Breeding my chihuahuas (help!!)

Discussion in 'The Breeding Ground' started by mninh0076, Aug 22, 2006.

  1. mninh0076

    mninh0076 New Member

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    I know alot of people disagree with breeding untitled dogs and such. However ever since I got my little girl fajita, everyone has wanted one of her pups. My mom even got a boy dog, paco so that she could have a playmate. Now they love eachother so much!

    After alot of thought and consideration we have decided to breed her, so please, if you could read this without bias or prejudice. I need real advice, regardless of your opinions so that i can prepare myself, and my dog- and take care of the puppies.

    Anyway, fajita is about a year and a half years old now. Paco is a little less. They started having sex back in july. Around july 12th. So She's about 2/3 of the way there. (63 days right?).

    I have plenty of homes already lined up for the puppies (6 so far, and if she even has that many- all of these people are people i know personally, some even family and i am not selling any of the puppies, just giving them away. after this birth she is being spayed as well) She is (when not pregnant lol) a 4 lb chihuahua, and paco is probably 2 or 3.

    The breeder we bought her from told us to make sure to wait atleast till her second heat to breed them (which we did) and make sure the male is smaller than the female. (he has longer legs but her body mass is so much more than his so hopefully that works as well)

    I have several websites bookmarked with directions and how to's to assisting the dog in birth, and i've watched a couple videos on it (gross i know but i was curious as to what to expect) And my cousin who used to work in a vet office, and helped her chihuahuas give birth is assisting me with it.

    I lost my job the week after they started to have sex. And she was at the vet right before she had sex because i thought she might have a skin problem because her hair became really thin (but its all grown back now) The vet said he thinks she has hip displasia (i think that is what he said it was) I havent had money to go back and get it checked, or to get xrays to see.

    So I'm in a bit of a pickle. I start a new job on monday, and ill have a paycheck on the 7th of september... so its cutting it really close. I'll be using the first few checks for the puppies/whatever needs done for fajita.

    But the vet was playing with her hip, and he said something about it popping or something, and said that means she has it. However she shows no signs of it at all. people talk about dogs walking funny or bunny hopping. she sometimes hops when she runs, but she has always done that ever since i got her ( on occassion anyway) and she was a month or two old. and its not so much a hopping its like her front legs and her back legs move with the partnering leg when she runs... its odd but ive never thought anything of it.

    She shows no signs of being in pain, her back legs dont walk "close" together. she doesnt appear to have any problems standing up.

    My question, though is if she has it, is it 100% chance the puppies will? I intend to get it checked out within the next couple weeks.

    I thought only big dogs get it... shes a very very small chihuahua.

    Also, if the male dog is smaller than the female, is it likely a C section will be needed?

    thanks all for your help!

    ps both chihuahuas are registered pure breds. the breeding has been breeding dogs for 30 years. she had about 14 beautiful dogs, and she was a nice lady. I dont remember if there was any heath garuntee or anything when we bought her. but i doubt she would sell people dogs with genetic defects... but still. what do you think?
     
  2. whatszmatter

    whatszmatter Guest

    I think they're all questions you should have had answers to before you did any of this. Other than that I'll have to let someone else give you the coddling you seek cause if I said what I thought I'd probably be banned.
     
  3. showpug

    showpug New Member

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    This is why you run health screens BEFORE you breed! If your chi is indeed dysplastic, there is a good chance that at least some of her puppies will be as well. Have you had your male chi checked for dysplasia or luxating patellas etc.?

    The second heat cycle is too early to breed a dog. They should be at the very least two years old and on their fourth cycle. The reproductive specialist I have been speaking with regarding the future breeding of Alice informed me that the reason it is so important to wait until at least two years is because that is when the bitch's pelvis is all the way done growing. Anything before that could cause delivery problems which chis' are very prone to in the first place. During my vet clinic years, the majority of dogs we saw that needed c-sections were chis. They usually lost the puppies and at one point a client lost his chi and all the pups. It was very sad. Please set aside $700-$1200 in case your chi needs a c-section as well and learn the warning signs of a bitch in labor distress.

