Aspen Kennels - Should be called "Mixes R Us"

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#81
It's ok Maggie'sMum, you just don't feel as strongly about it as I do. I have had too many experiences with this stuff. I have a local group that goes and protests against "breeding" like that, puppy mills and petsores. I have even gone to the former PetLand I worked at and then quit at because of the conditions, but that is a whole other story. Some people feel strongly about some things over others, to me a dog is like my child, so i protect, if your child was in danger or something was going the wrong way for them, I know many mothers who would forget the respect part to protect. I do understand what you're saying though, but do not agree with you, sorry. This whole thing has turned out to be so dumb, someone says an opinion and gets bashed for it, and then there is a whole dang cry over it. Ehh oh well many of you are different. From now on I hope everyone knows that not all of my opinions against backyard breeders like that who advertise in a website are not going to be pretty. On the other hand though I would never butt in and bash any of you on the forum for something you say. I have'nt so far and won't in the long run.
 

lakotasong

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#82
Does this mean you need to sugarcoat?? No, it just means you need to be respectful.
Sorry, but a true BYB/PM that does not wish to be educated will get NOT ONE OUNCE of respect from me. And if someone continues to stick around after I've politely and professionally tried to educate them for the better, then I will gladly let them know just how big of a piece of **** they are, online or off.
 

Muggie'sMum

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#83
But Summit, it's possible to display a little tact, taste and respect if you don't know if these people don't wish to be educated - which in this case, maybe they don't? You can't walk into every situation like this both guns blazing, it's just hurting your cause.


I guess I am just nonviolent, and non confrontational, and believe in the old fashioned concept of respect, especially for people who are older than me. Does respect mean I have to agree with them? No.

*sigh*

I'm not even going to continue to try to talk sense anymore.

You're all right! Let's string people up by their ankles with barbed wire, ESPECIALLY if they don't know any better!!!!
 
S

savethebulliedbreeds

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#84
Sorry, but a true BYB/PM that does not wish to be educated will get NOT ONE OUNCE of respect from me. And if someone continues to stick around after I've politely and professionally tried to educate them for the better, then I will gladly let them know just how big of a piece of **** they are, online or off.
I completely agree with you summitview.

I have tried being "nice" and "tactful" many times before. It has never ever worked for me.
 
S

savethebulliedbreeds

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#85
You're all right! Let's string people up by their ankles with barbed wire, ESPECIALLY if they don't know any better!!!!
The problem is is most BYBers and puppymills KNOW what they are doing wrong and just dont care.

I don't have a problem giving advice to someone that comes on here that doesn't know any better and had an accident, but when you are full out breeding like these breeders, you KNOW what is right and what is wrong. Their only reason for breeding these dogs is because they are cute and they sell for big bucks. I don't agree with that and I would not be nice if I wrote them an email either.
 

FoxyWench

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#86
well think of it more this way, somoene sends you an email you have no idea who this person is you oepn the email and read it...

Blah blah blah I HATE YOU...Blah blah blah, YOUR WRONG...blah blah blah YOUR A BAD PERSON...blah blah blah...YOU SHOULD DIE...

I know what i do...skim and deleete.

them someone else with the exact same veiwpoint sends you an eloquently written letter saying the exact same thing but in better chosen words and explaining why...Yes id deleet that one too but id be intruigued enough to actually READ it first.
And even if they dont want to learn, words wrote one way are more likely to stick with them and mabe even raise thoughts that wernt there before rather than just one more "i Hate You" email in their trash can...

if they dont want to learn your right they wont...but sometimes a little tact goes a long way...
 

BSan

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#87
Good point Jesse! Thanks for trying Muggie, and Foxy. As far as the other recent posts, all I can do is *sigh*. I guess for now your minds are made up, whether what you do is respectful, effective or not. So...... we'll have to agree to disagree. I stand my own ground, stating that my puppy, from Aspen, who was well taken care of, and noticeably by my vet, did not come from such a terrible environment that some have stated. He is an outstanding companion, and beautiful puppy. No regrets. For me, I think my part in this conversation is over, as there is nothing else to say.
 
