What do you think Joey has in him?

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by skittledoo, Sep 26, 2012.

  1. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    Sorry Amber, I think he's close enough to pure and if I were his owner I would AKC him as such and stop considering him a mix. Otherwise I'd presume he's a common mix associated with Ibizans. Azawakh are a bit obscure.
     
  2. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    Heck I know several 20 lb papillons. That's pretty far out of standard ;)
     
  3. GoingNowhere

    GoingNowhere Active Member

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    Honestly, he looks like an ibizan to me. I'd go so far as to say that he looks closer to standard than the vast majority of rescue purebreds I see around (comparing each dog to their own standards of course).

    If I were you, I'd be sending in a form from here:
    http://www.akc.org/reg/ilpex.cfm

    and coursing with him. Because in the end, even if he's *not* entirely purebred, if he enjoys it and you enjoy it and he was sold to you as a purebred, then who is it really hurting?


    Anyone who would be so bothered by you having fun with your dog should find something better to do with their time than complain about a well loved, well exercised dog.

    As a sidenote, I just love him and want to meet him!
     
  4. SizzleDog

    SizzleDog Lord Cynical

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    I agree with this, at least regarding the Azwakh comments. I've been fortunate enough to meet and interact with several (THANK YOU UKC!) and if Joey had Azawakh in him, I'd probably ask around to see if someone had slipped something in my drink.

    I do see Podengo in his face. (I've been lucky enough to spend a lot of time with all three sizes of Podengos as well - again THANK YOU UKC!) and if he has anything in him other than Ibizan.... I'd put my money on Podengo.

    BUT - from the admittedly limited knowledge I have of the history of Podengos in the United States, I'd be skeptical that a medio or grande got into "the wrong hands" in the first place. The Podengo people I know are insanely protective of their breed - much like the Ibizan folks - so I just don't easily see one ending up in a situation where it would be purposefully bred to an Ibizan.

    Granted, all the Podengo/Ibizan people I know are in the northern half of the country - I don't know anyone down in the Florida area. *shrug*

    Now, I am hesitant to tell the Ibizan people that they don't know their own breed. Heck, when people who are not in my breed try to tell me they know Dobermans better than I do... I feel a bit insulted! So I'm not touching that with a 10ft pole.

    Bottom line.... if AKC accepts him as a purebred Ibizan, he'll have a fun time coursing and I wish you all the best. If AKC won't accept him as a purebred Ibizan.... don't worry, come hang out with us CAT people. We're a fun bunch, even if some people don't want us around. ;)
     
  5. SaraB

    SaraB New Member

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    This. Anyone who gets offended by you participating in a sport your dog was bred for (even if he was a mix of some other sighthound), they have waaaay too much time on their hands. I say go for it.
     
  6. skittledoo

    skittledoo Crazy naked dog lady

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    You definitely have to soon!







    This is about how I feel on that matter.
     
  7. Gazehounds

    Gazehounds New Member

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    I would try to ILP him and see what AKC says. Just explain on the form that the previous owners said he was purebred and that he came from a breeder and leave it at that. Honestly, his dark eyes, pigment, and stop look "off" to me but anomalies happen so who knows? I know that none of that matters to you because he is a much-loved dream come true. We have Beezers and I showed pictures of him to my husband and he thought that Joey was a purebred but asked about his eyes. He's a very handsome dog and certainly has a bunch of Beezer traits. He obviously looked enough Ibizan for rescue to step up. He's well within standard size as well.

    The roach in his back could be crate related but it could also be related to a lack of muscle tone. A friend's Beezer (now a CH and on his way to his GCH) had a roached back when she got him and once she got him into coursing shape his back evened out and the roach was gone. He just needed better conditioning.
     
  8. momto8

    momto8 New Member

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  9. Dekka

    Dekka Just try me..

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    I don't think its a matter of knowing a breed. But knowing what the genetics do in a badly bred version of your breed. JRTs arent' supposed to have red noses but it happens. They aren't supposed to be brindle, that happens too. These are pointed out as not allowed BECAUSE they happen. If they didn't happen there wouldn't need to be rule for DQ. Why mention that something is a DQ if it never happens?

    If its mainly the nose I just wanted to know what the genes were in creating a darker nose yet of the correct colour. If that is genetically possible (which it sounds like it is via another poster) then there is no reason this couldn't be a purebred dog. Good breeders wouldn't have to deal with this issue so may be unfamiliar with it simply because they ARE good breeders.

    As to the beezer community knowing each and every dog. Then why don't the dogs in rescue all go back to their breeders? Why would you need breed rescue? How did this dog get bred then, as he is at least half if not more beezer....? Someone had to breed their dog. AND it should be simple to pinpoint the person as the breeds suggested as mixes are very rare. Those breeds are also less likely to have random breeders too.


