very frustrated with potty training...please help!

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by nancy2394, Aug 9, 2005.

  1. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    I had 4 dogs but recently lost 3 to old age and si
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    Georgia
    My neighbor's jack russel terrier mix had puppies May 24th. She had 7 puppies in all. I had first pick of the litter because she is my friend and neighbor. I picked out what I thought would be a great puppy.

    I got her at 5 weeks of age... seemed a little too early to be weaned if you asked me.. but that's water under the bridge. This puppy has been loved, cuddled, praised, and adored by myself, my husband and our 15 year old daughter. She has been a good puppy with the exception of her pooping and peeing everywhere in the house!!

    At first I thought maybe her young age and inability to control her urge and hold her bladder and bowel movements was the problem. But another neighbor up the street also got a pup from this litter and she has not done anything different with training her puppy than I have with mine. Her puppy has the occasional accident in the house... but otherwise completely trained and will even ask to go out. Mine won't even attempt to give us a signal she has to go out and she is taken outside many many times through out the day.

    We have tried various methods of potty training her with no success. I can't figure out why she will go to the bathroom just about every time you take her outside and you praise her and she comes in and I'll be damned if she doesn't squat in a corner or leave a turd on the floor.... and this is AFTER she's already gone outside. She knows she's wrong because when we catch her doing it and jump up to grab her she runs like hell to hide.

    I have now resorted to doing what I know I'm not suppose to do. I am using her crate as a punishment because I am fed up with the messing several times a day all over my carpets. She has pooped and peed in her kennel from day one. I was told that if a puppy does that then they are a "bad" pup and will never learn to potty train.

    Please tell me this isn't true.... I love this puppy. But I am to the point that if she doesn't learn to only relieve herself outside I will have no other option but to keep her locked up all the time or find her a new home. And I'm afraid someone else might not have had the patience I've displayed with her and she might end up beat or thrown outside. Please can anyone help me with this. I am open to any suggestions... maybe there's something I haven't tried yet. I know locking her in her kennel to punish her is probably the worst thing I can do... but I'm so frustrated with her. :(
     
  2. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    First thing, how big is the crate that you use? It needs to be just big enough for her to turn around and lie down, otherwise they can pee in a corner and sleep in the other.

    Puppies are very rarely potty trained at 2 months, it takes months for them to get it. The key is to praise them when they pee outside, and when they do inside in front of you, say a firm no and pick them up and take them outside again. They usually get it eventually.

    But yes, it will take a while, and you will have more pees and poops in the house. Take her outside as much as you can, every 30 minutes or so, after playing, napping, eating. Even then, there will be accidents, sometimes pups are so busy playing they just forget and lose it, it takes a few months for them to be able to hold their bladder at all time.
     
  3. Irish

    Irish New Member

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    I think she is just too young. 5 weeks is way too early. Even though your neighbor got one at the same time and is not having that problem, she probably just got lucky. I'm sure others will have great advice for you, but I think you are going to have to keep working with her, taking her out very frequently and wait until she gets a little older. I know its frustrating, but if you give her up, I think she'll have a really hard time getting another home.
     
  4. Saje

    Saje Island dweller

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    Wow, you need a little more patience! And I mean that nicely. You already know that using the crate as punishment is the worse thing you can do. You are not going to have a puppy that is reliably housetrained until about 6 months give or take. Part of the problem may be because you got her so young. 8 weeks is the minimum.

    Here's Mordy's post about crate training. I think it's the best one I've seen.

    http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showpost.php?p=49374&postcount=6
     
  5. juliefurry

    juliefurry Rusty but Trusty

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    Puppies won't learn to control their bladder until between 3 and 6 months of age. My youngest pup is around 11 weeks old and he does ok with going outside although you can take him outside and he'll go and then bring him back in and when you go back to the kitchen five minutes later he'll have messed in the kitchen. You might want to try keep the puppy leashed to you at all times of the day that way you'll be able to tell her signs on when she has to go outside. Also don't leave food out for her to eat whenever she is hungry feed her three or four small meals a day (depending on how old she is now). Take her outside ten or fifteen minutes after eating and play with her until she goes potty. I usually take my 11 week old puppy out every fifteen minutes when he's not crated and he'll go. He's only had one accident a day for the past three days. Make sure you praise your puppy and treat you puppy whenever it goes outside. When your puppy goes inside ignore it and don't let it see you clean up it's mess. Don't feel bad though my oldest puppy is going to be a year at the end of this month and he STILL isn't housebroken.
     