    At this point you need to confirm if she does or does not have hip dysplasia. If she does, you need to inform the future puppy owners and if they aren't comfortable getting a puppy from you, the most responsible thing to do would be to keep all the puppies. You brought them into the world, that means YOU are responsible that they get loving homes whether it be with you or someone else, hip dysplasia or no hip dysplasia.

    I can't emphasise enough how important health screens are prior to breeding. They prevent situations like yours.

    I wish your dog the best in this endeavour.
     
  4. mninh0076

    mninh0076 New Member

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    thanks for the quick replies. The breeder we got them from spoke of all that, so i assumed since their parents were they were fine too. I guess human ignorance. I am waiting on a new capital one card that i opened (just for this) to come in the mail so that i'll have money incase i do have to have a c section (cuz ive heard they were expensive)

    And I already planned on keeping one of the puppies, the other ones won't be a problem if there is a problem.

    and to whatszmatter- There are probably thousands of people that breed dogs everyday that have been misinformed (such as myself), or simply just breed them because they want a family of dogs. I could be running a puppy mill, I could be selling dogs to china to get them eaten or something- but I'm not. I'm a regular person just like you, though I will tell you, the reason I put at the begining of this page- please post without prejudice, is because I know alot of die hard "know it all" dog lovers are quite hostile. I was hoping to attract people to my thread that could offer insight, because they "care" about the dogs. Obviously you can't get past your opinions enough to help someone make the best of the situation for the sake of the DOGS.

    Thanks though, showpug
     
  5. kairi_s_nobody

    kairi_s_nobody New Member

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    I dont think they eat dogs no more, especially not chihuahuas and why would they want to buy dogs from america? they got their own dogs in china.
     
  6. mninh0076

    mninh0076 New Member

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    I didn't think much of that when i said it. lol, but all i was saying is there are worse things i could be with my dogs than breeding them so that other family members can enjoy them as well.

    Though, china did recently order an extermination of dogs. And they killed over 50 thousand of them, by clubbing. They just walked through the streets and smacked peoples pets with clubs and threw them into a truck. So maybe there is a shortage after that.
     
  7. jess2416

    jess2416 Who woulda thought

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    I care about dogs....thats why I am telling you please dont breed them, UNLESS you are trying to better the breed and have done all the proper health testing and etc...

    Do you honestly think, the people that care about the welfare of the animals are going to come to your thread and say "good job you asked for advice"

    I know I wont...

    So go ahead and breed your dogs, and whats going to happen if the people that say they want puppies dont want them..

    Are you planning on keeping them??

    Whats going to happen if you have a weak pup and you have to get up every hour on the hour (or more) to feed him/her??

    What are you going to do if the mother rejects them??

    *I'm done*
     
  8. mninh0076

    mninh0076 New Member

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    I'm prepared for all of that, and no, i dont expect "kudos, you asked for advice".


    Though, people that care about animal welfare would probably atleast give that advice, regardless of their own opinions.
     
  9. xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo

    xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo Brittany

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    Um, please don't get into detail on that because hearing stuff of that sort makes me sick to my stomach! (killing animals for no reason with clubs?) All I have to say is good luck with your puppies and I hope they are all healthy... I would give you more advice if I could, but I no nothing about breeding, sorry!
     
  10. stevinski

    stevinski Int CH - $uperBitch

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    breeding a dog with hip dyplasia is probably one of the worst breeding decisions you could have made, not just for the dog breed but for you,

    she will have difficulty giving birth and you will most likely need a cesarian(sp)

    also if you do indeed give these puppys to friends and familys, if the puppies end up with this disease then those people are gonna end up paying vet bills 1000 + and they will more then likely need multiple operations.

    the only advice i can give you would be to get a book, if you PM bubbatd, then she can point in the direction of a great puppy book :D
     
  11. stevinski

    stevinski Int CH - $uperBitch

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    then you say here

    that breeder is most definetly not responsible and a breeder you should completely avoid in the future
     
  12. I don't have much to say except:

    There is a GREAT chance that your dog will need a C-Section as it is very common is chihuahuas.

    You definately bred her too early.

    You should have done health screening before she got pregnant...not after.

    You should have been doing the research you are doing now long before you ever got your dog pregnant.

    Also how many times did you breed her and over what length of time?

    Did you do ANY research before you decided to get your dog pregnant?

