One step forward yesterday, one step back today

[Chewbecca]

Smkie,
No we don't have such a place. We don't even have a dog park here.

But I walk Ella on my street in front of my house. I know who has what dogs and usually when those dogs will be out.
This dog probably got out of its house and started wandering.

But it's not like Ella was like, "OH HEY THERE MISTER LAB, COME SAY TO ME!!!"
She was letting that lab know not to come any closer.
And the lab did.

I walk defensively, and Ella has a right to walk defensively, too, when an unknown, RUDE dog gets up in her face.

WHY OH WHY is the rude behavior excused, but the fact that my dog is dog aggressive, ISN'T??
WHY?

What if I just took "dog aggressive" out of the description of Ella and just simply said that Ella doesn't like dogs getting up in her face?
You know what? I bet that would change the defense for this rude off leash dog.

 

[jess2416]

not much to add, but GOOD LORD....

*sigh* sorry becca

 

[Paige]

I hate this too and my dogs are always leashed in public places. Gosh darn it keep your dogs away from mine.

All three of my dogs are friendly too and love playing with other dogs. I don't care though because they aren't so friendly when they are leashed. Not saying they're going to eat your dog but they don't want to cuddle with it.

 

[Kayla]

Hugs and half Becca- Duke and I have been dealing with the similar scenerio that you have with Ella his whole life- it is not fun, but you can do it your doing AMAZING with the cat, your post has inspired me to try it with Duke as even though he is know managable I think Cat is the final step to address the root cause.

Addressing the stigma of a muzzle, in Europe it is fairly common so people there may not react the same way as they do here, with all of the bs media reports a muzzle pretty much screams " I would tear you apart if this wasnt on my face". Can we change that- maybe if a big enough public campaign was started sure- but realistically owners of DA, reactive, fear aggressive- whatever type dogs are facing a very unique problem- you should not judge what you have never experinced, or as the saying goes, have walked in those shoes.

It takes so much strength to address these issues, deal with the utter disapointment and heart break when you were making progress and then have a degression.

Im soo glad to hear you and Ella are okay Duke sends lots of kisses to Ella because he knows how scary it is when big rude dogs invade his personal space.

I used a head halter the whole time I worked with Duke, lots of control, but worst case scenerio he could defend himself and me.


Just because everyone is sharing stories of dealing with such experinces the WORST incident I have ever had occur in regard to an irresponsible owner that would have left MY dog on the blame end for defending me, my friend and his best dog friend occured one night awhile back. All mentoned above ( Duke, my friend, her dog which is Dukes best friend) were walking down the street, out of nowhere I hear screaming, panting and dog tags) my super reactive dog owner ears perk up and I stop. Ahead, my next door neighbour is being pulled down the street by her dog, it's snarling panting and heading straight for us. In that moment I had to make a terrible decision- Do I a) stay there and let Duke defend me, my friend and her dog- who is only 45lbs or b) remind myself my dog has the power to inflict serious damage and a severe fear of other dogs and if left in that situation would not only seriously hurt the other dog, but would also get signifigantly worse after 15 months of work with him and then possible face legal complications because of the laws in my area.

I had to choose to stand aside while my friend kicked the dog in the face as hard as she could and we both screamed at the owner to get her dog away from us right now or I would let Duke ( who was now straining as hard as he could wimpering and barking) attack her dog.

But lets face it who would be blamed at the end of the day, around here the story would have been spinned, rottweiler mix attacks elderly lady and golden retriever, even though that's certainly not the way it went down.

 

[noludoru]

I know, right?
Let's create new things because people won't follow laws.
Let's spend the money building a public facility where dogs can be safely walked ON leash, instead of using that money to find ways to ENFORCE existing leash laws.

Yes, I think that is an excellent idea!

Around here it isnt an issue. WE don't have breed bans.

What now? What do breed bans have to do with this? Did I miss a few posts....? If you're talking about the problem of loose dogs, you have already stated multiple times that you DO have that problem.

THere are laws for the roads too, and people break those constantly thus there are accidents. Your suppose to drive defensively

She does. Leash. Pepper spray. Always being prepared.

What YOU are suggesting is that she not "drive" at all and that she needs to find a place where she can "drive" safely.. all because of the other idiotic drivers. She has a right to be out on the sidewalks, too.

 

[Bahamutt99]

IF i had a dog such as yours i would be scoping out someplace i could go.

Seriously, though, why should she have to? In my situation, I'm between a rock and a hard place. I don't have access to a car most of the time, and the nearest town with any kind of park is a 20-minute trip down the highway. I walk on the road that runs past my house. If someone told me to get off my own street and walk elsewhere because they were afraid of my leashed dog whooping on theirs, I'd tell them to stuff it. I'm not going to get in my car and drive around burning precious gas looking for a unicorn. (By unicorn, I mean just that. Safe haven free from obnoxious off-leash dogs. Something that doesn't exist.)

I do believe there is a certain measure of personal responsibility when you own a hot dog, or any other dog for that matter. You use your noggin. But you shouldn't be driven out of every area that you decide to walk in just to make life easier for others.

