BC breeders for me

Discussion in 'The Breeding Ground' started by Laurelin, Apr 13, 2012.

  1. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    Again. I'm really trying to do this next dog as right as right can be. I'm going to be pretty picky when it comes to this dog. Got a few breeds on the list, but would like to start talking to breeders including BC breeders. The other main breed I already have the breeder picked if I go that route. Looking for 2014 most likely.

    I have a few names I'm looking at but would like to hear from some more BC savvy people as well.

    You guys know what I tend to like. Main focus for said dog will be agility. Will probably dabble in something else but I want this to be my first 'for serious' agility dog.

    Must haves:
    - Full health testing. Breeder must also stand behind their pups if a health problem occurs. I don't expect no health issues ever (unrealistic) but I do expect a breeder to do their best and to offer advice if something happens. This is priority #1 for me at this point in time.
    - Well balanced temperament. I want a dog that is nice to live with. However, my 'nice to live with' standards might be a bit skewed lol.
    - Must be some kind of performance oriented breeder, not a conformation breeder. Sports or work are both fine by me
    - Breeder must be okay with dog being AKC registered (at least a performance listing). Most trials around here are AKC and I don't want to limit myself. I know a lot of working breeders won't allow this.

    Prefer:
    - Would prefer a breeder that allows pups to be kept intact.
    - Smaller scale breeder. 1-3 litters a year max
    - Breeder in the US, Canada would be okay too if they'll ship

    I swear I had more requirements but I can't think of them at the moment.

    One issue I'm running into is the working full time thing. How do you go about convincing a breeder that you will be a good candidate for a pup if you work full time? I'm definitely thinking dog walker or something of that sort. Not sure.

    Also if you have some breeders to definitely stay away from let me know. (Pm works too)
     
  2. Michiyo-Fir

    Michiyo-Fir New Member

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    Hmm maybe try Martha?

    Her kennel is Marcar Border Collies, but she's here in my area, in BC Canada. She health tests a lot for a working breeder and has health guarantees (although I can't remember if it's lifetime or over a few years for hips).

    I'm not sure how she feels about AKC registration but I do know she sells to performance and active pet homes. She's one of the top kennels on my list right now.

    She also breeds only 1-2 litters every 2-3 years and doesn't produce a lot of puppies. A few people around here have great things to say about her and one lady I know is trialing 2 of her dogs and doing very well.

    MarCar Border Collies
     
  3. lizzybeth727

    lizzybeth727 New Member

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    Trust me, Lar. If you tell the breeder about yourself and your plans for the dog, he/she won't CARE that you work full time. You're better than AT LEAST 75% of the people he/she'll get inquiries from.

    I'd tell the breeder that you're prepared to hire a dog walker if the puppy is having a hard time with you at work full time, but you're doing x,y,z things to make sure the puppy is ok with you being gone. ;)
     
  4. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    Thanks! I sometimes feel like there's no way I'll be good enough for a breeder like the kind I'd want to get a pup from. I think part of it is just the idea of going with something new and not having said experience with the breed. But we've all got to start somewhere. :)
     
  5. BostonBanker

    BostonBanker Active Member

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    Keep in mind, I'm pretty sure you can't get a performance listing with an intact dog, so those two things may contradict themselves. A friend of mine had to deal with that issue recently; her first BC got accepted into the AKC intact because they were still letting in outside dogs or something. Her second from the same breeder she could not get registered or ILP or whatever the options were, because he was still intact.
     
  6. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    Yep, that's one problem. If push comes to shove, I'd rather get a dog that can be PAL'd. If I need to neuter, then so be it as long as I get to wait until the dog is fully grown. I'd prefer both but I am willing to compromise on that.
     
  7. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    Contact Point or Hob Nob.

    I train with a lot of HN dogs, they're pretty fool proof. I also train with a few CP dogs and Iam blown away by their speed, drive, and love their tiny sizes.

    There is also Hillcrest with some pretty awesome dogs, I would like to research them further.


    I have a few friends with ranch collies but they tend to be ABCA and not AKC, they also vary a lot in temp where the HN and CP seem to be pretty predictable, even if they are primarily sporter collies.
     
  8. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    What kinds of temperaments are you seeing out of both sets of dogs? I've noticed a lot of DA in the local sports bred collies I've trained with. That is one thing that does concern me about going with a sporter. I either absolutely love them or I think the dogs are obnoxious but that probably depends on the handler too. The obnoxious ones I know come with obnoxious handlers, lol.

