Fila Owners (questions, what else?)
- Thread starter noludoru
- Start date
I am from Brazil. My family are working ranchers, I have been around Fila's my whole life. I can tell you a Fila will attack and kill an intruder without hesitation.
A Fila does not tolerate strangers of any kind. If your dog does, it is not a Fila.
A Fila cannot be touched by anyone it does not live with. If your dog can you do not have a Fila.
A Fila will react on it's own with extreme velocity. Fila always attack low then lunge upward tward the neck. They do not reach to grab a limb. They attack to eliminate the opponent. If your dog does not do this, you do not own a Fila.
Fila's are happiest in a rual setting where they are kept away from outsiders. A Fila in the home can be dangerous and they must always be put in a seperate room away from strangers.
A Stranger is anyone outside of the Fila's direct circle.
I have owned many Fila's and my family have had Fila for over three generations. I doubt many have more hands on experiance than I.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
A Fila does not tolerate strangers of any kind. If your dog does, it is not a Fila.
A Fila cannot be touched by anyone it does not live with. If your dog can you do not have a Fila.
A Fila will react on it's own with extreme velocity. Fila always attack low then lunge upward tward the neck. They do not reach to grab a limb. They attack to eliminate the opponent. If your dog does not do this, you do not own a Fila.
Fila's are happiest in a rual setting where they are kept away from outsiders. A Fila in the home can be dangerous and they must always be put in a seperate room away from strangers.
A Stranger is anyone outside of the Fila's direct circle.
I have owned many Fila's and my family have had Fila for over three generations. I doubt many have more hands on experiance than I.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
And would you be the same Nestor Costa who lectures on dream interpretation in Jungian psychology?
I'd be quite interested in learning more about you, your operation and your dogs.
I am also curious as to how a dog who only "attacks" to the trunk and neck can be so historically acclaimed for slave retrieval AND for removing weapons from the hands of would-be attackers?
Or would you be a name being used by HofJ to continue his perfidy?
I'd be quite interested in learning more about you, your operation and your dogs.
I am also curious as to how a dog who only "attacks" to the trunk and neck can be so historically acclaimed for slave retrieval AND for removing weapons from the hands of would-be attackers?
Or would you be a name being used by HofJ to continue his perfidy?
I am sorry that I am not who youspeak of. I am a simple software engineer from Brazil now living in USA.I do not at this time own Fila as I live in a city apartment. Right now I own Dogo Brasil, a much better dog for the city. Fila are still in my family on ranches and farms. That is where they are most suited.
As far as Fila and retrevial of slaves I am afraid much of this is romance designed to sell Fila. Fila have been used on plantations and ranches for centuries. In the case of slaves runaway slaves that where killed or injured by the dogs would be used as an example to others. They would not knock down and hold like a Bullmastiff. Fila is much more devestating and effective in attack. I do hope I have answered your questions.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
As far as Fila and retrevial of slaves I am afraid much of this is romance designed to sell Fila. Fila have been used on plantations and ranches for centuries. In the case of slaves runaway slaves that where killed or injured by the dogs would be used as an example to others. They would not knock down and hold like a Bullmastiff. Fila is much more devestating and effective in attack. I do hope I have answered your questions.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
Thank you, Nestor.
In the antebellum south, here, plantation owners, particularly in the Louisiana area, brought Fila from Brazil to help them. They found them very good for retrieving slaves, as the dogs could not only track and catch, but would hold the slaves without damaging them so that they could not work. Ugly, but a part of history.
Even today, one of the state penitentiaries in Louisiana breeds their lines of Fila to assist in running the prison.
Not enough credit is given to these dogs, all too often, for their sharp intelligence and ability to use good, sound judgement. I have seen Fila here who were never exposed to the outside world who were unable to function around anyone they did not know. I have also known (and had) dogs from the same lines who were exposed to the world around them at an early age and learned to judge the actions of people around them, and while not 'friendly' to all, are able to function and even seem to enjoy being out in the world.
They are so in tuned to their people that they do pick up on what we expect of them and act accordingly. Mine's demeanor also changes drastically according to where we are and what time of day or night it is. And there are very, very few people I turn my back on her with!
