Pitbull and other so called "bully breeds"

[AdrianneIsabel]

Well what my reply would have been is already stated a few times here, so I won't bother.

APBTs and SBTs are far more "bulldog" than "terrier". And AmStaffs are the 'pit bull' that AKC ruined, that have no purpose in history whatsoever. And actually, APBTs do belong to the molosser group. And no, I am not in any way thinking of or talking about American Bullies.

Hm....

My SBT is very terrier. My APBT are very bulldog, yes, but I also own two rescues. I still believe however we are using outdated minimalist categories to label our dogs needlessly.

And, ruined? That's a pretty bold statement, where do you get off claiming them to be ruined?

They're not some unable to naturally breed, naturally whelp, unable to jump, unable to swim, unable to whatever you ask breed.

 

[Danefied]

A few days ago here in sweden, there was a big disscusion about rotweilers and if we should forbid them or not. And the reason behind the discussion was this, a woman was out in the forest walking with her 2 full grown rottweilers, offleash. And then another woman was also walking in the same forest with her little bichon frise. And the 2 rottweilers noticed the little dog, and started running towards it, and the woman had no control on her dogs, and they ignored her completely. And the rottweilers ran oer and they ripped the little dog to pieces.

And because of that it is a big discussion about if we should allow that breed or not.

Personally i think it was the owners fault, if you dont have control of your dog you should not allow it to be off leash in public.

But you started a thread about pit bulls? I guess I'm confused as to what you're wanting to ask/discuss - maybe BSL? You won't find much of a discussion here, I think pretty much any half-way knowledgeable dog person is strongly against BSL (breed specific legislation).

As for that specific incidents you described, of course it was the fault of the woman who owned the rotties. But what you describe could have easily been a pair of greyhounds or other prey driven dog. Its simply a case of owners not having any sort of control, which unfortunately is not unusal at all.

 

[PitBullLove]

Sorry, but yes, AKC 'ruined' the breed. The fighting instinct has been bred out of a lot of AmStaffs. What's a Border Collie who cannot herd? Maybe ruined was a harsh word to use - I was not intending it in the way you are thinking. The word ruined is thrown around and used in many different ways in the dog world.

 

[kady05]

Sorry, but yes, AKC 'ruined' the breed. The fighting instinct has been bred out of a lot of AmStaffs. What's a Border Collie who cannot herd? Maybe ruined was a harsh word to use - I was not intending it in the way you are thinking. The word ruined is thrown around and used in many different ways in the dog world.

I've met many (Sako's mom included) "hot" AmStaffs. I highly doubt you've met every AmStaff on the planet, so saying they've all been "ruined" by the AKC is a little off. And, AKC didn't "ruin" them, the breeders did, if you want to go with that theory.

I'm aware that DA is an acceptable Bully breed trait, however I'd much prefer to have dog social dogs and don't think that just because all of my dogs (Sako included, who is a purebred AmStaff) are NOT DA means they're somehow "ruined" or what have you.

 

[AdrianneIsabel]

What a perverse way to look at the breed. Is that really all these dogs are worth to you? A desire to fight? If so this breed may as well already be dead because if you hadnt been told already dogfighting is illegal.

Me, my APBT are worth so much more and if I ever get an Ast I'll appreciate it's drive, biddability, and pleasure of companionship.

 

[kady05]

What a perverse way to look at the breed. Is that really all these dogs are worth to you? A desire to fight? If so this breed may as well already be dead because if you hadnt been told already dogfighting is illegal.

Me, my APBT are worth so much more and if I ever get an Ast I'll appreciate it's drive, biddability, and pleasure of companionship.

You said that a lot better than me. Personally, I can't stand people with the "If it's not DA, it's not a real APBT" mentality.. who freaking cares?!

 

[PitBullLove]

There is no need to get offended, AKC has ruined many breeds, and I did not say ALL, I said MOST, which is why many breed franciers push for their breed to NOT be registered by the AKC and why some breeders are not involved in AKC events and why working dogs and show dogs are very, very differently. Look at AmStaffs and APBTs and working Pointers and AKC Pointers and working GSDs and AKC GSDs. This might be a good read for you. Dog's Best Friend Annals of the Dog-Human Relationship by Mark Derr.

 

[PitBullLove]

What a perverse way to look at the breed. Is that really all these dogs are worth to you? A desire to fight? If so this breed may as well already be dead because if you hadnt been told already dogfighting is illegal.

Me, my APBT are worth so much more and if I ever get an Ast I'll appreciate it's drive, biddability, and pleasure of companionship.

No, that is not all I think the breed is worth at all.

 

[AdrianneIsabel]

So I ask again how you believe the mere elimination of the fight desire is a Proof positive of the ruining of the breed?

 

[kady05]

No, that is not all I think the breed is worth at all.

But your only reason re: AKC "ruining" the AmStaff was that "The fighting instinct has been bred out of a lot of AmStaffs."