    Im sorry but "A lot of people wanted puppies from my dog" is not a good reason to breed her...especially with health problems. If I did that I would have to breed my chihuahuas 24/7 just to satisfy any one who ever said they wanted one of my dogs. (Not that I would breed for that reason) Thank god I don't breed anymore!

    Please get her spayed after this is all over.
     
  13. tempura tantrum

    tempura tantrum Shiba Inu Slave

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    Hey there- people here are really trying their best not to go haywire on this thread. You may not believe it, but I've seen plenty of threads similar to yours go down a much nastier path. So take all of our griping with a grain of salt, and note that it's hard for us to hold our tongues when we're talking about little lives being at stake. (Especially when it seems pretty clear that the person in question kind of KNOWS that what they're doing is unethical).

    Now onto some advice.

    DO plan on a c-section being needed for your girl. As others have said- Chihuahuas generally have a great deal of difficulty with delivery, and you've bred your girl too early, which will only compound things. Good breeders prefer that they wait until 2 years of age to breed a bitch- otherwise she is both physically (and sometimes mentally) immature.

    The second heat is far too early.

    The mental immaturity thing is a big problem. While you've got a shot (as she's closer to 2 than she is to 1), that she'll be okay, a bitch bred as a "teenager," may become a poor mother. She may reject the puppies. Have a contingency plan for that possibility- as rejection happens to the BEST of breeders. In that case you will need to be hand-feeding babies- which is BEYOND time-consuming. (IE: it will be a GOOD thing that you don't have a job if this happens...you won't have time for one).

    On to the hip dysplasia thing...it sounds like she's got it. The hip "popping" is a bad sign. It means that the "ball" of her hip joint is scraping against the "socket," because one or the other is malformed. This may not be extaordinarly painful for her YET, but as time goes on, this joint (which doesn't move smoothly, like a dog with good conformation), will grind down. So- it's going to get worse with age. You owe it to her to get it fixed, or she'll suffer greatly.

    Dogs are good at hiding pain as well. It's a survival mechanism, but doesn't mean they aren't hurting.

    Surgery is pretty expensive- it can reach up to $5000 a hip, depending on how difficult the reconstruction is. In the very worst cases, people who cannot afford the surgery often euthanize the dog, as it's the only humane thing to do.

    You will need to inform your prospective puppy owners that there is a chance the puppies will have hip displaysia, and may need surgery. This is ethically the most responsible thing to do (and you can imagine how devestated your family and friends would be, if their puppy unexplicably became dysplastic and needed a surgery they couldn't afford). The puppies are theoretically "free," but chances are, the price tags of their surgeries may end up being a LOT more than people would've paid for a pup from a responsible breeder. I would also put a spay/neuter contract on ALL of these pups, as well as notify them that should they wish to give up the dog at ANY point in their lifespan, it is returned to you.

    Good breeders are responsible for ALL the lives they create- for as long as they live. Do right by your girl and the babies by making sure that you're there for them.

    As you can see- there's a lot of scary "what if" scenarios popping up. This is why we care about genetic testing, health screenings, showing our dogs, and doing the research...a lot of this could've been avoided had you simply gone the responsible route.

    Good luck- and keep reading! An excellent resource is called "The Book of The Bitch."
     
  14. LizzieCollie

    LizzieCollie Collie Crazy

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    The fact that you keep saying 'My dogs had sex" tells me alot about your age, or maturity (or lack thereof)

    You have made a horrible decision in breeding these two dogs together, and I am sure after the birth you will have MANY nightmares for years to come.

    You have bred 2 pet quality dogs together, just because. You have bred 2 UNTESTED dogs, one who most likely has HD and the other who is probably a carrier. Are you sure you are willing to pay 700 dollars for a c-section and then just 'give away' the pups? I doubt it.

    There are thousands of people who breed uninformed, and this is the #1 reason why we have so many dogs in shelters, and so many dogs euthanized DAILY.

    If you think your not doing anything wrong you are dead wrong. For every pup that bitch has, there will be 2 who will be put to death because you wanted to breed just because. By breeding her you will be responsible for hundreds of deaths.

    Also, how can you live with the possibility of bringing pups in this world to suffer? Hip Dysplasia is HEREDITARY and a great deal of those pups will suffer this condition. Spay her and abort the pups, its the kindest thing you can do.

