Your Definition of Ethics
- Thread starter lakotasong
- Start date
Redyre 
You chip all your pups with your own info?! Wow.. that is pretty respsonible...
I have no clue for technical what a responsible breeder is. A lot of the stuff on her sounds right.
Seeing as I got both my dogs for free in messed up situations I haven't had to go through the long arduous journey of finding a "good breeder" yet.
I imagine first and foremost what I'll look at, is not the dogs but the person in general. Their attitude.
Do they seem to generally care for their dogs?
Do they seem educated about dogs and their own breed in particular?
How many litters are "planned"?
Health guarentees (even though I don't think I would ever give a dog back) testing etc.
Even though it's a bit "debatey" (had to make up a word. LOL) This thread has been very informative for me. I plan on purchasing a confirmation dog in a few years and it's given me a lot of points to look for.
Thanks
You chip all your pups with your own info?! Wow.. that is pretty respsonible...I have no clue for technical what a responsible breeder is. A lot of the stuff on her sounds right.
Seeing as I got both my dogs for free in messed up situations I haven't had to go through the long arduous journey of finding a "good breeder" yet.
I imagine first and foremost what I'll look at, is not the dogs but the person in general. Their attitude.
Do they seem to generally care for their dogs?
Do they seem educated about dogs and their own breed in particular?
How many litters are "planned"?
Health guarentees (even though I don't think I would ever give a dog back) testing etc.
Even though it's a bit "debatey" (had to make up a word. LOL) This thread has been very informative for me. I plan on purchasing a confirmation dog in a few years and it's given me a lot of points to look for.
Thanks
No dogs should be bred unless they are conformationally correct (preferably Champions, but this depends on whether it's a working breed); excel in the work that they were bred to do; are OFA, CERF cleared, and any other ailments common in the breed; and most of all have a sound temperament. This is BECAUSE dogs dying in shelters mean something to me, if you are not breeding the best dogs possible and improving the breed, you might as well be sentencing dogs to death, because the last thing the country and world needs is to be flooded with more and more litters.
I agree with Summit about the breeder. To me, if the breeder does not give each of their dogs attention, exercise & love, they are irresponsible owners period. If their dogs sit in kennels and puppies are not given individual attention, no way. If they aren't involved in rescue, no way!!! If they have more than a few litters per year (especially if they have more than one litter at once), no way. If they do not make the effort to work their working dogs, no way. If they don't dedicate their lives to their breed, no way. If they don't require spay/neuter and return contracts, NOOO way. It's also extremely important to me that the breeder is educated about vaccinations & feeding. I wouldn't think twice about bypassing a breeder who feeds Iams, because that's extremely important to me.
I agree with Summit about the breeder. To me, if the breeder does not give each of their dogs attention, exercise & love, they are irresponsible owners period. If their dogs sit in kennels and puppies are not given individual attention, no way. If they aren't involved in rescue, no way!!! If they have more than a few litters per year (especially if they have more than one litter at once), no way. If they do not make the effort to work their working dogs, no way. If they don't dedicate their lives to their breed, no way. If they don't require spay/neuter and return contracts, NOOO way. It's also extremely important to me that the breeder is educated about vaccinations & feeding. I wouldn't think twice about bypassing a breeder who feeds Iams, because that's extremely important to me.
R
Yes, RCD, I do.
I did this 10 years ago with the first one, and will continue with the upcoming one.
My contract also specifies that any puppy I place may NEVER be sold, placed, or rehomed in ANY WAY without my express written permission. I retain the right of first refusal on all dogs I place, and this is a separate page of my sales contract.
There are significant monetary penalties for breach of any part of my contract regarding breeding or rehoming of a dog.
I get enough personal information from buyers that if I need to I can track them down. (SSN, DL#, DOB, etc)
I also require that I be kept updated on all phone number and address changes.
I don't plan to pry into any puppy owners lives, but I do firmly intend to see to it that ANY puppy I ever produce lives its life out in a loving responsible home. I will ALWAYS take ANY puppy back that I produce at any time in its life for any reason. Pretty much no questions asked.
For me, causing new life to occur is such a serious responsibility that I literally lose sleep over it. I will worry worry worry and plan plan plan until puppies are safely born, raised, and placed.
And then I will worry worry worry over health testing, titling, showing, breeding, etc etc etc.
HA. Having dogs is having a great chance to obsess over such things.
I did this 10 years ago with the first one, and will continue with the upcoming one.
