Forced sick leave pay

Gena

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#1
Seriously...who thinks these things up?

House Bill Introduced to Require Paid Sick Leave for H1N1 Cases - WSJ.com

NOVEMBER 3, 2009, 4:37 P.M. ET House Bill Introduced to Require Paid Sick Leave for H1N1 Cases

WASHINGTON--A senior House Democrat on Tuesday introduced legislation directing employers to pay for up to five days' sick leave for workers they send home because they have contracted the H1N1 virus.

House Education and Labor Committee Chairman George Miller (D., Calif.) said his bill would ensure that workers wouldn't miss out on wages if they contract the illness. The employer would be required to pay for the sick leave, and there would be no cost to the taxpayer, Mr. Miller said.

The bill wouldn't oblige employers to pay for workers' time off. It would tell them that, if they intend to send employees who are ill home, they must then pay for them to have up to five days' leave.

Mr. Miller said his panel would hold a hearing on the legislation the week of Nov. 16. If the bill is successfully enacted by Congress, it would take effect 15 days after being signed into law, and expire in two years.

It wasn't clear whether the legislation had the support of House leadership or Senate Democrats.

Mr. Miller said half of all workers, many of them blue collar, don't have access to paid sick leave. Often, these workers live on a paycheck-to-paycheck basis, meaning they can't afford to take time off if they fall ill. "Many of them are either afraid or cannot afford to take time off, especially if they don't have access to paid sick leave," he said.
 

GipsyQueen

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#3
I agree, I think it's a good thing! Why shouldn't they have the right to have sick payed days? I would rather pay them, than have them get the whole company infected with H1N1.
 

ACooper

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#4
Think of the food workers coming in sick, or ANY of the service workers who DO NOT HAVE paid sick time? They come in to serve you, can't afford to stay home and WHAM...........now you get sick too. I think it's a good thing too :)

It won't affect Kevin's company.......Kevin gets sick days already. They add up and add up until he is FORCED to take them or take the money instead.
 

yoko

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#5
Its bad because if they have to pay to send someone home some companies just won't. So more people will be exposed for a longer time
 
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Gena

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#6
Someone who understands the importance of prevention???

I haven;t read the proposed bill in detail, but is something wrong with it? I think this is a good thing...
From the article...
The bill wouldn't oblige employers to pay for workers' time off. It would tell them that, if they intend to send employees who are ill home, they must then pay for them to have up to five days' leave.
One, that right there will set employees up to fail. You've got to come in and pass your germs around and hope to get sent home for the pay to kick in.

Two, legislating what businesses have to pay ends up biting the employees in the butt in the long run. A small business owner simply won't hire more people or will let people go if he can't afford this new sick leave law. Plus it opens the door for more laws about what illnesses employers have to pay sick leave on. I've got sick time as part of my benefits, and can use it as I choose. But there are about 100 people working with me who don't get that benefit. If even 20 of those people use the 5 days at $65 per day plus another $65 a day for a replacement...it adds up quickly.
 

GipsyQueen

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#7
From the article...


One, that right there will set employees up to fail. You've got to come in and pass your germs around and hope to get sent home for the pay to kick in.

Two, legislating what businesses have to pay ends up biting the employees in the butt in the long run. A small business owner simply won't hire more people or will let people go if he can't afford this new sick leave law. Plus it opens the door for more laws about what illnesses employers have to pay sick leave on. I've got sick time as part of my benefits, and can use it as I choose. But there are about 100 people working with me who don't get that benefit. If even 20 of those people use the 5 days at $65 per day plus another $65 a day for a replacement...it adds up quickly.

Thats true, but people will not take as many sick days if they do not get paid, esp. if they are very tight on money, and have no choice. As far as I know, H1N1 is pretty infectious, so if 20 workers, all have H1N1, and lets say half of them come in and work; 1, they will not work as efficantly (sp) 2, they will infect more workers, resulting in lets say 50 sick leaves. If half of my co-workers are sick, then I will need people to do the job for them. Of course they will need to be payed as well, but they will not be able to work as efficantly as all my other co-workers.

Moraly, in my opinion, payed sick days should be a must.
 

Doberluv

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#8
It's bad because it's just more governement intrusiveness into private citizens' lives. Let the business owner decide how he wants to handle it. Why does everyone want the governement to regulate everything that is none of their business? What have these polititans regulated and run so far, that works? Why do people keep expecting them to fix anything? The definitition of insantity is.......
 

