Where do I begin??

Discussion in 'Dog Training Forum' started by yohan520, Feb 20, 2005.

  1. yohan520

    yohan520 New Member

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    I'm having several issues with a dog I recently found at a shelter- and I have no idea where I'm supposed to even start, so I'll just make a list of them-

    1. I've trained my dog to sit, but now, whenever she sees that I have a treat in hand, she'll automatically sit down. Without me ever telling her anything! She sits whenever she wants a treat- so am I supposed to encourage this behavior? How can I teach her to sit on command and now whenever she wants to?

    2a. Also, now that we fixed our backyard, we let her roam free. The only problem is, that when we want her to come back inside, she won't! She'll run away from us and even taunt us by coming close to us and running away when we're supposed to. We've tried giving her treats, petting her, whatever we could, but it's just not working! How can I get her to come in when we want her to?

    2b. Another problem, is that she'll find lot's of random items that seem to turn up out of nowhere- such as tennis balls, bones, bones, and more bones. I'm afraid that she'll choke on the bones so I've tried to take them away from her but now whenever she finds one, she'll run as if she's running for her life. She knows that I'll take away the bones if I catch her, but I'm only doing this for her own benefit. I've given her treats after confiscating the bones, but she seems to prefer the bones over the treats. What can I do?

    3. Also- how can I train my dog to fetch? Whenever she finds an item or when I try throwing a frisbee, she'll catch it and run away- After she's a safe distance, she'll chew on it and I'm afraid that she's eating some of it.

    4. How can I stop her from taking off with our shoes?? I tried to tell her that she was wrong by slapping the shoe against the ground and telling her that she was a bad dog, but I don't think it's a very effective way of training her.

    I realize that it is a lot of different issues, but I would appericiate any advice or help regarding this matter. THanks :)

    BTW- I believe that she is a min-pin- and she is an absolute angel when she is indoors.
     
  2. smkie

    smkie pointer/labrador/terrier Staff Member

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    Here is what I would do..I will start at the bottom and work my way up
    first we have a shoe box, it is wooden and we all put our shoes in there until our dog is past the chewing stage.
    To teach to fetch..do you have a hallway, you can throw one toy, while holding on to her collar, then turn her the other way and throw another..we call this a double. She will pick up the first one, remember the second and run for it. The trick is to catch her before she gets past you. A hallway is the best place to begin teaching retrieving because there is no where else to go but back to you. My old boss even had a long stretch of grass outside fenced on three sides, an outside hallway for dogs that we had trouble with getting them to return

    as to the bones, I would go out and remove all before she has access to them..we need to do a post about the danger of bones..my neighbor needs to read it bigtime for his trash raiding dog...and then find out how they are getting there in the first place. Someone has to be putting them there.
    Coming is a trust issue, there are all kinds of ways, from running the other way acting like your having the time of your life, to running a long cord and pulling them to you with loads of praise. Mostly I think it takes time and love so that they come to you out of respect..with a shelter dog that can take awhile, but Vic and I are there now..so I wish you luck
    lastly I don't like training with treats..I think it sends the wrong message, and besides the few times I have tried it i lost all their attention to the treat in my hand. The only time I did use it was for sitting pretty. Your love and affection should be all the reward a dog needs..kisses in the ears and telling them they are the best dog ever is the best treat they could get..
    all that is just my opinion, but that is what has worked for us..good luck
     
  3. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    I think SMKie has given you some excellent advice.

    A little trick I've used a few times to convince a dog to come when there was just too much fun she (Kharma!) wanted to have outside is to fake crying. When the dog comes to see what is wrong with you, you lavish the affection and let it think that it has 'saved' you from whatever was upsetting you. Dirty trick, but it works, lol! :D
     
  4. nicco

    nicco Wolfpack

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    LOL Renee. You're crazy (but in a good way) :D
    Kisses
    Nicco
     
  5. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    LOL! Nicco, if I wasn't nuts before, these Filas have made me that way! I swear, you have to stay on your toes all the time with them. I really don't think they're dogs at all - just extremely oversized cats in baggy dog suits. :D
     
  6. smkie

    smkie pointer/labrador/terrier Staff Member

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    I use to lay down in the pasture and pretend to be asleep or dead, whatever that pony cared to think I was, but it worked! I couldn't catch her any other way. It worked every time too. I think i came by it by accident the first time, i had chased her until i was winded and dizzy..did you shed a tear the first time and find it worked? When Bronki chewed up my last good pair of jeans that were hanging on the line, i sat down on the deck and had a good cry. He felt so bad, he never did it again.
     
  7. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    Just crocodile tears . . . I'm amazed Kharma fell for it, since she's the Queen of Trauma Drama, lol! She fakes crying all the time when she wants attention or when she wants me to get after Shiva for playing too rough. She's done it ever since I brought her home - deceitful little wretch!
     
  8. Debi

    Debi Moderator

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    LOL, Renee...I used to do the 'crying', too..for both dogs. It worked like a charm for quite awhile. I think they talked........they aren't falling for it anymore. Heaven forbid I am ever REALLY crying for them.......they'll be rolling their eyes. Now I make a high pitched sound.....Ham's big ears can't resist that one yet..and he's still curious. Addie has just matured to come when she's called...my drama bores her. :rolleyes:
     
  9. candy722

    candy722 New Member

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    There was a couple times that i was really crying because I was upset at my boyfriend and Toki came by my side and looks at me and acted like he knew what happened. He also gives me faces that his sad too. It's weird because he only does that when im crying.
     