Now Shiva, our other Fila, is from Brazillian show lines, and her temperament is, well, she likes attention
In the antebellum south, here, plantation owners, particularly in the Louisiana area, brought Fila from Brazil to help them. They found them very good for retrieving slaves, as the dogs could not only track and catch, but would hold the slaves without damaging them so that they could not work. Ugly, but a part of history.
Even today, one of the state penitentiaries in Louisiana breeds their lines of Fila to assist in running the prison.
Not enough credit is given to these dogs, all too often, for their sharp intelligence and ability to use good, sound judgement. I have seen Fila here who were never exposed to the outside world who were unable to function around anyone they did not know. I have also known (and had) dogs from the same lines who were exposed to the world around them at an early age and learned to judge the actions of people around them, and while not 'friendly' to all, are able to function and even seem to enjoy being out in the world.
They are so in tuned to their people that they do pick up on what we expect of them and act accordingly. Mine's demeanor also changes drastically according to where we are and what time of day or night it is. And there are very, very few people I turn my back on her with!
Now Shiva, our other Fila, is from Brazillian show lines, and her temperament is, well, she likes attention
Thank you Renee. Perhaps Fila have evolved on a different path in USA vs. Brazil. I do regret I have no experiance with USA Fila. In Brazil, what is Fila is very specific. Fila has to be strong and violent to be considered example of the race. Criteria may be different in the USA.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
Kharma - and the other Filas I've known from her lines - can be very violent and are unbelievably strong. Their survival skills seem to have kicked in, though, to allow them to 'evolve' into creatures that are capable of living and thriving in whatever environment they are in. That, to me, seems to be the very essence of the Fila - no matter where the Fila comes from. How else would they have survived and thrived in the privations of so many of the fazendas in Minas Gerais? Their physical toughness and agility is surpassed by their mental toughness and agility.
Their physical toughness and agility is surpassed by their mental toughness and agility.
Finally waded through this and all I can say is Kharma has been here twice now ....with complete strangers the first time and more relaxed this time . As an " elderly " person and having my young grand boy meet and pet her , I had NO qualms !!! She was beautifully brought up by Renee. Her slobber is still on my refrig .... I hate to wipe it off !
The Fila intellect is obviously much more flexible and grasps new concepts better than the human intellect at times. Ojeriza and an ability to move about and function comfortably in the world are not mutually exclusive. And to say that a Fila is nothing more than a violent creature who hates everyone other than immediate "family" is certainly not granting these creatures any credit for intelligence, cunning or abilities to adapt and survive.
And yet, regardless of what you or I think or believe, the Fila continues to adapt and survive and learns to live in a changing world, sometimes far better than many humans.
The essence of the Fila is not violence; it is great heart, courage, intelligence and loyalty that surpasses any breed I have ever encountered. Yes, the ojeriza is present in abundance, but the Fila rules the ojeriza; the ojeriza does not rule the Fila.
And yet, regardless of what you or I think or believe, the Fila continues to adapt and survive and learns to live in a changing world, sometimes far better than many humans.
The essence of the Fila is not violence; it is great heart, courage, intelligence and loyalty that surpasses any breed I have ever encountered. Yes, the ojeriza is present in abundance, but the Fila rules the ojeriza; the ojeriza does not rule the Fila.
I have no place in this debate since I don't own a Fila, but I'm bored and had a couple questions on my mind.
Nestor,
Since when does ojeriza equal violence? Violence is never mentioned in the definition. Just "averison". Dislike. Do you try to kill everyone you don't like? If you are going to brag up the intelligence of these dogs, then give them some credit.
I'm getting a little irritated with you deciding what is and is not a Fila. If you have Filas that bite to kill, then maybe it is you who doesn't have the "correct" Fila. Sure, these are very large and powerful dogs but you would be amazed at how precisely they can control their jaws. If all Filas bit down with crushing force, what use would they have been as working dogs when the breed was developed? Nobody here ever said that Filas don't bite, but they certainly can control a person or animal without maiming them.