Giny

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#9
I don't see it as a good idea either. It would bankrupt many small business. I can understand that certain jobs, it's difficult enough to survive on the wages that they are already given and staying home on a sick leave without pay would be difficult, but wouldn't it be a lot worse if many business, where they are employed, would have to shut down because of it?

And Doberluv, I agree with that.
 

Doberluv

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#10
Yup...just wait and see what Obama's health "reform" does to this country. The only consolation to me will be that I'll get to say, "I told you so."
 

GipsyQueen

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It's bad because it's just more governement intrusiveness into private citizens' lives. Let the business owner decide how he wants to handle it. Why does everyone want the governement to regulate everything that is none of their business? What have these polititans regulated and run so far, that works? Why do people keep expecting them to fix anything? The definitition of insantity is.......
I think there should be a social standard, but thats just my opinion. Just like everyone should have health insurance, everyone should be able to have payed sick days.
I don't think it has anything to do with politicians regulating or forcing anything.
 

GipsyQueen

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#13
Who then, do you think is forcing this bill?
Would you rather they sit back and relax? IMO politicians need to activly do things, to *improve* (Im not saying this is always the case) our economical, social, ect. ect. politics. Not everything my be in the interest of everyone (heck, there I are many things I dont agree with) but may in the long run, improve the economical, social ect. structure.
 

Doberluv

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Could you give me some examples or even one example of when and how our governement...our politicians have improved our economical or social structure?
 
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#15
they've got people so programmed to what they want you to think it's rediculous. this H1N1 has been around the world people. It hasn't caused anything like they're predicting here, NOTHING even remotely close. quit listening to the TV, and if you're so afraid, go live in a bubble.

People get sick, most do not, rarely is it severe, most times people don't even know they've ever been infected. Some people stay home when sick, some go to work, some get paid, some don't, some companies can afford it, some can't. Mind your own fricking business and honestly if you're that afraid, don't come out of your house. Let the rest of us that want to live with a little common sense continue to do so.
 
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Could you give me some examples or even one example of when and how our governement...our politicians have improved our economical or social structure?
i'm not for gov't take over, but i'm not niave to see they haven't done lots of good too.

Child labor laws anyone? The busting up of monopolies, although I'd argue that the big companies have worked they way around that and bought enough loopholes in washington they can disguise themselves rather well these days.
 
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#17
Yup...just wait and see what Obama's health "reform" does to this country. The only consolation to me will be that I'll get to say, "I told you so."
and doing nothing will result in the same. Our companies can no longer afford to give health care benefits, it will take down other companies, just like it has been doing recently. Americans won't be able to afford it on their own.

Our waistlines aren't the only thing bloated in this country. You think the housing bubble was bad? wait till health care consumes more than the 20% of our dollars spent in this country and then take suddenly take all the employee health benefits away and nobody can afford meaningful insurance. unless something changes, the collapse is coming and it won't be just realtors and mortage brokers out of jobs, think of all the good paying jobs that will be gone.

There won't always be a need for doctors nurses, claims people etc if nobody can pay for it
 

GipsyQueen

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Yup...just wait and see what Obama's health "reform" does to this country. The only consolation to me will be that I'll get to say, "I told you so."
The US is in a giant need of a health reform. Siriously? Is your health "system" working? I've know SO many people who have been thrown out of their insurance because they either cost them much, or they could not afford insurance anymore. What is the point of a health insurance, if they throw me out, because I cost them too much? How can it be justified, that people, who can not afford health inssurance, just plain and simply do not have health inssurance and are there for less privilged than those who do? Supposed two people have cancer - one has insurance, which helps pay for the hospital bill, the other doesn't and cannot afford treatment. Is that persons life any less worthy than the others? :rolleyes:
Our health system works pretty well. Im not saying its perfect, but it works. Everyone has to be health inssured by law, you pay a certian percentage of your income. However, you don't have to pay to go to the doctors, or to get a shot and so on and so forth.

Could you give me some examples or even one example of when and how our governement...our politicians have improved our economical or social structure?
Health laws, Educational laws, public schooling for everyone - not just for those who can afford it, Child care tax credits, inspection laws, through the government your money deposits in the bank are garenteed to be there ect.

No, not everything the government does is good, but imagine if there was no government`?
 

