Bringing a PWC Puppy Home

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

Finally! After nearly 10 months of searching, I found someone who has a litter for sale within the area (60 miles).

I have a mixed PWC and was looking for a purebred Male to accompany my Female Mixed PWC as she gets lonely sometimes when I have other things to do around the house.

The breeder told me the PWC will be 8 weeks next week and are currently 7 weeks right now.

She told me that the vet says they are ready to be adopted and I was wondering if 7 weeks is still too young or is it okay?

And from pictures I seen in the classifieds, it seems that some of the litter has their ears down and some with erect ears. Will the ones with ears down eventually become erect?

Fran27 · Jul 11, 2007

Never ever get a puppy from classified ads. And 7 weeks is too young.

Check the breeding forums for what to look for in a breeder... Make sure the parents are tested for hips (OFA), eyes (CERF), and whatever other problem the breed usually has, as well as temperament if possible, that there is no health history in the pedigree, that the parents were either shown or worked and have titles to show that they are a good specimen of the breed (I don't know what breed it is).

Before you ask, it's not snobbism. Lots of breeders (called backyard breeders) just buy two random dogs and breed them. And that's where problems begin. The problem with buying a puppy from them, even if it's just going to be a pet and not going to get shown etc, is that more likely 1) there is no pedigree or testing so the parents are likely to have health problems somewhere in their pedigree, so you have good chances of getting a puppy that will have health issues; 2) if the parents have no title, there is no proof that the puppies you will get will be a good specimen of the breed - and that means temperament-wise, too. Oh, and 'champion lines' doesn't mean anything.

Good breeders won't have to post ads on a paper, they will have a waiting list for their puppies. Good breeders will have all kinds of testing done on the parents and will have them titled, to prove that they are a good specimen of the breed and worthy of being bred. Good breeders only breed to improve the breed - there's way too many dogs in shelters right now... so they will likely only have one litter or year or two.

Yes, it might be more pricey to get a dog from a good breeder, and you might have to wait... but it's so much more worth it in the end. You know you will have a healthy puppy that is really conform to what the breed should be, and you won't have bad surprises and have to spend thousands down the road because of health problems (it can still happen, but much more rarely, and lots of good breeders will help you with it).

Or... you could check www.petfinder.com. But please, don't give money to people who have no idea what they are doing and are just using their pets to make money. You *will* regret it.

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

I think you may have over-read my post. Sorry

PWC = Pembroke Welsh Corgi

The person selling them has their dogs in-doors and both the Father and Mother are purebreds that are AKC and ACA registered dogs. She took all the pups for their deworming and vaccination boosters already. So I doubt they are backyard breeders at all.

I agree by going through a breeder but I could not find any in my area. I looked up the Club website and I e-mailed ALL the local breeders and none of which got back to me but 1, and he was charging $1000 per pup. That's a bit too expensive to me as I will also need to get that pup to a vet and have its vaccinations.

Fran27 · Jul 11, 2007

Rethink it, and read my post again.

Having the dogs registered to the AKC doesn't mean anything. You could register about any litter nowadays, it doesn't mean the parents were healthy, nor a good specimen of the breed. Pups being vaccinated and dewormed is the norm, and isn't a sign of a good breeder either.

What about the health testing? Did the parents have health testing done? Do they have any title?

Most backyard breeders are really nice people, they just don't know better. They really think they are doing a favor by breeding pet-quality dogs. The truth is, they are not doing a favor to the dogs or breed at all. How do you think so many health issues have shown up in lots of breeds? Because of poor breeding, and because too many breeders don't do any testing at all on the parents before planning a litter.

It doesn't matter what their reasons are - because they enjoy breeding, because they wanted their children to experience birth, whatever. Any breeder that doesn't breed to improve the breed is a backyard breeder. And only backyard breeders post their ads in the papers and only breed 'pet quality' puppies.

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

I'm a bit confused when you refer to title.

But what should I do before buying the pup?