You talk about your Filas on a farm, well perhaps the way the farm dogs are raised makes a difference in how violent and unmanageable they are. People on farms need Filas for one reason, and one reason only - work. The dogs never leave the farm. They are never socialized to anything but their working environment. So how can you compare those working Filas to urban Filas who are exposed to so many people and environments that they learn how to read human mannerisms, and eventually are able to distinguish what is normal and what is abnormal/threatening? How can you expect them to gauge what degree of force is necessary to get someone to back off, if they've never had civil contact with another person?
Nestor,
Since when does ojeriza equal violence? Violence is never mentioned in the definition. Just "averison". Dislike. Do you try to kill everyone you don't like? If you are going to brag up the intelligence of these dogs, then give them some credit.
I'm getting a little irritated with you deciding what is and is not a Fila. If you have Filas that bite to kill, then maybe it is you who doesn't have the "correct" Fila. Sure, these are very large and powerful dogs but you would be amazed at how precisely they can control their jaws. If all Filas bit down with crushing force, what use would they have been as working dogs when the breed was developed? Nobody here ever said that Filas don't bite, but they certainly can control a person or animal without maiming them.
You talk about your Filas on a farm, well perhaps the way the farm dogs are raised makes a difference in how violent and unmanageable they are. People on farms need Filas for one reason, and one reason only - work. The dogs never leave the farm. They are never socialized to anything but their working environment. So how can you compare those working Filas to urban Filas who are exposed to so many people and environments that they learn how to read human mannerisms, and eventually are able to distinguish what is normal and what is abnormal/threatening? How can you expect them to gauge what degree of force is necessary to get someone to back off, if they've never had civil contact with another person?
I was kind of wondering something along a similar line to RD.
If you lock the dog away from the world, how can you actually know what its true nature is like? Surely a dog that is well socialised is going to be far more true to its character than one that is never exposed to anything but its home environment?
That's certainly not to say that pure working dogs need to be socialised like pets, but to say that a dog that is well socialised in a number of different environments (urban and rural) is not true to the breed seems a little off balance to me. No matter what breed we're talking about.
Cass.
If you lock the dog away from the world, how can you actually know what its true nature is like? Surely a dog that is well socialised is going to be far more true to its character than one that is never exposed to anything but its home environment?
That's certainly not to say that pure working dogs need to be socialised like pets, but to say that a dog that is well socialised in a number of different environments (urban and rural) is not true to the breed seems a little off balance to me. No matter what breed we're talking about.
Cass.
RD,
Fila is a farm race. You can have one outside the farm, you can also drive a John Deere tractor as a daily commute car. It would not be that effective, but you may. This is the same for Fila. In Brasil, Fila is on the farm. Being a farmer or rancher in Brasil is very dangerous. Criminals threaten to kill farmers and take the farm, so you need a dog to protect. This is the job of Fila.
In Brazil, Fila are only kept in the city by those who live in favelas. Those places is where people are killed everyday. They do not need a dog just to bark, but to attack and save lives.
I learned to walk by grabbing the neck of a Fila. We always had 20 to 40 Fila at any one time. I know the breed very well.
Now, it is for me to live in a city, that is why I have Dogo Brasil and not Fila. Dogo Brasil is much better suit for life in a city. They are very accepting of people but still strong guard. Not as violent as Fila and for this situation that is a good thing.
I hope I answered your question.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
Fila is a farm race. You can have one outside the farm, you can also drive a John Deere tractor as a daily commute car. It would not be that effective, but you may. This is the same for Fila. In Brasil, Fila is on the farm. Being a farmer or rancher in Brasil is very dangerous. Criminals threaten to kill farmers and take the farm, so you need a dog to protect. This is the job of Fila.
In Brazil, Fila are only kept in the city by those who live in favelas. Those places is where people are killed everyday. They do not need a dog just to bark, but to attack and save lives.
I learned to walk by grabbing the neck of a Fila. We always had 20 to 40 Fila at any one time. I know the breed very well.
Now, it is for me to live in a city, that is why I have Dogo Brasil and not Fila. Dogo Brasil is much better suit for life in a city. They are very accepting of people but still strong guard. Not as violent as Fila and for this situation that is a good thing.
