What is "quality"?

[StealthDog]

Oh man, today was a day that got everyone's hackles raised in Nutrition. Mostly we talked about AAFCO and their labelling regulations, but we started discussing what the vet's role should be in discussing nutrition with clients. Is it appropriate for a vet to endorse a specific brand? Should they only offer veterinary diets, or should they offer maintainance diets too (or neither)? How should a vet respond if a client asks "What do you feed your pets?" There were sooo many different opinions. We also talked about by-products, and I was surprised when our professor said that can be as good, if not better, sources of nutrients than striated muscle. By-products get a bad rap because they are not the organs traditionally used for human consumption, but in many cultures, what we consider by-products are considered delicacies. Heart, lung, trachea, and liver (collectively called the pluck), rumen (tripe), thymus gland (sweetbread)... cheap because Americans don't generally eat them, but does that mean they are no good for our pets? I see "by-products" on the label, and don't think Winnie should eat them, but is that for my sake or hers? Where is there research showing by-products are bad or good?

Oh, this class makes my head hurt...

 

[showpug]

Oh man, today was a day that got everyone's hackles raised in Nutrition. Mostly we talked about AAFCO and their labelling regulations, but we started discussing what the vet's role should be in discussing nutrition with clients. Is it appropriate for a vet to endorse a specific brand? Should they only offer veterinary diets, or should they offer maintainance diets too (or neither)? How should a vet respond if a client asks "What do you feed your pets?" There were sooo many different opinions. We also talked about by-products, and I was surprised when our professor said that can be as good, if not better, sources of nutrients than striated muscle. By-products get a bad rap because they are not the organs traditionally used for human consumption, but in many cultures, what we consider by-products are considered delicacies. Heart, lung, trachea, and liver (collectively called the pluck), rumen (tripe), thymus gland (sweetbread)... cheap because Americans don't generally eat them, but does that mean they are no good for our pets? I see "by-products" on the label, and don't think Winnie should eat them, but is that for my sake or hers? Where is there research showing by-products are bad or good?

Oh, this class makes my head hurt...

Most of the by-products in pet foods aren't regulated. They can contain chemicals and floor sweepings most of the time. If the by-products were clean and regulated and we actually knew what they consisted of then no, they aren't a bad ingredient. Problem is, we don't. When I worked at the vet clinic, the Hills reps came in and gave us the exact same by-product speech that you got.

Read this:http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=ingrd

 

[StealthDog]

Most of the by-products in pet foods aren't regulated.

But who's to say that meat meals are well-regulated?

 

[Bobsk8]

But who's to say that meat meals are well-regulated?

That is what I can't for the life of me figure out. They are always praising foods with meat meals versus the actual meat, but can't anything be used in the meal as long as it comes from some part of the animal?

I found an article on what meat meal consists of.

Meat meal can contain the boiled down flesh of animals we would find unacceptable for consumption. This can include zoo animals, road kill, and 4-D (dead, diseased, disabled, dying) livestock. Most shockingly, this also can include dogs and cats. That's right, your pets could be cannibals. Fast Food Nation author Eric Schlosser writes, "Although leading American manufacturers promise never to put rendered pets into their pet food, it is still legal to do so. A Canadian company, Sanimal Inc., was putting 40,000 pounds of dead dogs and dead cats into its dog and cat food every week, until discontinuing the practice in June 2001. "This food is healthy and good," said the company's vice president of procurement, responding to critics, ''but some people don't like to see meat meal that contains any pets."

How roadkill ends up in Fido's food bowl
The process that turns these animals and animal parts into pet food is also disgusting. After all, it takes a lot to turn roadkill into something owners feel good about pouring into their pets' bowls. Ann M. Martin describes the process in Food Pets Die For: "At the rendering plant a machine slowly grinds the entire mess in huge vats. Then this product is cooked at temperatures between 220 degrees Fahrenheit and 270 degrees Fahrenheit for 20 minutes to one hour. The mixture is centrifuged (spun at a high speed) and the grease (or tallow) rises to the top and it is removed from the mixture. The grease becomes the source of animal fat in most pet foods. Oftentimes, when you open a standard can of dog food, you will see a top layer of fat. The centrifuged product is the source of that fat, which is meant to entice a hungry dog or cat. After the grease is removed in the rendering process, the remaining material is dried. Meat meal, and meat and bone meal are the end product of this process. This dried material is usually found in dry pet food."

Me, I will stick to the real thing and pass on the "meal"...


http://www.newstarget.com/012647.html

 

[shazbot]

Hey, I have never stated that NB should be used by everyone, I have said that I think it is a good food and for some reason there seems to be a stigma about mentioning that on this forum. Some people , when they read a postive comment about it, seem to get bent out of shape and post back rude comments like yours for instance...... Sorry I "annoy" you..... Incidentally I found your comment rather annoying and rude to boot , so I guess we are even.......opcorn: ha ha ha !!!!!

It's not that you say it should be used by everyone, it's that, that's all you give advice about. NB this, NB that, I feed natural balance and people here know it's a good food. But it does get old when you see the same advice over and over again

 

[showpug]

But who's to say that meat meals are well-regulated?

"MEAT" meals are different from say "Chicken meal" when the meat source of the meal is not specified that is where you can run into trouble. The difference between actual chicken and chicken meal is water. Chicken meal is the same as chicken meat but with the water removed. The reason why chicken meal is better then chicken meat is because it is denser. So, when chicken meat is listed as the first ingredient, it can claim to be the largest amount by weight in the food, but you are weighing water. With chicken meal you actually get more meat because the water is removed and it takes more actual meat to weigh more.

The poor quality comes in when it's just "meat meal" listed insted of "chicken meal" or "lamb meal" etc.

 

[DanL]

Reminds me of some TV show that had a fake commercial for "Vintage Farms Deli Loaf, made with real meat chunks".

 

[Bobsk8]

It's not that you say it should be used by everyone, it's that, that's all you give advice about. NB this, NB that, I feed natural balance and people here know it's a good food. But it does get old when you see the same advice over and over again

OK..... Don't feed NB..... Don't feed NB...., it's the worst food in the world.. My dog hates it.... Her coat is awful........ Happy now.....