Speaking of dogs killing little animals.

[oriondw]

Was walking on our nightly patrol around the house, and saw 3 racooons in my garbage.


One of the racoons ended up with its back and rear legs being crushed.

I was suprised at how fast these little things can run though.

Also was first time i actually saw my pup make decisions on the fly. He went not for the closest one, but for the biggest one. Ended up being a female, think he killed the mother and 2 small racoons run away. Now they wont survive probably and wont mess on our property anymore.

Interesting, how did he know?

 

[smkie]

i would be careful letting him go after a raccoon. I have heard from pretty reliable sources that a raccoon knows how to grab on to the neck and they kick the bowels out of a dog. If you are careful how you dispose of your garbage you will not draw them to your home. What happened to the baby raccoon with the crushed legs? that is terribly sad.

 

[Amstaffer]

If you are careful how you dispose of your garbage you will not draw them to your home.

Right one here!!

Also....Raccoons can be very dangerous! They can rip out a dogs eyes very easily....Why risk it.

You might not of intended it but you dog has become a instrument of cruelty

 

[Renee750il]

Guys, while I don't like seeing any creature suffer, dogs like Orion's - and mine - are guardians and hunters. This is their nature and it is something we accept. Mine have had the advantage of being taught by Bimmer to kill quickly and that what is killed is to be eaten, not wasted, which is an advantage few dogs have.

A raccoon - like a groundhog or badger - can be a formidable foe for most dogs, but the herder/guardian molossers are well equipped to deal with much more dangerous predators. Can they be injured by a wily raccoon? Of course! But they aren't in the danger that a regular hunting breed or German Shepherd or Doberman would be.

All that said, it's still best to lock up the garbage in such a way that it doesn't draw raccoons. Why cause needless death and injury? And remember, where raccoons go, skunks follow!

 

[smkie]

if you add some bleach to your garbage bins..and have lids that are secure they raccoons will go somewhere else..plus i put bones inside a glass jar so that no animal has to risk having a punctured intestine.cooked bones are bad for everyone. We had to be careful of raccoons at the kennels. There was a creek directly behind and woods as well. The raccoons knew there was dog food there and once one got ahold of a lovely little pup. The pup must have suprised it when it was sniffing around the food pans. That was the only occurance we had where a raccoon killed a puppy. Hunters tend to love to tell stories tho and espeically to tender hearted kennel gurls that don't want to hear their dang stories in the first place..especially hunters that stand there with a raccoon pick working thier teeth if you know what i mean. I keep Victor leashed at night when i take him out because i wouldn't want him to suprise one and here there are so many.

 

[Amstaffer]

This is their nature and it is something we accept. Mine have had the advantage of being taught by Bimmer to kill quickly and that what is killed is to be eaten, not wasted, which is an advantage few dogs have.

Well my dogs were originally bred to kill other dogs......But I am sure not going to "accept" that.

A raccoon - like a groundhog or badger - can be a formidable foe for most dogs, but the herder/guardian molossers are well equipped to deal with much more dangerous predators. Can they be injured by a wily raccoon?

Well don't compare a badger to a raccoon, a raccoon is a tough opponent and has a excellent chance of blinding your dog but a Badger has an excellent chance of killing your dog...no matter your breed. My main point there is why risk it?

Why cause needless death and injury?

This is the whole point.

 

[Renee750il]

AmStaffer - there's a big difference between being bred to kill other dogs and being bred to guard herds and kill threats to those herds. My dogs are actually working farm dogs. Part of their job is to erradicate vermin. Groundhogs, badgers, etc. - even coyotes - are a real problem out here. Their burrows can be deadly to cattle. A cow or bull with a broken leg has to be put down. You have no idea how efficient these dogs are. Mine in particular were not only bred to deal with wild cattle, but to hunt jaguar and wild boar. I've seen them hunt. It does kind of turn my stomach, but I have to admire their sheer ability.

Orion's Ovcharka is a very similar creature. This is what they were born and bred to do. Yes, they will adapt to a life in the city quite well with the right people, but when they are in their element, they guard and they hunt. Mine are just fortunate to live in a place that is perfectly suited to their breeding.