I hope I answered your question.
Thank You,
Nestor Costa
I have been silently watching this thread ever since my wife brought it to my attention with pity and disgust. The main problem that I see here is that to HoJ || Dictator one Fila is every Fila. The very notion that every Fila thinks and behaves in exactly the same manor is as inherently absurd as saying that every human thinks and behaves exactly alike. It's an easy mistake to make... Taking your personal experiences with one breed, in one role, trained one way, in one place, to do one thing, and globalizing this one repetitious experience into "all that Fila are." It's also an easy stance to defend when you talk in such absolutes... You love using words and phrases like "cannot" "is not" "impossible" and "has to." What this means is that you have already made up your mind. The case is closed. The book has been read, and you know how it ends.
Basically by talking down to all of these people you are illustrating that your mind is absolutely closed, and narrow when it comes to this. Fila are what you say they are. It's a good thing reality (past, present, or future) doesn't give a flying rip what you think. Otherwise I wouldn't want to bother continuing to live in the place in which you "dictate".
It's amazing how you can so blindly, and narrowly, take a race of living beings, and paint them all into such a small corner, label them, and dismiss them. You are, in fact, arguing against nature. In nature everything evolves, and everything changes -- This especially holds true when humans put their grubby little fingers into the cookie jar. We LOVE to take a good thing and screw it up. Its in our blood.
So lets, now put everything you're saying into context. You're saying that a breed of dog... numbering in the hundreds of thousands (millions?) across the globe. A dog breed whose bloodlines, temperaments, looks, and physical traits are in the hands of hundreds of breeders across the globe. A breed who has been taken out of its original habitat, and been planted in numerous new environments which place new requirements upon the breed. You say that with a breed of dog going through all that... It is impossible for the breed produce any variance, of any sort, from the dogs you happened to know back home? and on top of that you claim that the breed cannot, under any circumstances, adapt to any life other than the life that you picked out for them. So, basically, what you're saying is that flying in the face of nature, the will to survive, the ability to adapt, the intelligence of the breed... No dog that is, or came from a Fila bloodline could possibly be anything other than what you say it should be.
Wow. Thanks. Geez. Should we wait around for you to start slaughtering anyone who isn't fair haired and blue eyed, or can I take it from the fact that you're an unyielding, unrelenting, unintuitive, unimaginative, completely close minded bigot when it comes to "your" breed, that nobody should ever listen to you about anything except the strict parameters under which you chiseled your non-malleable opinion from the bedrock of ignorance?
So, for all you intelligent people reading at home, please prefix anything that HoJ or Dictator says with the following phrase: "The killing machines that we raise, and train, on our farm to be as ruthless and unforgivig as possible." That puts everything that those two user-names say in the proper context for you.
Back to reality. A proper owner of a Fila should be able to mold an amazing breed of dog into any capacity, and under any environment.
Back to reality. A breed that is being "bred" will naturally change over time, not making it any less the breed, than your children when they know how to do things with technology that you never dreamed of will be less human.
Back to reality. An intelligent, intuitive, responsive, understanding, watchful animal will *always* be able to adapt.
Back to reality. In the end... "you" (restricted plural) don't have any say at all where the breed came from, where the breed is, or where the breed is going. Those are simple, solid, facts.
So... your born, bred, and trained killing machines are what fila can be under certain circumstances. And Renees girls are examples of Fila under different circumstances. My Bella is an example of this remarkable breed in yet a different role.
I would ask that the next time you decide to open your mouth and spew forth the flies that you cradle therein, that you should expect to be called on your stance, your arrogance, and your ignorance for that that makes you. A narrow minded man who participates in, condones, and continues to spread fear, uncertainty, and doubt about a breed that is so much more than people like you will ever know.
Mores the pity, for you'll live your whole life believing a lie: That you are an authority figure based on your few square acres in one part of the world with one breed of dog raised in only one set of circumstances trained in one way and expected to do one thing.
Statistically speaking. You are being completely, utterly, and resolutely absurd. Obtuse speaks not only of your viewpoint, but your ego.