Should I ask the breeder if the Parent's have been tested for their health and genetic disorders so that the possibility of passing the gene down to the pup is narrow?

Fran27 · Jul 11, 2007

Yes, and ask them if the parents have any working or show titles, so you know you're getting a well bred pup.

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

Mmm, thanks for the input Fran.

I was thinking though, what if there is health testing and it is in good standards but there are no show titles (meaning they have been to a dog show?) or working titles?

Fran27 · Jul 11, 2007

I would say it's unlikely, but people don't agree on the subject, lol. I know that personally if I had a corgi, knowing that they are herding breeds, I would like to know that the parents were good at doing what the dogs were bred for - even if I'm not going to work with the dog, you know? But it means the puppy is likely to have the right temper.

About testing... if the breeders tell you that they were checked but can't show you any record, run away.

This thread might interest you...

http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57004

It shows what to look for and to avoid in a breeder.

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

Yeah I was just looking at a sticky earlier that describes nearly the same.

It said what you said about no breeder will put their dogs on classifieds or newspapers. But it just seems so hard to find this breed locally. I am at a loss for finding a purebred of this breed. (Most of them live in northern FL which is about 4-6 hours away)

A friend of mine got his through a breeder website and had to participate in a survey where they asked questions before he was e-mailed back to meet with the breeder. But he told me that his dog is not AKC registered and he paid about $200 for the pup I believe. His Corgi's temperament seems to be very hyper and disobedient and the exact opposite than the temperament I been reading about this breed. So I'm thinking the breeder he got them from wasn't a good breeder or possibly a BYB (since I was going to ask him about the breeder so I can purchase one when they had a litter avail)

When I heard that, I thought it sounded like backyard breeding too since the pup was not registered while most pups that are purebred lines are AKC registered.

Now I'm confused whether or not I should be picking up this new addition to the family. I looked forward to this too

Fran27 · Jul 11, 2007

I know, it's frustrating

And yes your friend looks like he got his dog from a horrible breeder

I was looking at the breeds I might be interested in in the future, and for most of them the good breeders are hours away... but I figured it would be worth it to get a healthy and well tempered dog. If not, I'll just find one on petfinder...

I got my golden retriever from a bad place, and it shows. I'm quite sure he has really bad hips, I just haven't got the courage to get them x-rayed yet, but at least it doesn't seem to bother him... for now. I'm sure we'll have to pay for surgery eventually. And temperament-wise, it's not great either. He is good natured, but he has resource guarding issues, which I never heard of in goldens - and we've been working on it for months, and there's not much improvement.

Believe me, i won't make the same mistake again.

Denaluvscorgis · Jul 11, 2007

I agree with Fran on this subject. To be honest, the breeder saying the puppies can leave at 7 weeks old is a red flag to me. :yikes: That's too young!!! Corgi's ears typically start to stand up between 8-10 weeks at least in my experience. I also agree that it would be much better to have to travel some distance to get a healthy puppy. You'll be much happier in the long run. Good luck with your search.

BostonBanker · Jul 11, 2007

The other posts are correct - it sounds like that may not be the ideal breeder to buy from. Wouldn't you rather drive a few extra hours and get a dog that you know has had every possible advantage? You'll spend the next 15 years being glad you drove 4 or 5 hours.

Also, corgis do tend to be very high energy dogs. I'm mentioning it because I saw another post where you were concerned about your corgi x's energy level. They are working dogs, bred to be active and busy all day. I've known a great many corgis (the horse world is full of them), and many are outside all day, running around, playing fetch, playing with other dogs, and basically being on the go non-stop. That is just my personal experience - I thought it would be worth sharing. There are quite a few corgi people on this board; perhaps they will chime in with their own opinions.

Herschel · Jul 11, 2007

RSX JDM Integra said:

Hahaha. The ACA is a joke registry. The only people that register dogs with them are back yard breeders or puppy mills. Huge red flag.