  6. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    I had 4 dogs but recently lost 3 to old age and si
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    We altered the crate so she only has enough room to turn around and lay down and she doesn't care... she'll just poop and pee and lay right in it. I have had dogs all my life and i know each puppy is different and require different time spans before they are trained... but you usually see some kind of progress with them.

    We tried making the kennel a friendly and "safe" place for her to be. We had a nice cushy pillow and toys and we even would put a shirt that had our scent on it in the kennel with her. She never appeared to be scared or traumatized by the kennel.

    I may not sound like I've been patient with her... but this has been going on for several weeks now with no change. And I wouldn't get so frustrated if I wasn't taking her out so often and doing all the things they tell you to do. I didn't want to take her until she was 8 weeks old but as fate would have it I had to take her at 5 weeks or she was gonna have to go to another home because the owner wanted them gone because the momma dog already had weaned them and was now biting them because they wouldn't leave her alone.

    I thought about getting some of those puppy pads for in the house and do that indoor and outdoor training a lot of people are recommending. I've even thought of getting some puppy diapers but she's too small for them.

    I truly love this puppy and don't wanna give up on her. I am willing to stick it out and do what I have to if I know it's gonna work. I am just having this fear that she will never potty train.
     
  7. juliefurry

    juliefurry Rusty but Trusty

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    I'm sure she will get potty trained. You sound like a very devoted doggy mommy. She's young give her time. I'm sure with your patience she will get it.
     
  8. Mikey27X834

    Mikey27X834 New Member

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    Just take her from her crate to the outside every half hour and say "toilie" and wait for about 5 mins. If she goes, praise her and give her treats. If she doesn't, just take her back inside, put her in her crate, and wait another half an hour. Release her from her crate again and take her outside to poop and say "toilie" again and repeat.

    Just be consistant, patient and use positive reinforcement. Don't use the crate as punishment. It's supposed to be a happy place for the Dog, not a bad place.
     
  9. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    mikey... we did that. And whenever she would go outside and relieve herself we'd praise her and give her a treat. Then of course we'd have to give our adult dog a treat because she couldn't understand why the pup would get one and not her...lol. And if she did her business outside we gradually increased her play time outside the kennel. If she went outside and did nothing then she went right back into the kennel and was taken out again a little while later. This is why I am so frustrated with the whole thing because i am truly trying everything with her. And to my own shame I admitted I did resort to using the kennel as punishment recently. I knew it was wrong when I did it, but my frustration level exceeded a comfortable level at that time.
     
  10. Mikey27X834

    Mikey27X834 New Member

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    Yeah, I can see why that would be frustrating. Good thing in my house, only one room downstairs has carpet lol. Maybe the reason she poops inside despite her knowing it's wrong is because she has some sort of medical problem? Maybe you could take her to the vet? Maybe she does it for attention? There must be a reason for it. Try and find the cause and work on it.
     
  11. YorkieLover

    YorkieLover New Member

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    This is what puppies do, they have accidents.. You just clean it up and go on.... It takes time to potty train as everyone has mentioned above, some dogs get it right away others take months. If the dog is using it's crate to potty in I would get the dog out of the crate. Our new puppy did the same thing and I finally took him out and put him in a puppy safe room (our bathroom) with a baby gate up. He has a potty pad in there (if he needs it), his bed, toys and water. This has worked fantastically. The other thing you can do is leash him to you so you know when he needs to go and you can get him outside. I believe someone else suggested that above.
     