I could go on, But I believe that I have made my point: This discussion is nobodies class room. After having made, and argued your point, please move along. Other people would like to use the soap box as well. You're hogging the action, and polluting both the screen and the mind.
As for the exercise of replying... Don't bother... One of lifes little lessons is this: "Never argue with a stupid person. They'll bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience." I invite everybody to now learn about one particularly wonderful feature of the vBulletin software: the "ignore" feature.
Cheers!
DK
Basically by talking down to all of these people you are illustrating that your mind is absolutely closed, and narrow when it comes to this. Fila are what you say they are. It's a good thing reality (past, present, or future) doesn't give a flying rip what you think. Otherwise I wouldn't want to bother continuing to live in the place in which you "dictate".
It's amazing how you can so blindly, and narrowly, take a race of living beings, and paint them all into such a small corner, label them, and dismiss them. You are, in fact, arguing against nature. In nature everything evolves, and everything changes -- This especially holds true when humans put their grubby little fingers into the cookie jar. We LOVE to take a good thing and screw it up. Its in our blood.
So lets, now put everything you're saying into context. You're saying that a breed of dog... numbering in the hundreds of thousands (millions?) across the globe. A dog breed whose bloodlines, temperaments, looks, and physical traits are in the hands of hundreds of breeders across the globe. A breed who has been taken out of its original habitat, and been planted in numerous new environments which place new requirements upon the breed. You say that with a breed of dog going through all that... It is impossible for the breed produce any variance, of any sort, from the dogs you happened to know back home? and on top of that you claim that the breed cannot, under any circumstances, adapt to any life other than the life that you picked out for them. So, basically, what you're saying is that flying in the face of nature, the will to survive, the ability to adapt, the intelligence of the breed... No dog that is, or came from a Fila bloodline could possibly be anything other than what you say it should be.
Wow. Thanks. Geez. Should we wait around for you to start slaughtering anyone who isn't fair haired and blue eyed, or can I take it from the fact that you're an unyielding, unrelenting, unintuitive, unimaginative, completely close minded bigot when it comes to "your" breed, that nobody should ever listen to you about anything except the strict parameters under which you chiseled your non-malleable opinion from the bedrock of ignorance?
So, for all you intelligent people reading at home, please prefix anything that HoJ or Dictator says with the following phrase: "The killing machines that we raise, and train, on our farm to be as ruthless and unforgivig as possible." That puts everything that those two user-names say in the proper context for you.
Back to reality. A proper owner of a Fila should be able to mold an amazing breed of dog into any capacity, and under any environment.
Back to reality. A breed that is being "bred" will naturally change over time, not making it any less the breed, than your children when they know how to do things with technology that you never dreamed of will be less human.
Back to reality. An intelligent, intuitive, responsive, understanding, watchful animal will *always* be able to adapt.
Back to reality. In the end... "you" (restricted plural) don't have any say at all where the breed came from, where the breed is, or where the breed is going. Those are simple, solid, facts.
So... your born, bred, and trained killing machines are what fila can be under certain circumstances. And Renees girls are examples of Fila under different circumstances. My Bella is an example of this remarkable breed in yet a different role.
I would ask that the next time you decide to open your mouth and spew forth the flies that you cradle therein, that you should expect to be called on your stance, your arrogance, and your ignorance for that that makes you. A narrow minded man who participates in, condones, and continues to spread fear, uncertainty, and doubt about a breed that is so much more than people like you will ever know.
Mores the pity, for you'll live your whole life believing a lie: That you are an authority figure based on your few square acres in one part of the world with one breed of dog raised in only one set of circumstances trained in one way and expected to do one thing.
Statistically speaking. You are being completely, utterly, and resolutely absurd. Obtuse speaks not only of your viewpoint, but your ego.
I could go on, But I believe that I have made my point: This discussion is nobodies class room. After having made, and argued your point, please move along. Other people would like to use the soap box as well. You're hogging the action, and polluting both the screen and the mind.
As for the exercise of replying... Don't bother... One of lifes little lessons is this: "Never argue with a stupid person. They'll bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience." I invite everybody to now learn about one particularly wonderful feature of the vBulletin software: the "ignore" feature.
Cheers!
DK