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#88
Same here, nothing more I have to say. I have made my point and others have come to understand it from my point of view and theirs. I love that we all can have different opinions and different ways of dealing with things. Some people are "non-violent and non-confrontational" and others are like me, we will try in a nice way to educate, but when they don't listen that way we can get ugly. Thats just the way some ppl are. To you nice ones and to you "stand up for what you believe in a 'violent and confrontational' way ones"... I say way to go to everyone and all for their love of dogs and drive to keep the population down and blood lines clean and controled.
 

~Jessie~

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#89
After I try to educate and that person is then rude, I will be rude and mean to them and tell them exactly how I feel! Many people do not listen, but some do (a very few some).

I don't think that anyone said that Aspen Kennels do not take care of their dogs... the problem lies in the dogs that they are breeding.
 
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#92
That is really sick. A new breed? for 1500 bucks? No thank you. If I wanted to buy a mix I could find a perfectly happy dog to save at a shelter. What is wrong with these people? If you want to pay that much go get a show quality pure breed.

A doodleman pinscher? SChnoodle? No thanks.
 

Dizzy

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#93
If I wanted a pure bred dog - I could go down to ANY shelter and pick one up.

There are as many being pumped out as mixed breeds.

The only gripe people have is because they have mixed parentage.

I would have paid over the odds for my Bodhi - I persoanlly would not want a pedigree dog. She is my perfect dog. I would get another mixed breed ANY day of the week.

IF I was to want a dog, and wanted to BUY a MIX BREED - that is my choice, and I would apply the same knowledge to acquiring one as any purebreed. People like to know where there puppy came from. You have NO guarentees with a shelter dog. Personally - that is fine by me - as I do not have small children to consider, or any other factors - SOME PEOPLE DO.

The fact is - noone here has the right here to say what breeds (mix or otherwise) do or do not exist. Noone here has the right to tell me, or anyone else what I should or should not own.

It is no different to BSL.

People should be targetting TRUE bad breeders indiscriminately.

You talk about ETHICS - well - that only hits home if you agree with those ethics in the 1st place.

Personally - I think 99% of pedigree dog breeding needs looking at, and monitoring.
 
S

savethebulliedbreeds

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#95
UGH! I do not, and never have agreed with the breeding of mixed breed dogs for ANY reason.

You do not have to buy a mixed breed dog from a BREEDER! There are many, many rescue groups out there with new born, mixed breed puppies that need homes.

Trust me, bad breeders are targeted the same here. Mixed or purebred. If someone is breeding mixed breed dogs they are doing it for nothing more than profit and purebred breeders that breed for that very reason are also bad breeders.
 

Dizzy

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#96
You do not have to buy a mixed breed dog from a BREEDER! There are many, many rescue groups out there with new born, mixed breed puppies that need homes.
There are many many pedigrees in rescue too... Not to mention many breed SPECIFIC rescues....

So, theoretically - you shouldn't have to bother buying one of those from a breeder either.

In fact - while we're on the moral soap box - surely people are doing a dis-service to ALL dogs by buying from breeders FULL STOP while there are so many dogs in kennels - pedigree and mixed.
 
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#97
There are many many pedigrees in rescue too... Not to mention many breed SPECIFIC rescues....

So, theoretically - you shouldn't have to bother buying one of those from a breeder either.

In fact - while we're on the moral soap box - surely people are doing a dis-service to ALL dogs by buying from breeders FULL STOP while there are so many dogs in kennels - pedigree and mixed.
Exactly, all breeders should be held to a much higher standard than what now exists.
Three of my 5 dogs are registered purebred dogs from breeders who neglected them horribly. I took them home when the breeders were shut down. 2 of the three only bred one breed...it meant nothing. One breeder was up and running again within a year in a different location but still kept her dogs in a dark basement kenneled for over 20 hours/day in wire crates (my Amos came from her shop of horrors).

Tinkers breeder was well known in the show world but kept her 20+ Chihuahuas in a filthy trailer with less than bare minimum care.

Many breeders of pure bred dogs pump out puppies for a dollar and house their breeding dogs in disgusting conditions...check out how many offer puppies over the net. Pure bred means nothing anymore, you still have to do your homework and that means truly knowing (not over the net), how the dogs are REALLY cared for and bred.

Breeding to improve the breed is the execption these days. Very few breeders breed for those reasons and even fewer dogs are actually doing the work that they were bred for.
 
