School will give boy's dog a tryout

Discussion in 'Dog News and Articles' started by Sweet72947, Jan 6, 2011.

  1. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Messages:
    10,234
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    :eek:


    :eek:


    :yikes:

    There are no words. What reputable organization would place an unaltered bitch as a service dog with a CHILD!?!

    *MEGAFACEPALM*

    This actually kinda makes me want to cry. Strider is still intact. I was worried about whether he'd be able to work while Kaia is in season, and ready to swoop in and have his huevos amputated if it affected his ability to work, because she is staying intact.

    She's two days into standing heat as of today. He has been a PERFECT ANGEL. No whining, no fussing, no marking, no not listening. Honestly, he's been much more attentive and obedient, in that he jumps to obey commands faster than usual. He's done his alerts perfectly, even with her whining and flagging in the next room. Moxie suggested that maybe he thinks if he listens super well, I'll let him have her. :rofl1: When I expressed my worries to the trainer that mentored us, she laughed and said that if we keep him intact we'll only be working with half his brain at any given time and so far that had been plenty. When he's around a girl in season, only a quarter, but that he was a smart enough dog a quarter would be plenty. So far she is right. :)

    It probably helped that we dragged him down to Moxie's place and put him in a downstay while having the leashed collie bitches jump over him while they were in heat. :D
     
  2. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I know someone who had an intact male as an SD and had two unaltered bitches (not SDs) at the same time. Dog was perfect.

    I was a little worried about Logan, but I do bring home "dog in heat" smells all the time (we do a lot of AI stuff at work) and so far, he doesn't care. He's also been in the kennel with a dog in heat in the next run over (solid walls between them) and wasn't all too interested. So I don't think it'll be a big issue. I'm sure once I move we can test him, too ;)
     
  3. lizzybeth727

    lizzybeth727 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    6,403
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Two dogs, three cats
    Location:
    Central Texas
    Oh yeah, AND, Assistance Dogs International, the accreditating organization that certifies assistance dog training organizations, has as one of its guidelines that organizations cannot place intact dogs as working dogs. Plus, you know, there's the whole COMMON SENSE thing that says you shouldn't place them with CHILDREN (and then fight for that child's rights to have the dog in SCHOOL with him without an adult handler), but whatever.
     
  4. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Messages:
    10,234
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    Really? I wonder if they'll decide to yank that org's accreditation now.
     
  5. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I doubt it. ADI's not really good at enforcing their rules.
     
  6. stardogs

    stardogs Behavior Nerd

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,925
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    2 dogs, 1 cat
    Location:
    NC
    Home Page:
    I did some sleuthing too and the dog's breeder has several complaints about dogs with congenital heart and other chronic conditions - so much for the claim that she's from valuable lines...Even more reason for her to be spayed imo.
     
  7. motherofmany

    motherofmany Clicker Extremist

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    When the little guy walks his bitch in heat past the wrong dog, what then?

    In theory I love the idea of special needs kids having SDs. After watching a PBS special on it (probably the same one a poster mentioned earlier) I became a little more..um...skeptical of the S part although the comfort aspect still seems to have value. IMO. YMMV.
     
  8. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Comfort alone does not make an SD and SD. I'm all for kids having pets or skilled companion dogs, disability or not. But for the most part, not SDs. I thought this kid and this dog was different. But no.

    And the "trainer" of this dog has come to the SD forum I'm on looking for trouble :rolleyes:
     
  9. motherofmany

    motherofmany Clicker Extremist

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Oh I get that. Completely agree too. But I think the term SD has been loosely used for a while now which in the long run is going to cause major problems for true, serious, working SD's.

    Which I don't think this dog is. (gonna get railed for this comment I suspect)
     
  10. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Messages:
    10,234
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    You won't get railed. A service dog is only legally a service dog if it performs trained tasks to mitigate its handler's disability. It's recommended you train at least 3 tasks in case the validity of your dog's working status is ever challenged in court.