    I have only been around trial bred dogs at actual stockdog trials. They are certainly impressive in that arena but I don't see them around agility.

    I like the idea of ABCA regged dogs more than AKC but I'm realizing around here to limit yourself to non akc venues will be really limiting. Oklahoma is not exactly the hotbed of dog sports and trials. Someone who breeds ABCA dogs but will allow sports owners to PAL or do a limited reg with the AKC would be ideal.

    I'm going to start trying to hit up a lot of trials this next year, hopefully both stock and agility. Try to see what is out there a bit more.
     
  9. Lizmo

    Lizmo Water Junkie

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    I think most working breeders can be pretty flexible about the AKC reg stuff if you talk to them about it. But like you said, most will probably do the ILP/PAL, but that requires the dog to be neutered. We couldn't full-up AKC reg if we wanted, but PAL/ILP was fine (but that was never an issue for us).

    I think I gave you some names in the past?
     
  10. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    I think you did and I remember a couple but if you wouldn't mind sending them again just in case, I'd be grateful. :)

    Just trying to expand the list and such right now.
     
  11. Fran101

    Fran101 Resident fainting goat

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    Ok, I am NO expert when it comes to this stuff lol but while I was looking at breeders, here are a couple that I really liked

    Keep in mind, things like personable and being house dogs/loved family companions (with pictures of the dogs simply having fun, being part of the family, personality descriptions etc..) were big factors when I chose breeders. So these are much more small scale than others.

    Here were my top 3. Number 1 and 2 were my favorite

    http://topnotchbordercollies.weebly.com/index.html
    Dogs are akc reg and very well rounded (agility, show, rally-o, etc..) health testing is all there, dogs are raw fed and versatile.
    They are in FL and I met one of these dogs and simply loved her. I think I may have contacted this breeder a while back and found her to be very friendly and open

    this one, which was my performance breeder pick. http://www.hillcrestbordercollies.com/home.cfm
    Dogs are AKC reg, there is LOTS of agility and flyball!! Health stuff is there, natural rearing, they have a great youtube page/blog,


    http://www.creeksidebordercollies.com/AboutUs.html
    This breeder was one of my more working/sport picks.. dogs are much more working line than the above but still dogs do compete in agilty quite a bit. Dogs are raw fed, all health clearances are there.

    but this is also listed on their website
    "Spay and Neuter: It is our goal to keep our carefully bred working dogs' bloodlines undiluted by "show" and/or "sport" lines, therefore every puppy from Creekside who’s future includes anything but a focus on stock work MUST be spayed or neutered at a suitable age*. 12-14 months"
    That leads me to believe that AKC stuff might be an issue, but not sure.
     
  12. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    Applegarth I think PA has some nice BCs. AFAIK They're primarily working lines and are worked (herding sheep) but the breeder is pretty into obedience, freestyle and agility too. She's produced some very successful performance dogs. I've known multiple people who have gotten dogs from her over the years (babysat one at my house even several times :)) and they've all had great BC temperaments - sound, drive to spare but great house dogs and good companions. Haven't known any to have health issues either but AFAIK she does all of the health testing. As far as size, the ones I have known are typical BC size with a few being a bit smaller. So not as small as what some sport only breeders are selecting for but then, I don't think size is a great basis to choose on either. Such a breeder may offer you the best of both worlds though, in terms of the working vs. sports argument. She has no real website but I can give you contact info if you're interested. I'm pretty sure her dogs are AKC registered.

    If you're looking for more towards Sporter Collie breeders, I know Cyclone BCs and have liked the dogs I have seen from her. I think she's in WVA. They are more a combination of obedience lines (Heelalong), some sport lines and some working lines. I'm in class every week with her and four of her dogs (two Savvy-aged puppies and two of her adult dogs). A lot of performance people in this area have dogs from her and they all seem pretty happy with them and the dogs seem to do well for them. In general they aren't over the top crazy dogs although one of her adults dogs is rather crazy on the course (shrieking and what not). She also does high level competition obedience with her dogs (really I think obedience is more her primary thing). Also quite a few are shown in AKC conformation, although they aren't really bred for conformation they seem to do well. They are definitely AKC registered, so no worries there. I can also send you her contact info if you are interested.