 

[oriondw]

Just for clarification:

He killed the mother. All i heard was a crunch, no snapping sounds, so i assume it was 1 bite.

I dont even see what kind of threat these things are, if they die in one bite.

Ill try the garbage trick, it is better that they dont even come.

Amstaffer, i guess you've never seen a dog take out 3-4 wolves at the same time. Or even upto 10 cayotee's. Trust me, dogs like that exist, only you dont see very many of them in America.

Are you serious about badgers killing a dog? Dont make me laugh, a friends Caucasian used to hunt and kill those for all the time when he roamed their property.

 

[Amstaffer]

Just for clarification:

I dont even see what kind of threat these things are, if they die in one bite.

One lucky bite? They can remove an eye in one swipe. Coon hunters in the United States lose dogs to raccoons... it happens. They especially like to lure the dog into the water, climb on their head and drown them. Maybe the raccoon you are talking about is a different, smaller species.

Amstaffer, i guess you've never seen a dog take out 3-4 wolves at the same time. Or even upto 10 cayotee's. Trust me, dogs like that exist, only you dont see very many of them in America..

This is almost laughable. Where are you from? There is no dog alive that can kill 4 wolves at a time! Four Timberwolves have killed a young adult Grizzly Bear! Maybe you speak of some pygmy species of Wolf I have never heard of (unlikely) or maybe unguarded wolf pups.

Are you serious about badgers killing a dog? Dont make me laugh, a friends Caucasian used to hunt and kill those for all the time when he roamed their property.

When I speak of Badgers I am talking about the Midwestern American Badger. They will run under a dog and disembowel fairly quickly.

 

[oriondw]

One lucky bite? They can remove an eye in one swipe. Coon hunters in the United States lose dogs to raccoons... it happens. They especially like to lure the dog into the water, climb on their head and drown them. Maybe the raccoon you are talking about is a different, smaller species.

Nothing to do with luck, everything to do with precision heavy strikes these dogs are famous for.

This is almost laughable. Where are you from? There is no dog alive that can kill 4 wolves at a time! Four Timberwolves have killed a young adult Grizzly Bear! Maybe you speak of some pygmy species of Wolf I have never heard of (unlikely) or maybe unguarded wolf pups.

Im from Russia. From what you wrote, it seems you have very little experience with anything but bull breeds. I will ignore this statement for now.

When I speak of Badgers I am talking about the Midwestern American Badger. They will run under a dog and disembowel fairly quickly.

I dont know how to say this, but that is very very unlikely to happen with these dogs


It seems you have a very limited knowledge of dogs in general and especially poor knowledge of breeds such as mine and Rene's.

 

[Amstaffer]

It seems you have a very limited knowledge of dogs in general and especially poor knowledge of breeds such as mine and Rene's.

Wow, lets be real. I was trying hard to be nice but you statement that your dog or any dog alive can kill 4 wolves at one time is as stupid a thing as I have ever heard. When I said it was almost laughable I was being nice. What did I say that would validate your statement that I don't know much about dogs?

Dogs are not smart enough or strong enough to match two healthy wolves let alone 4. You question my knowledge of dogs and you spout this foolish bragging....that is truly laughable.

Do I know about every Russian breed of Dog? no, but I am very well versed in nearly every breed in AKC and other western European breeds. I am also somewhat versed in Japanese breeds. I also have some knowledge of South American breeds.

Most dog breeds in the world that I am not knowledgeable in, are just variations or very similar to the dogs I am into. You Wolf killers are probably very similar to the Kuvaz or Anatolian Shepard dog. Neither of those dogs are meant to enter one on one combat with wolves, they are meant to sound alarm and challenge the wolf while help arrives.

Most Shepard dogs are bred to stay with the flock and not fight the wolf for two reasons first of all the wolf would just kill it and the more intelligent (larger brain) wolf would lure the Shepard dog away while teammates clean up.