    If you insist on breeding irresponsibly purchase another bitch who doesnt have HD or any genetic condition and breed her, but dont bring such poor quality pups into a world over filling with dogs.
     
  15. J's crew

    J's crew New Member

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    Not true. There is a wealth of information on breeding and whelping on the internet. I suggest you use your search engine. Also ask for a rush on that credit card, your gonna need it.

    Asking questions such as the ones you did will NOT get a positive response, given the possible genetic problems, birthing problems, etc that you have set yourself up for.

    Get busy, you have ALOT of reading to do. 99% of threads started like yours end up with alot of pissed of people. We do care about dogs, thats the reason we do not have time to educate ignorance.

    Oh, and BTW, just incase you are wondering. Dog lovers breed to BETTER the breed. Dog lovers spend countless hours already cleaning up messes from BYB's such as yourself. Go volunteer at a local animal shelter and watch all the dogs that get PTS because they are from a BYB, puppymill, etc.

    Also, one more thing. Just about every time someone says they are breeding their unproven, untested pets, their reasoning is because all the puppies will have homes with family or friends. Not a good enough reason for me. Not after watching 50 plus dogs be PTS EVERY day at 1 shelter in my county.

    And, I do want to add that I am sorry if this is harsh. It should be. Sometimes learning right from wrong is not always pleasant.
     
  16. rhinecat

    rhinecat New Member

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    Hip dysplasia can be particularly devastating for small dogs, as they do more jumping from heights than large dogs do, and often end up overweight, both of which exacerbate the pain of dysplastic hips. Your dog may need surgery in the future. All of the puppies will be at risk of having hip dysplasia and may need surgery at some point in their lives. The surgery can cost several thousand dollars. Whoever you're giving the puppies to will need to be warned, in no uncertain terms, about this possibility, and I cannot suggest strongly enough that ALL these dogs be spayed/neutered and not bred (or rebred). Chihuahuas, as a breed, are very prone to joint problems (Legg-Calve-Perthes, luxating patellas) and, again as a breed, do not need dogs contributing the genes for hip dysplasia.

    Also, if you did not have your dog screened for heritable disorders, you may be in for general heartbreak with the puppies. The breed is prone to hydrocephalus, seizure disorders, tracheal collapse, heart defects... So I would seriously suggest that you evaluate whether you're prepared to deal with all the potential problems. It may not be too late to spay Fajita, if you feel that you will not be able to pay for the puppies' medical care on top of a potential C-section and treatment for her hips down the road. If you decide against that, or it is too late, I would suggest applying for credit cards, Care Credit, or a personal loan ASAP.

    Best of luck.
     
  17. xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo

    xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo Brittany

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    I don't want to get into any arguments, but I just wanted to state that my neighbors flat coated retriever, Emma is going under hip displasia surgery which will cost her owner, Tracy 5,000 each hip! Keep that in mind, and make sure that whoever gets the puppies can afford surgeries of that cost!
     
  18. LabBreeder

    LabBreeder Guest

    All I will say is that you did NO thinking before allowing them to breed. To young, no health checks, hip dysplasia, not bettering the breed...so many things wrong!
    If your dog and the pups live you'll be lucky. Have you even had her checked to see if she is in fact pregnant? Just because they "had sex" doesn't mean she's pregnant.

    I won't say anything else because what you've done is wrong on so many levels *BYB*. Let someone else give you the babying support you desire. It sounds like you need prayers for the upcoming pups more than anything.
     
  19. xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo

    xo_PuPpYlUvEr_xo Brittany

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    I sent you a PM, please read it.
     
  20. pitbulliest

    pitbulliest New Member

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    You bred your female at 1.5 years? You are supposed to wait until she's at least 2 years old to breed her. So she's already pregnant now........and you are coming asking for advice after the fact?

    Abort the pups..its the kindest thing you can do right now for your huge mistake...and PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE help your Chi by fixing the hip dysplasia...it will cost you, but like someone already mentioned..dogs don't always show when they are in pain..and your dog may be in ALOT of pain that you need to take care of....abort the pups and take care of your girl!

    I really don't have anything else to say....*shakes head*... :(
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2006

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