds their dogs a raw diet and advises against feeding kibble - which in my opinion speaks volumes about how much they are concerned about these animals and their health.
No hobby breeder (I'm not saying back yard breeder) with a litter or two per year ever did (nor is going to) establish a new breed and I'd rather see competent people like these do what they do than the hundreds of "business opportunity" F1 breeders in the US who are happy to sell you a lab/poodle cross for $3,000.
Rutland Manor for example feeds their dogs a raw diet and advises against feeding kibble - which in my opinion speaks volumes about how much they are concerned about these animals and their health.
No hobby breeder (I'm not saying back yard breeder) with a litter or two per year ever did (nor is going to) establish a new breed and I'd rather see competent people like these do what they do than the hundreds of "business opportunity" F1 breeders in the US who are happy to sell you a lab/poodle cross for $3,000.