Q - Raw Rec. Bones a substitute for dental care, vs. 10% RMBs in Daily Diet

[Crowsfeet]

I recently had a discussion with my boyfriend about recreational bones and including RMBs in my dog's raw diet. I may be able to start Happy on raw again, we're sort of figuring out how to go about it.. the last time I tried, I was doing it without very much balance and probably in a pretty bad way. Too much fat, too much bone, not nearly enough variety, etc. Anyway..


So, my boyfriend is concerned about Happy's stool. I want to feed Happy the classic 10% Organs, 10% RMBs, and 80% meat. So, hypothetically, 10% Chicken liver, 10% turkey necks, 80% beef tongue, or whatever, I know you guys understand. The concern is that Happy will have processing issues with the bone, he's afraid there will be chunks of bone in his stool. This did actually happen before, there were tiny shards of bone in Happy's stool, which makes me feel like I was doing something very wrong- that is unusual, isn't it? I thought bone was supposed to be fully digested, giving stool that sort of grayish calcium-like quality from time to time. (Happy has visited the vet since, and is doing well, by the way).

What Chris, my boyfriend suggested, is that we feed Happy ground raw(including bone, of course) daily, and offer a recreational bone(maybe like a lamb shank, or hooves or something) to him at all times, as well, for his dental benefit.

My argument, was that a rec. bone wouldn't at all provide the dental care that RMBs would provide. Not only do dogs chew rec. bones in a different manner(I'm picturing canines dragging/scraping along the shaft/sides of a rec bone, where as in processing a turkey neck/RMB, a dog would have to use their entire mouth, breaking the bones down into smaller pieces which have contact with all of the teeth, and the whole of the mouth gets a work out, jaw and all). As well, if we include the correct ratio of RMBs, and are sure to use bones that will easily be processed(I was thinking fish bones, chicken and turkey necks, maybe some ox or rabbit if the opportunity arises) hopefully Hap' won't have any issues with his stool whatsoever.

If anybody could present me with some information to add to this debate, I would really appreciate it. I would really like to make sure I do this the right way, this time around.

Thank you!

 

[BabyDane]

I wouldn't feed ground meat and bone in replacement of RMB's. You lose the dental benefit (which is one of the biggest perks) and you also lose the enjoyment your dog will get by gnawing on bones.

It IS normal to see bone shards in their stool in the beginning, you weren't doing anything wrong in that department. It takes a good few months for dog's digestive systems to become adjusted to eating raw bones fully and capable of digesting bones completely. Even a well adjusted raw eating dog will have the occasional bone fragment in their stool. We have been raw feeding for years and still see them occasionally. Our dogs are to the point where they could swallow a whole chicken thigh bone whole and it would be digested, which is NOT something a newbie raw eater is capable of doing. I don't think your boyfriend needs to worry about this, although most new raw feeders do worry about bones. Its just a normal thing to the transition and not something to worry about. With time you and your boyfriend will see that it is normal and not a concern.

From what you said about what you plan to feed, it sounds to me that it would be balanced, but you might need to add in more bone. Just turkey necks is probably not enough bone. I would highly recommend feeding bone in chicken for the first two weeks and nothing but that. Then start adding in some turkey the third and fourth week. Then add in the beef tongue WITH a bone in meal. Don't start feeding the organs until about 2 months into the transition because they are very rich and can cause your dog to back track some. Add organ meats in slowly and gradually.

Here is a "getting started" guide I wrote up which I recommend you follow. Good luck!

How to get started | Prey Model Raw

 

[PlottMom]

Daisy had the shards of bone when I first started her, and it resulted in bloody diarrhea, a trip to a horrid vet who told me I was killing my dog by rawfeeding, and much panic on my part.

Another raw group I belong to suggested soaking her bone-in food in apple cider vinegar for a few hours before feeding, in order to help along the process of changing the pH in her tummy. Did that for a week or two, it worked, and I've never looked back.

 

[Doberluv]

Great article BabyDane! I appreciate your posting it.

 

[Crowsfeet]

I definitely appreciate it too - it sounds really solid

And Plottman, that sounds like a really great tip! I'll keep all of these awesome info in mind

 

[RawFedDogs]

So, my boyfriend is concerned about Happy's stool. I want to feed Happy the classic 10% Organs, 10% RMBs, and 80% meat. So, hypothetically, 10% Chicken liver, 10% turkey necks, 80% beef tongue, or whatever, I know you guys understand.

I think you misunderstand the concept. The ratio many people shoot for is 80% meat, 10% BONE and 10% organs. It's NOT 10% RMB's. It's 10% total bone. Feeding like you want to will almost guarantee soft mushy stools. Not enough bone and bone solidifies stools.

With that said, I think its pretty useless to worry a lot about percentages and ratios. Feed meat, bones, and organs from a variety of animals. Mostly meat, some bone, and some organs. Exact percentages matter little. In the wild, I"m sure dogs/wolves don't measure so precisely. If you feed a variety of animal parts from a variety of animals, nature will balance everything out automatically.

The concern is that Happy will have processing issues with the bone, he's afraid there will be chunks of bone in his stool.

There will be bones in his stools for a while. Don't worry about them. It happens to every dog when first switched.

You are right. Ground is not the way to go. Dogs have built in grinders that work very well and have for millions of years. Check out my web page for my suggestions on beginning raw feeding. Skylar, Zack, and Abby on the WEB

Remember that switching a dog to a raw diet is a process. Don't try to shortcut the process and you will have minimum digestive difficulty. Very few of the dogs I have switched had diarrhea or even soft stools as long as they followed my recommendations exactly. Good luck.