Doberluv

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#19
Government Intervention has hurt the Economy Reclaim Our Heritage



Our public education is in a miserable state. Our money has no such guarantees. They only tell you it's a guarantee. The federal government just manipulated our economy in such a way as to take 1/2 of my retirement right out of my accounts. They're printing money so fast with no gold standard that the dollar is diminishing rapidly. You think your money is safe in a bank? What kind of guarantee is that? It did not diminish so drastically on account of the natural market. Government intervention caused this.

What do you think the "federal" reserve has done to our monetary integrity? The federal reserve is not a government entity, despite the word, "Federal" in there. It is a cartel, just like a drug cartel....crooks, thugs. They have destroyed the value of the dollar. It has not been backed by the gold standard for quite some time. And when that happens, after a certain amount of time, our country....the world economy will collapse. But our governement supports and is indirectly involved with this organization.

What do you think of the federal government's money monopoly?

I don't think monopolies are always a bad thing depending on what kind of monopoly it is. There are economic and social disadvantages and there are some advantages too.



Government Intervention: A Threat to Economic Recovery

June 10, 2009
Government Intervention: A Threat to Economic Recovery
by Ambassador Terry Miller
Testimony
Testimony before
The House Committee on Foreign Affairs'
Subcommittee on Terrorism, Nonproliferation
and Trade

June 10, 2009


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My name is Terry Miller. I am Director of the Center for International Trade and Economics at The Heritage Foundation and editor of the Index of Economic Freedom. The views I express in this testimony are my own, and should not be construed as representing any official position of The Heritage Foundation.

Though we sit today at what may well be the low point of a recession that has seen world economic growth slow to near zero, it is important to remember that what we are experiencing is a temporary setback. If one takes a longer view, it is clear that the economic policies that have come to dominate world economic thinking over the last 60 years, and especially since the fall of the Soviet Union, are producing strong broad-based growth, growth that is increasing prosperity and reducing poverty around the world.

The numbers are not ambiguous. Over the last decade, per capita income in all countries of the world combined has increased by an average of about three percent per year. Over the 10 years, that adds up to an increase of over one-third in average world incomes.

The growth in incomes is remarkably broad-based, not concentrated in just a few countries or regions. Of the 156 countries for which we have reliable data, only 12 failed to participate in this positive growth over the decade.

The economic system that has been producing these remarkable results is known by various names. Most economists would call it the free market system or capitalism. Some identify it with globalization. Some call it the Washington Consensus, because it represents the consensus of views and policies espoused by the World Bank, the International Monetary Fund and, at least until recently, the government of the United States.

At The Heritage Foundation, we call it economic freedom, and we measure it each year in the Index of Economic Freedom, which we publish jointly with The Wall Street Journal.

The key principles of economic freedom are individual empowerment, non-discrimination, and the dispersion of power:

Individual empowerment means that individuals retain control of where they live and how much they work. They have the right to own property and decide when and how to spend their wealth and income.
Non-discrimination means that there should be no preferences based on race, gender, religion, class, family connections or any other such trait. Each individual deserves an equal opportunity to prosper to the full extent of their ability and effort. Transparency in decision-making is a key aspect in ensuring such fairness; it is behind walls of secrecy that discrimination most often flourishes.
Dispersion of power means pursuing policies and practices that foster competition in labor markets, in capital markets, between firms and even among countries. The separation of political and economic power is a key aspect in the dispersion of power.
Countries that respect these principles of economic freedom do far better on average economically than countries in which governments play a more intrusive role. The countries ranked as most free in the 2009 Index of Economic Freedom had average per capita incomes of over $40,000, more than 10 times the income levels in countries where economic freedoms are repressed.

Some criticize the free market system as good for the rich but not for the poor. The data show otherwise. When we compare economic freedom scores with poverty levels as measured in the United Nations Human Poverty Index, we find that countries that gained at least 5 points of economic freedom in the decade between 1997 and 2007 moved almost 6 percent of their populations out of poverty on average. Countries that lost at least 5 points of economic freedom, by contrast, saw poverty levels increase.

The same positive trends are evident in connection with social development in areas like education, health, child or maternal mortality, and overall life expectancy, as well as in protection of the environment, where countries that are more economically free do a far better job than their less free counterparts.

Given these positive long term trends, and the proven good economic results in countries around the world that respect principles of economic freedom and market-based decision-making, I would submit that the first responsibility of policy makers in leading economies, especially in a time of downturn or crisis, is to preserve the capitalist system and to do no harm. Markets are by and large self-correcting. Government interventions, which are almost always designed to restore or protect the status quo ante, impede the corrective action of the market and thus slow recovery.