    But if the beezer community is so sure he is mixed and they know far more than anyone else about what beezers look like when mixed (though this must almost never happen if they are as careful as Momto8 has implied) why ask us?

    All I see is a very handsome dog that to me looks more like the breed standard than many a purebred of other breeds look like theirs.
     
  10. YodelDogs

    YodelDogs New Member

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    I have shown dogs for 2 decades and I'm going to put in my 2 cents about conformation. I do not think Joey truly has a roached back. Any dog can roach up if they are standing with the hind legs too far up under them. Unfortunately, I can't put my hands on Joey and feel his spine myself so I have to go only on the photos provided.

    From a show standpoint, Joey does have a bad topline. He has a slight dip behind his withers and too much slope in the croup. This gives the appearance of a roached back. I believe that I could stack Joey in a show pose and get that back leveled out. Skittledoo, didn't you say something one time about visiting Georgia? If you do, perhaps we could meet up and I could try to stack him and see what happens.

    Joey has numerous conformation flaws but I think he is probably a purebred from a BYB. I would try to get a PAL from AKC. A dog does not have to be a top quality dog to get a PAL and I see no reason why he would be declined. :)
     
  11. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    Totally what I'm hoping.. I'd like to get a 'real' OB title on Arson.. so I'm filling out the CKC PEN form currently. He's too tall, out of standard but I'm hoping they don't deny him. Can't hurt to try though.
     
  12. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

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    That's a really good point. When Strider hit his puppy uglies his rear looked over angled and dropped off, so it felt uncomfortable for him to extend his rear out in a stacked pose. It made him look roached at times, and he really did not have a roached back. When he finished maturing he came back together and now it's fine.
     
  13. Teal

    Teal ...ice road...

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    Ibizans aren't MY breed.. but I have spent years with them in the field, and with their breeders.

    My personal opinion is that there is Podengo in there. EVERYTHING about him - from his head, to his pigment, to his coat, to his structure - says Podengo/Ibizan mix to me.

    Azawakh? Not a chance. There is nothing about his structure, coat, or temperament that hints at Azawakh.

    I would certainly like to see if the AKC accepts him into their PAL program as an Ibizan! It wouldn't surprise me if they did.
     
  14. MericoX

    MericoX Roos, Poos, & a Wog!

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    He kinda looks like a giant Junior.
     
  15. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    Not sure how different CKCs PEN is from AKC's PAL. But there would be no doubt about him getting a PAL. Are you concerned because of his size?
     
  16. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    I'm concerned as the CKC is far more hardcore.. My pics need to have size written on the back, signed by a vet, he has to be microchipped and they only take specific brands.. proof of alteration..

    Anything they feel is awry, your application vanishes and you don't get CKC approved. They could turn me down on his size, not liking the pics, deciding the reason he has no registration isn't good enough.. Happened with Smudge. Smudge was (is) full AKC reg, seems though it was the correct chip company it was not a chip they approved of.. couldn't be bothered to contact me.. my application vanished.. had to call repeatedly to get answers.. So none of mine have CKC registration, performance or otherwise.. AKC is way better to deal with. Sadly I'm close to the border but not quite close enough to trial across it regularly..
     
  17. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    That's too bad Mafia. I've known breeders in Canada with CKC registered dogs who have had a really hard time getting CKC to send them papers for litters. People complain about AKC's ethics or whatever but they are professional, send things in a timely manner and try to be as helpful as possible if you call or email with questions.
     
  18. SevenSins

    SevenSins Guest

    And what are the odds of those two breeds just happening upon each other and creating such a cross? Unless we magically found the one person on earth who happens to own both breeds AND happened to have an "oops" litter...
     
  19. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

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    Well, back when I thought his nose was black that's what I thought he was. It's pretty common for ibizan breeders to also keep podengos. They're pretty compatible I guess. I know of three that have both breeds, and I don't know that many beezer breeders at all.

    ETA: And GRIN imports a batch of Spanish sighthound rescues every year. They have a lot of podengo/beezer/galgo blends. Since Amber was told he came from a Florida breeder though, I don't think that's where he came from. I think their dogs are all chipped before getting adopted out too.
     
  20. Zoom

    Zoom Twin 2.0

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    I have nothing to contribute as far as what Joey is-- other than adorable--but I've seen crazy stuff in otherwise well bred litters. My old training mentor had an Aussie from a pretty decent breeder. Just looking at him you would swear up, down and sideways he was a Sheltie mix: way too small, flat stop, just incorrect in a variety of ways. But the rest of his litter looked just fine; he was just a random genetic fsckup as far as his conformation went.
     

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