My contract also specifies that any puppy I place may NEVER be sold, placed, or rehomed in ANY WAY without my express written permission. I retain the right of first refusal on all dogs I place, and this is a separate page of my sales contract.
There are significant monetary penalties for breach of any part of my contract regarding breeding or rehoming of a dog.
I get enough personal information from buyers that if I need to I can track them down. (SSN, DL#, DOB, etc)
I also require that I be kept updated on all phone number and address changes.
I don't plan to pry into any puppy owners lives, but I do firmly intend to see to it that ANY puppy I ever produce lives its life out in a loving responsible home. I will ALWAYS take ANY puppy back that I produce at any time in its life for any reason. Pretty much no questions asked.
For me, causing new life to occur is such a serious responsibility that I literally lose sleep over it. I will worry worry worry and plan plan plan until puppies are safely born, raised, and placed.
And then I will worry worry worry over health testing, titling, showing, breeding, etc etc etc.
HA. Having dogs is having a great chance to obsess over such things.
S
It is a very commercial food. Commercial foods = crap. Don't buy any food that you can buy at a grocery or department store. The companies tend to spend more money on how the bag look than the contents. I know people are led to believe that is good, high quality food but it is not. Its full of fillers and you have to feed your dog more to fill it up.
If you put your dogs on higher quality foods they will need to consume less and therefore poop less. There coat will be healthier and shinier, your dogs will be in better health period. Lets put it this way there are just too many pros of feeding high quality food to list.
Another little piece of advise is don't feed your dogs anything that says byproducts (ex. chicken byproducts, beef byproducts etc.) on the label. Thats a pretty good indication of a bad dog food although there is more to it than that.
If you put your dogs on higher quality foods they will need to consume less and therefore poop less. There coat will be healthier and shinier, your dogs will be in better health period. Lets put it this way there are just too many pros of feeding high quality food to list.
Another little piece of advise is don't feed your dogs anything that says byproducts (ex. chicken byproducts, beef byproducts etc.) on the label. Thats a pretty good indication of a bad dog food although there is more to it than that.
B
Every purebred dog breed has four dimensions to it that make it the breed it is; look, health, temperament, and ability. A responsible breeder will take into account all four of these dimensions before they breed. They will have a clear understanding of what these qualities are and why they are so important.
When I say *look* I’m referring to the physical appearance of the dog. Every breed of dog has a certain way it is suppose to look that is unique to it’s breed. The ideal specimen should have as many of these qualities as possible. How they keep track of what qualities each breed is suppose to have is through the dog’s breed standard. The breed standard outlines the qualities of the physical appearance of the breed. It also outlines the ideal temperament.
In regards to health, every breed has certain health problems that are common to it. Some have more than others because of multiple factors. The idea of breeding purebreds is to have the least amount of health problem possible, preferably none. Health testing is done on both parents, before breeding the litter, to determine if both dogs are free of genetic defects that could be passed on to the offspring. The breeder should also be familiar with at least four generations of the dog’s history; both parents. This is important when determining if there are any carriers of a disease in either parent’s history. Some defects skip over a generation. Health defect testing will only tell you if the dog has a defect, it doesn’t tell you if the dog is a carrier for a defect. By knowing the dog’s history, you can see if any of it’s relatives had any defects. If they did, it can tell you that the defect has skipped over one or more generations.
Temperament is another thing is impacts the breed and makes it unique. Every breed of dog has a slightly different temperament. Again, the idea is to breed dogs that come as close as possible to the breeds standard. This way, the dog will act the way it is said it’s suppose to act.
Ability means the dog can perform the function(s) that the breed was originally bred to do. Like a beagle being a good hunting dog, a golden retriever being good at retrieving and hunting, a border collie being good at herding, the mastiff being a good guard dog. Every breed has a reason it was bred for. It has an ability it is good at that makes it unique to every other breed. Some abilities are close to other breeds but each one is slightly different.
All of these four dimensions, put together, make up the breed you know and love. The catch is, all of these qualities must be worked for, through selective breeding. The founders of the breed made these qualities into the breed they are today, but it is through selecting breeding (picking out specimens that match the look, health, temperament, and ability of the breed) that maintain the breed’s uniqueness.
There are many types of breeders out there. Some breed only for health and temperament. Some breed only for look. Some breed only for ability. Some breed for ability and health. The list of possible combinations goes on and on. But the one thing all of these breeders are missing (the ones I just listed) is that they are not breeding for every dimension that the breed should have. So they are creating dogs that are only “half-pure” or “partial purebreds”. With every generation that goes on, that the breeder(s) do not breed for all four dimensions, the resulting litters become less and less like that of a purebred. Yes it is true, they will still technically have papers and be register able by the AKC, if both parents are purebred, but in reality they will not really be what they are suppose to be.