The record of government interference in the economy, whether in the United States or in countries around the world, is not pretty. The TARP and TALF programs, both initiated under the previous administration, are good examples of the problems of government interference in markets. The policy-makers involved argued that the programs were necessary to avoid an immediate melt-down in financial markets. We cannot, of course, know what would have happened in the programs' absence. However, from the perspective of six months following their passage, we can see that their lasting result has been not the hoped-for increase in stability and lending in credit markets, but rather greater uncertainty and volatility. Markets need sure and stable government laws and policies in order to properly price assets. The TARP, in particular, has created confusion and interfered with the establishment of a market-clearing price for the troubled assets in question. There has been a disappointing lack of transparency in the program's decision-making processes that leaves potential investors uncertain of the direction of the market and therefore unwilling to invest. The TARP may have artificially inflated the value of the troubled assets, but it has done little to get them off the books of the financial institutions.

The fiscal stimulus package passed under the current administration is even worse. Even if one accepts the Keynesian notion that increased government spending can increase economic growth, and there are real doubts about this, almost none of the money has actually been spent, or will be spent, in a timely fashion. One estimate this month is that only about $37 billion of the $787 billion stimulus package has been spent so far. Most of the money is projected to be spent in the future when government stimulus will no longer be appropriate and will most likely only contribute to inflationary pressure.
 

Doberluv

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#20
The cost of these programs is creating a huge debt for our children that will have to be financed somehow. If we continue them, we are going to see either inflation or increased taxes or both, as well as a fall in the value of the dollar and decreased foreign investment in the United States, lower productivity overall, and reduced economic growth in the future. That is far from doing no harm.

Between January and April this year, the International Monetary Fund reduced its projection of U.S. economic growth in 2010 from a positive 1.6 percent to zero. The most significant U.S. public policy change during this period was the passage of the stimulus package. Now we are seeing bond markets driving up the cost of Treasury borrowing in response to unprecedented government spending. This is a path to impoverishment rather than recovery. We need to stop.

Some have expressed the hope that increased international cooperation, such as among the G-20, could contribute to a solution to the problem. I have very modest expectations in this regard. The G-20 can play a positive role in exchanging information and promoting mutual confidence among governments, but the most important macro-economic variables under the control of governments, the money supply and spending levels, must and will remain the province of individual governments.

There was much talk about regulatory reform at the recent G-20 summit, and such reform is, in fact, needed. Financial market regulation needs to change to encourage more transparency, greater competition, and a reduction in regulatory distortions that increase lending risk. The probability, unfortunately, is that international cooperation will lead to just the opposite, a regulatory system that is more complex, more subject to manipulation, and more restrictive.

The general rule is that more regulation leads ultimately to the provision of less of the regulated product. It is extremely unlikely that increasing regulation of financial and credit markets could lead to any result in the end other than a reduction in the availability of credit to individuals and businesses and an increase in its cost.

Looking forward, as we begin to recover from the financial crisis, there are different and even greater potential risks to the U.S. and world economies. Policies that would greatly and artificially increase the cost of energy will cut U.S. and world growth and lead to increased poverty worldwide. It is imperative that these costs be fully considered in the development of any policies to address climate change.

In addition, actions that would restrict or reduce the flows of goods and services or capital among the countries of the world would also have a devastating impact on world growth. Trade flows increase productivity and growth rates. Income from trade dwarfs all other aspects of financing for development in poorer countries. Trade restrictions go by the name of protectionism, but what they protect are the unfair privileges of politically-connected special interests.

If policies must be developed in any of these areas, it is most important that they be as simple, straight-forward and transparent as possible. As the size and reach of the federal government increases in the U.S. economy, there is an ever-present risk of increased graft and corruption. These factors, more than any others, account for low levels of development in much of the world. Corruption thrives where economic regulations are complex and government involvement pervasive. It must not be allowed to take root here.

Over the past decades we have maintained in America, and exported to most of the rest of the world, a free market economic system that encourages openness, the free flow of goods, services and capital, and interconnectedness among the nations and people of the world. The result has been greatly increased prosperity for all. A time of crisis may be a time to examine what has been done and what might be done better, but it is surely not the time to fundamentally undo the policies and practices that have brought so much benefit to so many.

Economic Freedom Improves Lives
 

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