 

[Bahamutt99]

Another point. If these dogs are running into the street, it's a fair bet they're running into neighbors' yards, too. When I had two very hot big dogs, and my neighbors had about a half dozen nasty toy poodles, I used to go above and beyond to be considerate. I always peeped in their yard before letting my dogs out. They, in turn, kept "accidentally" letting their dogs out, and they'd charge the fence, or go out in the front yard and antagonize our dogs at the gate. So here we have an example of how you're not even safe in your own home from loose dogs, and no doubt some would have suggested that I walk my dogs on leash in their fenced yard, to keep them from participating. But how on earth is that fair? How far should we have to go to protect those who have no interest in protecting their own animals? (Those same people had an all-the-time "accidentally" getting-out cat that ended up buying it in our yard, as we always feared it would. It's a crying shame when people wont quit making excuses, and their animals pay the price.)

 

[Miakoda]

THere are laws for the roads too, and people break those constantly thus there are accidents.

Is it really an accident when you are blantantly disobeying the law by speeding and then end up slamming into th rear end of someone? Or when you try to pass someone in a no-passing zone and hit someone head on? Or how about in my husband's friend's case, when a drunk driver veered out of his line and hit their minivan head on killing their 8-year-old daughter. Was that an "accident"? No freaking way.

Again, it's nothing but excuses.

And I'm sorry, but if some smiling kid comes running up to my son and decks him in the face, I can honestly say that it wasn't my son's fault for just minding his own business and walking down the street. Nor would I expect my son to just come on home with his head hanging. That's what your telling us is ok in the canine world.

 

[ihartgonzo]

I'm sorry, too, Becca. =(

Anyone who tells you (or hints) that your wonderful dog who you work so hard to desensitize, control, and even MAKE leashes to keep her safe and secure, should be locked behind closed doors, muzzled, and never see the light of day all for the convenience of irresponsible, reckless dog owners... well, tell them to SUCK IT.

Hey, I have an idea! Since off-leash dogs are at an incredibly high risk of being hit by a car... let's stop driving in our nieghborhoods. Park outside of the neighborhood, and walk home. And since riding bikes/scooters/skateboards is very tempting for off-leash dogs to chase and bite at, go somewhere else to exercise! Yeah. It would just be too risky with off-leash dogs running the streets, and it's way too much to expect people to follows laws and keep their dogs contained.

 

[elegy]

So here we have an example of how you're not even safe in your own home from loose dogs, and no doubt some would have suggested that I walk my dogs on leash in their fenced yard, to keep them from participating. But how on earth is that fair?

fair? surely you ask for too much.

my neighbors who tie their lab/pit mix out without supervision allowed her to dig under my six foot high wooden privacy fence with the gate that can only be unlatched from the inside. the fence that i built as soon as i moved in so as to keep my dogs safely enclosed.

fortunately nothing came of it, but it pissed me the hell off. especially when she did it multiple times.

now they tie the dog out front, and it dug up the end of my garden.

this is the dog that he allows to roam offleash when he's outside, paying no attention to her. she goes to the bathroom in my yard, runs across the street and craps in those peoples' yards, doesn't come when called, runs up in other dogs' faces. i told him point blank that if she runs up in my dogs' faces they'll attack her. he looked all horrified but of course it didn't change his behavior at all.

 

[smkie]

I was only trying to offer an idea where you could walk in peace, wasn't that you didn't have the right to walk down your sidewalk. I thought about the elkhound kennel and how i saw they had a gated pathway for dogs. Sorry for making the suggestion. I seriously doubt you could take 5 dogs owners and have them all say they never had a dog get out at least one time. IF i came here and vented about every dog we ran across i would be doing nothing but. IT was merely an idea about what might be out there, i had no idea that kennel had this until i took a friend there to drop of their dog. I thought it was nice and wished more communities had just that.Sorry for making the suggestion. I would certainly not muzzle my dog anymore then i would declaw a cat.

 

[Chewbecca]

The difference between you ranting about every dog you come across that is off leash, and me ranting about an off leash dog that rushed into my dog's face is:
Your dogs like other dogs, my dog doesn't.

 

[smkie]

wish i could think of something that would help.

 

[Dekka]

ONyx was something else. I have broken up so many fights, as i did with Ollie and VIctor at the party, i target the aggressor and turn loose of the other. i don't reach in with my hands but use a body block and like Mary push my way to safety. Not that i advise that to anyone else, it is just what works for me. I would much rather be bit in the leg then through the hand. Which i have had happen enough to learn my hands are the last thing i will put into a dog fight. I broke up one where the tooth went inbetween my second and third finger where they join my hand resulting in torn tendons, and inside and outside stitches. WHen Garg and Bronki got in a fight and Garg had Bronki by the throat i dropped my weight on GARg and pinned him to the floor which forced him to turn loose of Bronki and gave bronki time to get to a safe zone which he had enough sense to do. BY that time i had garg contained. Dog fights scare me to death.

They should scare you, they should scare anyone.

Your method would not work with dogs who were both in on it. I am glad that has worked for you. Unfortunately in a 'real' dog fight, where dogs are seriously into it, if you pin one the other one will keep going. (its like they think you are on their side)

Most serious fights I have seen/had to deal with the issue is getting them to let go. I have no qualms about sticking my hands near most of my dogs even when they are aroused. (the still know what is me and what is the other dog) but I too would not be so keen on sticking my hands near other dogs. This is why if I lived in town I would carry pepper spray.