    There are too many cases of people claiming to have service dogs with them when in truth they are just pets, or Emotional Support Animals (basically there for comfort). I believe ESAs have housing rights, at least in section 8 housing (correct me if I'm wrong someone), but they do not have access rights to public places like service dogs do.

    Alerting is not considered a task BTW. You can't train it. It's a behavior the dog either does or doesn't do on its own. And no dogs are 100% reliable at alerting. They're valuable because you can't train it, but they also need to be trained other mitigating tasks to be legally considered a service dog along with public access behavior.

    ETA: I suspect this dog probably does fit the legal definition of service dog. At the very least, the card swiping task is a legitimate task. Though, I'm pretty disturbed that she didn't do it during the TV interview.

    ETAETA: The fines are pretty stiff for people with imposter SDs, if they get caught. The hard part is catching them. I think it's something like a $20,000 fine?
     
  11. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Romy's spot on.

    ESAs have access rights only in housing, and only in housing covered by the Fair housing Act. So not in single-family homes. Gavroche is my ESA, and we lived in a no-pets apartment for 7 months. ESAs can also fly in the cabin of an airplane, under the Air Carrier Access Act (I think that's what it's called).

    There are some places that give ESAs public access. I believe some parts of California, and possible some parts of Washington and Oregon. But it's local or state laws, and the dogs don't have access anywhere else. And of course it's never really the dog that has access, it's the PWD/handler that has access with the dog.

    There are far too many people out there claiming their dogs are SDs and they aren't. Some are well-mannered, but some are terribly untrained, even aggressive. Sadly, many of them are PSDs (psychiatric service dogs) which makes it that much harder for legitimate teams to go places unhassled. Airports can ask for a doctor's note to confirm a PSD is actually an SD (same goes for ESAs). It's a shame they discriminate that way, but we have fakers and huggers to thank for it. (BTW, the SD forum I go to "fakers" are people who are not disabled and say their dog is an SD to get it to fly for free in cabin, take it everywhere, stay in no-pet hotels, etc. and "huggers" are people who really are disabled but their dogs aren't task trained.)

    I think ultimately, national certification will take place, and I think we're getting closer and closer to that point. But the logistics of it in such a large country are quite the headache. I guess all we can do is wait and see.
     
  12. lizzybeth727

    lizzybeth727 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    6,403
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Two dogs, three cats
    Location:
    Central Texas
    Did he mention why, in three years, he couldn't train that other dog to sit?

    I believe that this organization is probably not accredited. Accreditation is a long and time-consuming process, they come out for a site visit and look at ALL your procedures - training, safety, EVERYTHING - it's a major pain in the neck. Plus I think there are yearly dues.... not sure about that. Anyway, I wouldn't ever suggest someone go to an organization that's NOT ADI accredited, because accreditation really does show that you've got your ducks in a row; and because there are enough organizations out there that ARE ADI accredited, that if you want a dog and can take care of a dog, it shouldn't be that difficult to find one.

    The website of the organization says that the dogs are "West German Show Line German Shepherds".... sounds like a sales pitch to me. :rolleyes:

    I agree, national certification will happen, it's just a matter of when. I think it'll make it more difficult for people who train their own SDs... but opefully they can find a way to make it work. It's really unfortunate that it's coming to this. :(
     
  13. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I am BEYOND pissed right now. Apparently this dog DID INDEED GO TO SCHOOL TODAY! IN HEAT AND ALL!!!!!

    *headdesk*
     
  14. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Oh, and the dog comes from schutzhund lines. Trainer won't say if she's had any bite work, but she has been trained through BH (schutzhund obedience). Granted a dog being from schutzhund lines doesn't automatically disqualify it as an SD, but bite work certainly would. I'd also not try to place a dog from such lines with a CHILD.
     
  15. lizzybeth727

    lizzybeth727 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    6,403
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    Two dogs, three cats
    Location:
    Central Texas
    I..... just..... have no words......

    *cries*
     

Share This Page