I hope your dog never comes across wolves with out the assistance of Humans....don't under estimate the wolf. The Russian Wolf (Gray Wolf) is the same Species as the Timber wolf (Gray Wolf) are the same species and are truly skillful killer.

 

[Amstaffer]

I just looked up your dog and it is bigger than a Kuvaz or Ant. Shep....looks like a Tibetian Mastiff. But size is not the issue. Actually size maybe be a hinder than a helper.

 

[EliNHunter]

Wow, lets be real. I was trying hard to be nice but you statement that your dog or any dog alive can kill 4 wolves at one time is as stupid a thing as I have ever heard. When I said it was almost laughable I was being nice. You question my knowledge of dogs and you spout this foolish bragging....that is truly laughable.

Amstaffer -- why are most of your posts so condescending and nasty? I know of your proverbial stirring of the pot ways, but it's really not appreciated or necessary. Please tone it down. Thanks.

 

[Amstaffer]

Amstaffer -- why are most of your posts so condescending and nasty? I know of your proverbial stirring of the pot ways, but it's really not appreciated or necessary. Please tone it down. Thanks.

I was the one attacked....does it sound feasible to you that a dog of any breed could kill 4 wolves?...come on!

Most of my posts? could you give examples? Beside this case I don't believe I have been condescending or nasty.

How have I Stirred any pots?

Please PM with examples I think I have been friendly and nice in everyother post on this forum.

 

[EliNHunter]

I was the one attacked....does it sound feasible to you that a dog of any breed could kill 4 wolves?...come on!

Most of my posts? could you give examples? Beside this case I don't believe I have been condescending or nasty.

How have I Stirred any pots?

Please PM with examples I think I have been friendly and nice in everyother post on this forum.

Amstaffer -- I publically apologize to you. I think I got you mixed up with another poster which is what I mentioned above. This thread started to seem a bit heated and I thought it was that person, again. I'm sorry

 

[Amstaffer]

Whew....I thought I was going crazy.

No problem, I should have been a little nicer on this thread but it just got my dander up.

 

[EliNHunter]

Whew....I thought I was going crazy.

No problem, I should have been a little nicer on this thread but it just got my dander up.

P.S. Your dogs are cute!

 

[Amstaffer]

Thanks

Its not the best picture of them but when I caught Sal with his tongue out I knew it was going to be my favorite picture.

 

[Stanna]

Amstaffer has always been pretty polite and reasonable. He seems to advocate a distate for threads that promote breed pissing contests, is all.

 

[oriondw]

Most dog breeds in the world that I am not knowledgeable in, are just variations or very similar to the dogs I am into. You Wolf killers are probably very similar to the Kuvaz or Anatolian Shepard dog. Neither of those dogs are meant to enter one on one combat with wolves, they are meant to sound alarm and challenge the wolf while help arrives.

Caucasians were bred to neutralize threats that got onto their territory, not scare them away. Meaning they were bred to kill wolves and anything else that was a threat.

The only thing similar to a Caucasian is a Central Asian, some people consider them the same breed only different sub groups. They look and act very similarly, Caucasians are usually bigger and more explosive though.

Yes all dogs are variations of each other Even the original breeds themselves.

Most Shepard dogs are bred to stay with the flock and not fight the wolf for two reasons first of all the wolf would just kill it and the more intelligent (larger brain) wolf would lure the Shepard dog away while teammates clean up.

Caucasians are not shepard dogs, they do not herd anyone. Caucasians are there to protect the herd, there is usually a few guarding a herd. Usually roaming the territory mingling inbetween and afar from herd.

Trust me on this, I have alot more expriences with these dogs then you do, or ever will. Why do you try and debunk what I say when you clearly have no knowlegde of how this breed even works.

I hope your dog never comes across wolves with out the assistance of Humans....don't under estimate the wolf. The Russian Wolf (Gray Wolf) is the same Species as the Timber wolf (Gray Wolf) are the same species and are truly skillful killer.

I know very well the capability of wolves as well as capability of my breed. Why do you get so heated by the idea of someone's dog being able to kill wolves. I dont understand your position.