The quality of purebreds is not determined by the paper work, it is in how closely to the four dimensions the breeders breed them.
When I say *look* I’m referring to the physical appearance of the dog. Every breed of dog has a certain way it is suppose to look that is unique to it’s breed. The ideal specimen should have as many of these qualities as possible. How they keep track of what qualities each breed is suppose to have is through the dog’s breed standard. The breed standard outlines the qualities of the physical appearance of the breed. It also outlines the ideal temperament.
In regards to health, every breed has certain health problems that are common to it. Some have more than others because of multiple factors. The idea of breeding purebreds is to have the least amount of health problem possible, preferably none. Health testing is done on both parents, before breeding the litter, to determine if both dogs are free of genetic defects that could be passed on to the offspring. The breeder should also be familiar with at least four generations of the dog’s history; both parents. This is important when determining if there are any carriers of a disease in either parent’s history. Some defects skip over a generation. Health defect testing will only tell you if the dog has a defect, it doesn’t tell you if the dog is a carrier for a defect. By knowing the dog’s history, you can see if any of it’s relatives had any defects. If they did, it can tell you that the defect has skipped over one or more generations.
Temperament is another thing is impacts the breed and makes it unique. Every breed of dog has a slightly different temperament. Again, the idea is to breed dogs that come as close as possible to the breeds standard. This way, the dog will act the way it is said it’s suppose to act.
Ability means the dog can perform the function(s) that the breed was originally bred to do. Like a beagle being a good hunting dog, a golden retriever being good at retrieving and hunting, a border collie being good at herding, the mastiff being a good guard dog. Every breed has a reason it was bred for. It has an ability it is good at that makes it unique to every other breed. Some abilities are close to other breeds but each one is slightly different.
All of these four dimensions, put together, make up the breed you know and love. The catch is, all of these qualities must be worked for, through selective breeding. The founders of the breed made these qualities into the breed they are today, but it is through selecting breeding (picking out specimens that match the look, health, temperament, and ability of the breed) that maintain the breed’s uniqueness.
There are many types of breeders out there. Some breed only for health and temperament. Some breed only for look. Some breed only for ability. Some breed for ability and health. The list of possible combinations goes on and on. But the one thing all of these breeders are missing (the ones I just listed) is that they are not breeding for every dimension that the breed should have. So they are creating dogs that are only “half-pure” or “partial purebreds”. With every generation that goes on, that the breeder(s) do not breed for all four dimensions, the resulting litters become less and less like that of a purebred. Yes it is true, they will still technically have papers and be register able by the AKC, if both parents are purebred, but in reality they will not really be what they are suppose to be.
The quality of purebreds is not determined by the paper work, it is in how closely to the four dimensions the breeders breed them.
B
Responsible breeders keep in contact with the owner for the dog's whole life. If they move out of state the breeder will know about it because they call and visit the owner periodically. If the breeder doesn't feel that the potential owners are willing to keep this close relationship with the breeder, when the breeder is screening potential buyers for the future pups, the owners will not get a dog for them. After you buy a pup from a responsible breeder you are looking at a very long relationship with them. They don't end up in shelters.
Since you just cant resist my company Red, no, I havent had Dixie tested yet, I have had quite a lot on my plate to deal with.
And, our breed does not have a history of elbow or eye/sight problems so that will ptobably not be within her health testing requirements.
And I have been absolutly responsible.........100%, my pups and mom have all been completly taken care of. Everything responsible has been done.
I have alittle "dirt" on you Red, would you like to make this an all out battle for the world to read???I mean, every chance you get, you have to try to "show" everyone what a bad person that I am.............that is so immature!
I have never done a dang thing to you,. never, yet you persist.
We can hash up the past, you can tell on me(which is all in a search anyway) and I can tell on you, everything that has been volutarily sent to me over the net about you and your "breeding" program, and all its problems.
Many are proud of me for the way things have turned out, I am proud of myself................
Honestly............you sound complatly jealous!
And, our breed does not have a history of elbow or eye/sight problems so that will ptobably not be within her health testing requirements.
And I have been absolutly responsible.........100%, my pups and mom have all been completly taken care of. Everything responsible has been done.
I have alittle "dirt" on you Red, would you like to make this an all out battle for the world to read???I mean, every chance you get, you have to try to "show" everyone what a bad person that I am.............that is so immature!
