Do you like dogs with docked tails?

I don't see how keeping the tail makes them lose their personality?


And I've a lab. He's not exactly a stoic animal himself (even at 8 he still tears about as if he was 1) but has had no problems.

We don't see a lot of tail problems in the clinic either in similar dogs.

But maybe we're just bad pet owners, I don't know.

Well without raising flames....

I won't own a boxer with a tail..Period...whip like tail attached to a happy butt..NO THANK YOU...

I have done three litters myself, but i have banded the tails (which does the same thing as docking).
I have gotten to hold and perform, so both ends of the deed.
They squeal while being restrained and then POOF miraculously they are just find and feeding again!

Do i like dogs with non docked tails...sure...i prefer not to own one though. I have a mastiff that visits often could NOT LIVE WITH IT...and german shepherd tails..oh heck no, hair and bruises..no thanks!

I think that once we start dictating whether dogs are to be docked cropped or s/n (which by the way is also an unnatural mutilation--no matter how necessary) we give way to AR "wackos" telling us we can't even OWN dogs.
S

Lab coats are completely different than Dobe OR Boxer coats GO...as is the tail itself...the bone and density of said same. Labs have been selected very carefully for the tails they posses...it is a part of the dog and they use it to do their job. IF a line was to have fragile tails they would not further it. Not every breed put tails up there like that...historically...if something is not specifically paid heed to...it cannot be expected to bear up the same as if it had.

stoic has nothing to do with running around and being active. Stoic means not reacting to pain.

So someone who s/n's isn't a responsible pet owner?

I don't think every animal in the world needs to be spayed and neutered (we'd run out if so) but for people who don't plan to breed then yah probably. Only takes once for the animal to run out the door for a new litter to be brought about.

I don't think that's convenience, that's just good sense.

Sorry, you're right, I picked the wrong word. Let's go with 'calm' instead.

Hmm maybe.. but girls aren't in heat 24/7. Why is it so hard to think that people could (if they wanted to) be a little bit more dillegent during those 4-6 weeks out a year to keep track of their dog?

You are deliberately trying to twist my words! I said I had Snip snipped. I said it was done for convenience. You said people were irresponsible and I agreed. You were the one who brought that up not me.

LOL!!!

I give up. That's it! Keeping their tail doesn't make them lose their personalities. Docking their tail doesn't make them lose their personalities either. They're going to be as physically active, as high energy and exuberant doing other activities and thus prone to hurting those long tails whether they're docked or not. So, it's better that they're docked at an early age. Long tails on certain breeds, depending on the construction of the tail are more prone to injury than others.

I've had Labs too. In fact, in one of the pictures I posted in this thread, my lab is in the lake behind Lyric. I wouldn't worry so much about a Lab. Mine made it to 14 years old without hurting her tail. She wagged it plenty. But a Lab's tail has a thick fat layer on it and a lot of thick fur. A Dobermans does not. A Boxer's, Vizsla, Weim and a lot of other breeds do not have that protection. And Labs run at probably less than half the speed of a Doberman. I ought to know. I've had both. LOL.

Not talking about a male and a female that someone owns. I'm talking about wild dogs or a dog that got loose or something like that. An intact dog may slip out the door when you go out to get the mail, or meet someone, and sure you could tell them to 'stay' and they're probably great animals else wise.

But if they get a whiff of an in heat female they may decide to ignore your command and bolt out the door in the few moments you have it open.

It's not just your dogs breeding with each other you have to worry about, but others too.


I'm just going off what you said. That's all you're giving me. Sorry if I didn't pick up on something that you meant to say but didn't or was not as clear as you thought it was.

And I'd have to disagree that a lab runs at half the speed of a dobe. Your lab may have, but I've seen some pretty fast labs. Not all of them have that jaunty lope that they're portrayed as.

Absolutely. :hail: I keep writing posts while others are writing and I miss them so mine must be redundant. Anyhow, good points.

Well around here there is pretty much 0 feral dog population. And it might surprise you but animals can be taught to listen over hormones. Kaiden can work and stay right beside girls in heat in group settings and not go on a breeding rampage. In fact its easier if the dog is at a distance. So its more convenient to remove the parts than it is to train your dog.

I am not saying s/n is wrong. I encourage my puppy buyers to do so. I am just saying lets not delude ourselves as to who is benefiting from the surgery.

On the s/n issue..........it is NOT common practice in other parts of the world like it is here in the US. I have/had friends from all over (as most of us here on Chaz do) and most of them are appalled at how the US pushes for s/n.

It most certainly IS for the convenience of the owners in most cases (and yes, it does keep population down since many can't/won't be bothered to be careful). They happily perform a spay/neuter elsewhere when it's medically necessary or you ask for it (I've been told) but they do not do it routinely like they do here.

hmm Labs have Newf in their history...Dobes...Greyhound...LOL. I'm going with the Dobe LOL.

I wish I could say the same. Especially after the two hurricanes we've had.

I realize animals can be trained above their hormones. But not every dog is the same and an animal may just go '**** it' regardless of how well they're trained.

I suppose in the long run we are in a manner benefiting from the surgery but I also like to think that the unborn puppies who may be abandoned from such accidental breedings benefit in some way as well.

:rofl1: Me too

That is why you train and manage. Its not as hard as you make it out to be. How many pups would get born (if people actually were responsible) over how many dogs die due to complications of the surgery? I know of dogs who died on or just off the table. A person came onto another forum in the past 3 days who had lost their 3 year old bitch on the table during a spay.

There are risks with any plan of action.

I don't intend to make it out to be hard. I just realize that dogs are not perfect creatures (and cats especially not) and there are extenuating circumstances that are beyond our control which can easily result in an 'accidental' breeding.

Well in the three years I've been working in a vet clinic we lost one animal due to a spay (none to neuters, but a neuter is much less invasive) and that's because the owner wanted it done on a 7 year old. I still am disappointed that my vet consented to do it but her blood work was normal so he went for it and lost unfortunately.

I will disagree with the "easily result" LOL have you tried breeding dogs? Its not instantaneous. You would have to have a dog who gets out (and trust me I have dogs that can get out more than most) then have your training fail then have a receptive other dog right there before you notice...

Yes it can happen, but I wouldn't call it easy...

Well I've not bred a dog in the traditional sense (as a hobby and selecting for genes and what not), no. But I've watched many dogs going at it in my job. When clients want us to AI a dog (as long as it's not like a bull dog or something) we always try to get the dogs to accept one another naturally first.

The majority of the time most bitches are receptive.

I imagine so.. but even with a receptive bitch its not normally instantaneous, esp if the dogs don't know each other. Canines have a courtship ritual which involves playing, play bowing and chasing before they ahhh get down to business.

Bounce was in heat at the national speciality. We won a new collar that day. She managed to slip out of it and do a few laps before she came back. She stopped to play bow at the males. None of the boys tried to instantly rape her, though a few of the experienced males postured back.

Granted I'm not sure of the full courtship ritual involved in dogs whom are strangers but I do know my dog can run a lot faster than I can and disappear from my sight a lot faster than it would take me to get to my car. So while he may not instantly jump on the nearest thing with a...opening, dependent on where he went and my luck in which streets to take, he'd still have plenty of time to introduce himself and buy her a meal.

But he's fixed so nothing can ever result from it.