Drive your little RSX a few hours to get a dog from a decent breeder. It is a once in a lifetime trip for a companion that you will have for the next decade.

This incredible PWC breeder is less than two hours from Orlando. http://www.riversidepwc.com/

MafiaPrincess · Jul 11, 2007

I couldn't fins a non skeazy American cocker spaniel breeder here. My target range was within 10 hours. Then I moved it to 12 etc. Looked at 60+ kennels over months and there were ones that looked good. Show titles pretty dogs, talked about health testing.. To find they were passing on nasty eye conditions.. Some lied about doing more health testing than they were doing etc..

So I had to wait, and look. My puppy flies next week from North Carolina a good 15 hour drive away because I couldn't find anyone good enough closer. I might have if I'd gone to shows and kept pushing, I'm sure there have to be a few good breeders up here. But I've been waiting for this puppy for 9 months. Waiting for the bitch to go into heat, whelp, watching the puppies grow up etc.

Maxy24 · Jul 11, 2007

Yeah they sound bad, unfortunately it is far easier to find a bad breeder than a good one. I think some of us may be able to help, what state do you live in? (you can PM me if you'd like). A good way to find breeders is go to a dog show and ask the handler with the breed you like that you are interested in getting a Corgi and what breeders they recommend. You can also go to the Pembroke Welsh Corgi club of America website and look for breeders they list (sometimes they list a person you should call who will then give you some names of breeders).

I'm very glad you are willing to learn, please turn down this breeder! We here are trying to educate people about BYBs so that we can help the dogs already here but keep the breeds alive, healthy and true with GOOD breeders.

Without those OFA and CERF health screenings your heightening your chances of getting a dog so you can loose him in a few years or have to pay for a surgery and watch him in pain. My aunt got her Goldens from bad breeders and one died at 5 and the other at 6. The wait is worth it, and if you don't want to wait then think about adopting

otch1 · Jul 11, 2007

Hi RXS... I understand how disappointing it is to have your heart set on a puppy, then have to reconsider. Many owners go through this, after a long search. They take the first available pup out of the most reasonable breeder they can find. This breeder is probably a very nice woman, but it's best to find someone that you know has the experience, knowledge and health guarantee that will ensure you having a positive experience. Remember, this is an animal that you will hopefully be spending the next 12 years or so with. The purchase price should not be the biggest consideration. You will pay twice as much in the long run, should you purchase a puppy that develops health problems down the road due to lack of health testing and an appropriate breeding pair. Herschel sent you a good example of what you should be looking for. A breeder/owner-exhibitor with years of experience and knowledge in the breed.That's often worth paying more for when you're certain you want to purchase a purebred dog. If you'd like any more referals for the west coast and mid west, pm me and I'll send you a few phone numbers. Good luck!

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

She originally said they can be taken home when they were 8 weeks but they are about 7 weeks something now so if I took them home it will only be 2-3 days shy of being 8 weeks. Note that she originally said they must stay for 8 weeks but the vet gave her the "OK" to have them leave; a few days shy of 8 weeks. (I read somewhere that puppies should be atleast 8 weeks old before leaving their litter)

I live in the state of FL. Typically Southern FL. I'll message her and ask her about the Health Screenings and all that.

But the thing is, if I don't buy this puppy, what's to become of them? If we all were to avoid people who aren't top notch breeders with golden standards but mediocre standards like getting the litter registered, vaccinated and dewormed, what's to become of them? Are they supposed to not have a home?

Maxy24 · Jul 11, 2007

RSX JDM Integra · Jul 11, 2007

^

Did a search within FL and found nothing for a purebred Welsh Corgi

Denaluvscorgis · Jul 11, 2007

I also wanted to chime in on what was mentioned earlier about a Corgi's energy level. I have a 4 year old PWC. They're EXTREMELY active dogs, and require a huge amount of exercise and attention. A bored Corgi tends to be a naughty Corgi.

Bringing a PWC Puppy Home

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