I have never done a dang thing to you,. never, yet you persist.
We can hash up the past, you can tell on me(which is all in a search anyway) and I can tell on you, everything that has been volutarily sent to me over the net about you and your "breeding" program, and all its problems.
Many are proud of me for the way things have turned out, I am proud of myself................
Honestly............you sound complatly jealous!
No, I don't think that's a huge part of the problem, but it is a part of it, I'll admit that. I think that most dogs in shelters come from accidental breedings that produce unwanted pups. I'm not saying that everyone should breed their dogs, not everyone should, but if someone wants to breed their dog, then it's their choice to do that. I'm just saying that nobody has the right to condem someone for making the choice to breed their dog.
Now on to how eveyone says that health screening is so important....Cancer, Heart Disease, Altzheimers (sp?) all runs in my family, so does that mean I should never have children? This goes back to the greed comment I made about how some want the perfect dog (in their eyes). The perfect dog to me has nothing to do with looks or "breed standards", it's the personality. I understand things like 2 Aussie Merle's can't be bred b/c the pups will more than likely be blind and/or deaf, there are certain circumstances, but that's not health screening, that's general knowledge about a breed.
Regarding mixed breeds. If someone wants to cross one breed with another, it's their choice. If you believe that 2 different breeds should absolutely not be bred, then your also saying that different races of people should not have kids. And that is racism folks....
Now on to how eveyone says that health screening is so important....Cancer, Heart Disease, Altzheimers (sp?) all runs in my family, so does that mean I should never have children? This goes back to the greed comment I made about how some want the perfect dog (in their eyes). The perfect dog to me has nothing to do with looks or "breed standards", it's the personality. I understand things like 2 Aussie Merle's can't be bred b/c the pups will more than likely be blind and/or deaf, there are certain circumstances, but that's not health screening, that's general knowledge about a breed.
Regarding mixed breeds. If someone wants to cross one breed with another, it's their choice. If you believe that 2 different breeds should absolutely not be bred, then your also saying that different races of people should not have kids. And that is racism folks....
But not everyone looks at their dogs as "humans" per say, as I do and as I can tell you do too.
They ask how you can compare children to dogs or vice versa. I think the same, what is good for one is good for the other..........to a point. Now, I do not beleive in mix breeding, and all genetic diseases or health(major) problems do not need to be bred, this is just so the pup will never suffer. But things as allergies, can be bred out.............however, many say a dog with allergies should not be bred..................
They ask how you can compare children to dogs or vice versa. I think the same, what is good for one is good for the other..........to a point. Now, I do not beleive in mix breeding, and all genetic diseases or health(major) problems do not need to be bred, this is just so the pup will never suffer. But things as allergies, can be bred out.............however, many say a dog with allergies should not be bred..................
I agree with you there. A dog with a known disease or health problem should not be bred. But all this looking back 6 generations to find faults in the line is just going overboard.
I do believe though that cross breeding different breeds is okay. Nothing at all wrong with a mutt.
Let me add this, I never have and never will breed any dogs. I've thought about it but decided against it.
I do believe though that cross breeding different breeds is okay. Nothing at all wrong with a mutt.
Let me add this, I never have and never will breed any dogs. I've thought about it but decided against it.
Chi~Watch your words...........................Tell me again after the last pup has left, and I will be surprised!
The reason I do not beieve in breeding mutts is because there are so many now. I mean, there are o many stories of females gotten loose and knocked up, and such, that if everyone that did breed, bred a full blooded dog only, the world will still be full of mutts due to accidents!
Besides, I do also beleive in "preserving" a breed, keeping it clean as much as possible, guess I am just old fashioned that way......sentimental!
The reason I do not beieve in breeding mutts is because there are so many now. I mean, there are o many stories of females gotten loose and knocked up, and such, that if everyone that did breed, bred a full blooded dog only, the world will still be full of mutts due to accidents!
Besides, I do also beleive in "preserving" a breed, keeping it clean as much as possible, guess I am just old fashioned that way......sentimental!
S
I know some of you may disagree so lets agree to disagree right now. I feed Nutro Natural Choice. But I think any of the Nutro products are great. They also have Nutro Max & Nutro Ultra. Each of those 3 lines they have specific formulas for different needs. I absolutely love it. I worked at a pet store and all we sold was Nutro. I heard so many wonderful stories from people that switched their dogs to this food. One ladies dog was near death he was soooo sick all the time. She switched food and he is happy and healthy. Im not exactly sure what was wrong with him though. There are also a lot of other great foods available also. Does any one else have any suggestions for her?