    ETA - someone I've known for a long time online has a Hillcrest dog and is extremely happy with him. She does agility and bought him as a performance dog. I think Hillcrest is a very respected BC breeder in the performance world.
     
  13. BostonBanker

    BostonBanker Active Member

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    As I said in a previous thread where they came up, I adore the Creekside dogs I know; I have a friend who has two, and know several others. I've hung out with the breeder a fair bit at trials, and I can't say enough good things about her, her dogs, and everything I've seen of her ethics. It is absolutely where I would go if I were going to get a purebred BC. I am fairly certain her dogs can not be AKC registered the normal way; something to do with dogs from the Canadian registry not being allowed in. I can't say I listened all that carefully when my friend was trying to get her younger dog registered, but I know in the end she got him neutered (he was already 3 and they were fairly certain he wasn't going to be bred).
     
  14. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    I know Ignited Border Collies asks that their dogs be kept intact at least until maturity. But otherwise their puppy contract scares the crap out of me. (Futurepuppy's mama is from Ignited)

    Steve is from Orion Border Collies. Her puppy contract requires spay/neuter but she didn't have any problem with allowing me to keep Steve intact for longer than the allotted year.

    Quicksilver makes super nice dogs.

    Power Tripp Border Collies. I especially like how transparent they have chosen to be about health issues.

    These are all sport breeders, btw.
     
  15. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    I didn't think of Power Tripp but I see those dogs at trials here too and one of the BC/Beardies was in class with Savvy for a while.
     
  16. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    What were your thoughts on the Powertripp dogs? I really like them from what I can see. Something about their website just gave me a good gut feeling.

    I am so glad I started this thread, my breeder list has nearly doubled. Lots of breeders y'all have mentioned that I really really like the sound of.
     
  17. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    They seem pretty typical of Sporter Collies in what I have seen. I haven't noticed any sort of red flag issues or weird (beyond normal BC weird) behavior from them that would make me feel they shouldn't be considered.
     
  18. vandog

    vandog Merlie Girlie!

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    Looking through the responses to your thread, there are several breeders I would avoid entirely (for example, Hillcrest had THREE "Accidental" breedings last year), HN dogs are associated with ETS, and Ignited as mentioned has a pretty scary contract.
    I think you would do great with a dog from Kim (Powertripp). She is brutally honest about her dogs and that has paid off in the long run... many happy puppy buyers and her BC are both gorgeous and athletic - not something that goes hand in hand these days.
    Contact Point is also a great option.
     
  19. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    Do you have a source for the association with ETS and HN dogs? I train with a ton of them, literally my trainer herself has 5, and I've not seen any distinct issues with their jumping style/ability.

    Honestly HN aren't really my style as much as the CP dogs I train with but I will say the HN are probably a bit more balanced and less "sport" bred. On the flip side the CP I know can and do herd, well, and I prefer their smaller sizes. They're also though much more annoying single minded, obsessive, squeaky barking, dancing paws, faster and more chaotic dogs than the HNs I know which seem to have pretty nice off-switches and a bit slower/more workable for the average owner training style and yet they can still get the job done.
     
  20. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    The CPs & HNs I know tend to be pretty dog tolerant. Over all they are more focused on their owners and their toys though.

    Patron is an HN dog and he's in a fair number of my photo threads, he loves my dogs, he's just so happy to be around dogs. On thursday his owner was cleaning the carpets so she dropped him off at my work and I set him loose with 4 goldendoodles, a lab, a little corgi mixed breed, and another border collie, it took him maybe 5 minutes of adjusting and then he spent the day having a blast playing. He did however try and entice dogs to chase him through the weaves, over the teeter, up the aframe, into tunnels, and anything other way he could incorporate agility and dog play. He's a pretty cool dog really. IME most of the other HN dogs are like this, they can be a little less dog friendly but they're at least dog social.
    (at Schutzhund)
    [​IMG]

    Ayumi is a CP dog and she's in a fair number of my photos too. She's dog tolerant, like she'll let Sloan sniff her, but she's not dog friendly like she'll seek out a dog to play. Honestly she doesn't want much in life except a ball and maybe sheepies when she sees them.
    (at flyball, humorously we train agility with both of these dogs and I only have photos of them trying other sports it seems)
    [​IMG]

    I personally, for my style, would prefer a CP sporter collie but I know a lot of people who are adamant against them and prefer ranch dogs. Oh and if you do go with CP, don't tell her she has sporter collies. LOL
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2012

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