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#98
Many breeders of pure bred dogs pump out puppies for a dollar and house their breeding dogs in disgusting conditions...check out how many offer puppies over the net. Pure bred means nothing anymore, you still have to do your homework and that means truly knowing (not over the net), how the dogs are REALLY cared for and bred.

Breeding to improve the breed is the execption these days. Very few breeders breed for those reasons and even fewer dogs are actually doing the work that they were bred for.
I totally agree with this, it's something I've been thinking about a lot lately. As dog lovers we want to help and protect the dogs, but the problem runs so deeply that there is little we can realistically do, than stay aware, support rescues and shelters, and hope the love of dogs will motivate people to be educated about their care and well-being... and of course, love and care for our dogs to the best of our ability.

It is truly sad the conditions that some breeders keep their animals in, even small-time breeders who might only have a few animals. Pure bred really can mean anything from the healthiest, most pampered pups you could hope for to the sickest, most neglected... it's really sad. Dr2little I've seen a lot of what you described with the chihuahuas, I think the majority of dog breeders in KS run a fairly filthy operation, but there's so much land and farms and good ol' boys that it's just way more uncommon to see a breeder who does all the health testing, asks a lot of questions of the family the dog will be going to, etc. More often than not the dogs live outside, people come by and see them, say "aww how cute", the money changes hands and that's that. Not the best way to do things, but I can't say that I hate all breeders who run things this way. I got two wonderful dogs from two bad breeders. I wouldn't trade them for anything. I reported neglect on Midas' breeder because he was being neglected, outside all day alone in a concrete pen being eaten alive by ticks. He was an "AKC purebred lab" with papers, but it took hours of tweezing, bathing, and a couple good douses of vet bug-killing stuff to get all the creepy crawlies off him. Moro's breeder is a friend of mine's relative and she was healthy and vermin-free, but that doesn't mean he was a good breeder either. She was an "ad puppy", the local classified was for "$50 wolf hybrid pups for Valentine's day"...when we looked at the number, we realized that we knew the guy selling them, went out there and got her. He had another female pup that looked just like her... his son tells me that he never ended up selling that one, and she still lives out on his farm. He only has litters every once in a while, I don't think more than once a year. I know now that buying a dog this way is not a good way to go, but I'm not gonna say that I hate the guy for it or that I think he's pure evil for breeding wolf hybrids and selling them through the paper. It is not the best situation, but I have a lot more problems with puppy mills and huge breeding operations that dole out puppy after purebred puppy for enormous prices, with little attention to their care.

Still, that is the situation that so many puppies end up in. Why does it happen? Well, it's a combination of the exploitation of humanity's love for dogs, and greed, plain and simple. People see their gorgeous dream of a purebred dog, they think, "I have to have it!", they find someone with an advertisement for it, they buy it and they don't want to think about where it came from. As long as that type of demand is there for dogs, there will always be people willing to do whatever they can to fill the supply and make the money, regardless of the effects on innocent dogs. It's sad but the world works this way again and again. It's just like if I sat here and started thinking about my clothing, and how much of it was possibly made by underage workers in some third-world country because it can be made cheaply there and brought here to be sold for huge prices... I'd just get really depressed because there's little I can do, short of making all my own clothes.

What really upsets me is people who see their dog as kind of a fashion accessory, or an afterthought to their life. People who are like "oh yeah, I have a pit bull/poodle/rottweiler/dalmation/insert breed here", and it's kind of like their only use for the dog is the bragging rights to say "I have this"...and in reality the dog sits outside in the yard and never gets played with, or is chained up, or the owner loves the dog at first when it's small and cute, and then gets bored with it as it gets older and it's just kind of "there". It's amazing to me that some people would spend thousands on a purebred dog from a crappy breeder or a pet store, only to get tired of taking care of it in a few months.

That's why I think sites like this are great...it encourages people to think about their dogs and talk about them, share ideas for the best ways to take care of them, and it gives new owners a wealth of information to help them raise their dog to be happy and healthy. That's why the world needs more dog people like us... people who don't just see their dogs as something neat they bought. People who see their dogs as their true friends, companions, even their children ;) (I know hubby and me call ourselves 'mom' and 'dad' around the dogs, hehe) The world is a better place for dogs cause of you guys!!!
 

chinchow

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#99
I'll stick to buying my purebreds from a reputable breeder who doesn't mix breeds to make a buck, or get their name out there by creating something that will probably never happen anyway. Thanks.
 

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