  10. ChiliBeans

    ChiliBeans New Member

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    lol...Chili wised up to the fake crying act a long time ago when she figured out that everytime I did it I'd snag her! Now I have to lure her with a favorite toy. She can't resist her stuffed animals, and I'll hold it up in the air for her. When she jumps for it, I catch her in midair!

    About the question of how to get a dog to act on command...I have wondered about this myself. I was watching a show on television one day about some prison inmates who were training dogs. They were instructed to use a clicker of some sort to click whenever the dog performed the behavior. Then after they clicked they gave the dog the treat. Somehow the dogs were supposed to associate that click with performing the correct behavior rather than just the treat. I told my husband that I wish we had a clicker to use for Chili.
     
  11. caseyolee

    caseyolee Border Collies R' Us

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    Stop using treats for sitting. When she does what she's told, play w/ her fav. toy, or make a big deal that she sat when you told her. By make a big deal about it, I mean: "Good dog, that's a good dog, you are good" in that little kid voice, pet her like crazy. She'll get the idea.


    First, she needs to learn a recall (to come). To teach her a recall, get something she really likes (toy, treat, bone, whatever). Tell her to come, if she doesn't listen, IGNORE her. It's the best thing to do when shes taunting you. Just ignore her. Tell her to come again. When she finally does, play w/ her like mad w/ her fav. toy, give her her fav. treat, ect. You want her to know that if she comes to you, you will make it worth her while, that getting played w/ or getting her fav. treat is better than being ignored. When you have a good recall in the house, THEN move outside.

    You can also teach a recall on a 10-20foot long line (rope) outside. This needs to be used w/ a "choke collar" (you know, the ones that are chain that tighten when you pull). Say come, if she doesn't listen then give a tug on the rope. Not a break her neck tug, but so she feels it and it's uncomfortable. When she listens, play w/ her like mad w/ her fav. toy, give her her fav. treat, ect. She will get the point that's it's better to come and get a treat than have this collar make her uncomfortable.

    As long as they areen't chicken or poultry bones, she should be ok. They are the ones that splinter. Go around the yard/house and pick up all the things you think she could choke on. Then, go to the store and get a dog bone. Make sure it says made in the USA b/c they foreign ones have a cancer causing preservative in them.

    Question 2a. Teach her the recall before you start playing fetch. If she knows what come means, and when she brings the ball back, play w/ her like crazy, give her a treat, ect. Whatever she likes best. Make it worth her while to bring it back to you.

    It will take a long time for her to get the idea that shoes are bad. Get a squirt bottle and fill it w/ water. As she is chewing on the shoe, spray her in the face and say NO. If this doesn't work, and she likes the water (doesnt happen very oftten) then give her a slap on the end of the nose. Not SLAP, but make it uncomfortable and tell her NO. Soon, she will learn what NO means.
     
  12. BigDog2191

    BigDog2191 Big German Shepherd

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    That's actually very smart Renee, I've done that before :) .
     
  13. bonster

    bonster Disappointed :(

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    Hey Yohan, maybe some of my experiences might help...

    I had exactly the same with my rescue - Bonnie. I think - as someone else suggested to me on Chazhoud - out of the shelter, when outside your dog will be like a "kid in a candy store" with all the new exciting sights, smells etc! It helps to understand this to know your dog better and not get frustrated with what your dogs natural/healthy instincs will be...

    Funny about the treat - I think the key is that she sees it!
    Bonnie does that - think it just gets ingrained that when 'offered' a treat they come and sit for it! If you want to use the treat for something else (eg a good recall) you might have to hide it in your pocket (without doggie seeing) and pull it out at "reward time" - if you dog sees you get the treat I would guess its thinking... if I go and sit like a good dog I'll get that treat....

    Coming back has to become more interesting than your dog carrying on doing what its are doing (and that can be tough!) - use mega-praise when they return etc. I used a flexi(retractible) lead and normal collar or body harness to start with - to give gentle encouragement. I wouldn't suggest that you start with a "choke chain".... I also found it useful to lay off just general (un-earned, "free") praise/petting to help get the message over.... ie you want praise, come when I call and you'll get it....
    You want your dog to return becuase it wants to, not because its worried (fearful) about getting uncomfortable if it doesn't..

    On the shoes - I'd also add that I have to disagree with Caseolee about slapping the dogs nose though - you need to build trust and friendship with your dog - especially as its from a shelter - and I wouldn't suggest that this would do that - hopefully a stern "no" would get the message across, ideally as the objects are being taken - not afterwards, so that your displeasure is related to the immediate act.

    Just my .02 from experiences over the last 6 months... hope they help...
     
  14. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    Good post, Bonster. Bonnie sounds like she's coming out of her shell just beautifully. I remember when you first started posting about her she wouldn't play, and now look at her, chasing that soccer ball and having a HUGE time! You've made such a difference in her life.
     
  15. smkie

    smkie pointer/labrador/terrier Staff Member

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    I disagree on the bone topic..steak bones, porkchop, rib, all can puncture the intestine. SMall ham bones are horrible choking hazards as well..in our house..no bone is a good bone. One lady called me up late one night wanting to know if I knew why her dog was bleeding from the rectum...it was too old for parvo, and had been vacinated as well. The first thing I asked her was the bone question..the dog had gotten in to the trash that morning and injested some porkchop bones...I told her I would go to the er vet, but she did'nt and the next morning they found the dog dead.
    I keep any bones we may have in a can in the fridge until trash day, and then I pour bleach on it just in case the neighbor's dog gives my trash another go.
     

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