tug as a reward

[SunnyNJazzy]

So my agility trainer wants me to get Mysti to be toy driven/use tug as a reward to help speed up my times. She's not slow by any means but by switching to toy reward instead of food reward will speed her up even more supposedly.

Training at home, and at a few random places I've gone to when I can she LOVES her tug toy(any toy for that matter), gets incredibly amped and DOES speed up alot. BUT, when I go to agility class she shuts down when I pull the toy out on course, totally ignores it and will wander off in search of treats and will only take treats as rewards (since I stupidly only used treats there since I started back in July).

Any suggestions on how to get her to enjoy tugging and make it exciting/fun at agility class? What toy do you use for tugging?

It seems like the more I try to "train to tug" the more she shuts down on it and I think I'm starting to put stress on it instead of keeping it fun... who knew tugging could be so complicated.

 

[Catsi]

Hi SunnynJazzy,

I would make the tug sessions very short. Get Mysti aroused, tug for a very short time even to just get her gripping and release. Leave her wanting more.

I think that maybe agility class is really over-stimulating for her to even think about wanting to tug right now. Can you move away from the action and find the threshold at which she will tug? Even if it's 100m away or more, or you have to do it behind your car... anywhere that you can get a good response. I'd still keep it short and highly aroused. I find when I add a lot of running games with Abby (notoriously selective tugger, starting to improve now), she is more highly aroused and able to tug. And just continue to build the value for this. I would not make it a long tugging session. Just get a grip, release, ask for another behaviour and/or go for a run, tug, release etc. Very short sessions. If Mysti can tug behind a tree, can she tug in front of the tree next time? Keep building value and slowly challenging her.

Also, there seems to be times when Abby naturally wants to tug... early morning, late evening, when I come home, when she is in a playful mood. I really try to utilise these times because then it's not like you are forcing the issue and getting nowhere.

I have a ball with a fluffy tail on the end and a fluffy rabbit that Abby seems to like, but I did fall into the trap of going through lots of toys to see what she liked. Now I am just trying to build value for the stuff I've got, because I found that she was just picking and choosing. 'I'm not playing with this today, try something else maybe my pink rabbit mum,' lol. She does seem to like stuff with fluffy bits. Good luck.

Edit - I think if Mysti already loves tugging at certain times and in certain places it's to do with the environment and value building rather than the tug toy itself.

 

[Sekah]

I had/have a similar issue with Cohen. She would tug okay at home, but as soon as we were in agility class she had zero interest in it and would only want to work for food. I did a lot of work asking for solid tugging for a food reward ("tug" is now a cue she understands and will oblige), and also met her half way and asked for tug in the room where we took agility, but when class wasn't on and the equipment was away. It's important that if she refuses the tug in this less stimulating environment don't give in and offer food instead. It's still a work in progress, but through babystepping we got it to an acceptable point.

If she won't tug in class, play short games before you do a piece of equipment/sequence/course. Hand touches, fun tricks, tag, engaging the opposition reflex, etc are all good ways to encourage a bit of extra speed when it counts.

 

[AdrianneIsabel]

I hope Sara sees this... I think she had to work hard but got Zuma from being non-toy to being tug crazy.

She may have some great advice.

 

[smeagle]

My dog's strongest drive is food drive, she's rarely interested in toys. I think sometimes the problem is that people use toys to build drive but don't know how to do the same with food, hence people thinking that you can only get good drive with a toy. IMO, in dog sports a dog working in food drive looks no different to a dog working in prey drive and if food is your dog's strongest drive then why not use that to your advantage? Like learning how to use a toy to build drive you need to learn how to use food to build drive. There's no reason a highly food driven dog can't be fast.

Having said that, if your dog goes nuts for toys at home but not at training then you just need to build their durability on the tug more slowly. How long are your tug sessions going for? To begin with keep them at 30-60 seconds at the most if that's as long as your dog can go for, always leave your dog wanting more - don't tug until they lose interest or become tired or bored. What kind of tug are you using? The wrong type of tug can easily put a dog off tugging if it's too wide for them to get their jaw around comfortably and they can't get a good grip or it's not a good surface for them to grip on.

How we use the tug makes a huge difference. I see SO many people who push the tug towards their dog and in the dog's face to try and get it to tug. Dogs have opposition reflex and pushing a tug towards them will turn them off. Think of the tug as a wild animal, a wild animal wouldn't jump in the dog's mouth, so the dog needs to chase and capture it to 'win' the tug.

I'd be taking her to heaps of random places and getting her to tug, if she doesn't engage, put her away so she doesn't get to train with you. Build the distractions gradually, build her desire for the tug so every time you bring it out she is desperate for it. Make her want it more than you want her to tug

 

[lizzybeth727]

A couple of ideas:

1. Practice using tug as a reward in lots of places. It's sometimes different for dogs to learn that tug is just a game, versus tug is something that happens when you do something right. Kind of like how many new dogs have to learn that "good behavior = treat," sometimes dogs have to learn that "good behavior = tug game." Start in less distracting environments, and progress to more distracting environments and places similar to the agility field.

2. Use the food drive, and teach her that tugging = treat. When she does a good behavior, pull out the tug and get her to play; when she's playing really well, have her drop the tug and give her lots of treats. So the sequence goes "good behavior -> tug -> treat." Eventually the tug will become more intrinsically reinforcing, because IT has been reinforced.

 

[SunnyNJazzy]

Thank you guys those are some great ideas I will totaly try them!! I started making her tug for treats and she's tugging a bit better even at home. I'll start adding new locations and distractions soon. Thanks!!

 

[adojrts]

A very good article from my trainer, Jess who is the 2010 FCI World Agility Champion

http://agiledogtraining.wordpress.com/2011/11/08/how-i-accidentally-trained-my-dog-not-to-tug/

 

[SunnyNJazzy]

Thank you adojrts! That article was spot on how I was feeling and the crate game idea is fabulous!