  12. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    I had 4 dogs but recently lost 3 to old age and si
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    she's already been to the vet and has a clean bill of health. There's no medical reason this pup should be so against relieving herself outside...lol. The vet told me to put her in the crate ALL the time except when she is taken outside to relieve herself and to put her right back in the kennel. I got weak and felt bad for her so I started to increase her times out of the kennel if she did good by using the bathroom outside. Obviously I've got this poor puppy all confused now with all the DIFFERENT methods of potty training we've tried over the past several weeks. She needs consistency and i guess I'm just trying to decide on which method is the best with the highest success. So, that is why i am here at this forum.. hoping I will get some good advice.
     
  13. YorkieLover

    YorkieLover New Member

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    So how old is the puppy now? If the puppy is doing it's business outside then coming in and pooping again could you be feeding too much? Do you feed on a schedule? This makes a difference in the potty training aspect as well. Also, if you limit the area of the house the puppy is allowed in it also helps with less areas the puppy can potty in. We kept our first one baby gated in the back 3 rooms of the house that way we could keep in eye on her and know when she started sniffing around she needed to go outside. We feed twice a day that way they are only pottying 2 to 3 times a day. I know they go 1st thing in the a.m., right after breakfast and right after dinner. We also put the water dish up by 7:00 that way there is no need to potty during the night.
     
  14. Mikey27X834

    Mikey27X834 New Member

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    Does she have a favourite place in the house? Maybe you could restrict her to that place so she can't move around much and then use that as a substitute for a crate?
     
  15. YorkieLover

    YorkieLover New Member

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    When I put pottying 2 to 3 times a day I meant pooping... What goes in must come out... LOL
     
  16. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    I had 4 dogs but recently lost 3 to old age and si
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    I'm used to feeding rotties... so maybe I am over feeding her. But I only give her one scoop of puppy chow in the morning and then around lunch time and again around dinner time because she's always hungry. She does have water just about everytime she goes outside because that is where my big dog eats and drinks is on the back porch. We used to feed her in the kitchen but she's such a slobby water drinker that she gets it all over the floor and you can't see it on the tiles until you hit it with your bare feet and go for a slide nearly killing yourself as you plummit to the floor.

    She doesn't eat after that last feeding and will only get a few licks of water while passing by the water dish to go off the porch to do her business. She goes all night long without having accidents and even sleeps in the bed with my daughter now because none of us were getting any sleep with her crying ALL night long. You'd think she'd get tired of yipping and crying... but she can carry on for hours at a time. So, with great apprehension we allow her to sleep in the bed and all seems well.

    She's a real small dog... I am amazed at how much she can poop and pee. She's probably only about 4 or 5 pounds and she's 11 weeks old today. I don't think she's gonna get very big. Oh you guys don't know how bad I want to do the right thing with her and get our lives back to normal with a happy, content and toilet trained puppy. I guess I got it easy with all my other dogs... none of them ever had this trouble. So, I guess I still have a lot to learn about training.
     
  17. Saje

    Saje Island dweller

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    Some dogs just don't do well in crates. If you she is peeing and pooping in the crate and is now associating it with bad things I wouldn't use it.

    Clean her messes with Nature's Miracle, Petastic or Urine Away which have enzymes that help get rid of all the odours (even the ones only she can smell)

    When she is out of the puppyproofed room or crate tie her leash around your waist so you can always see her and take her outside right away. You'll learn her signals faster and she won't be as bored. It's a good way to bond
     
  18. nancy2394

    nancy2394 New Member

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    i have bonded so much with this puppy already.... i can't imagine our lives without her despite her obvious rebellion...lol. I find myself kissing her right on her little puppy mouth and she licks me all over my face. I think we may actually be holding her too much. Seems like she's always in my lap cuddling with me at the computer when she's not banished to her crate. We play all the time and she is never out of my site for more than a minute maybe two. I can try the leash thing... but she never leaves my side when she's out of her kennel. If i'm sitting in my chair at the desk.. .she's jumping on my leg crying for me to pick her up.

    As far as the signs she has to go out... I must be missing them cuz I never notice any signs except when she first gets up from a nap it's pretty obvious she's itchy pants and needs to go out. She sniffs all over the carpet on a regular basis so it's hard to decifer if she's sniffing for a place to potty or if she's just sniffing for the heck of it. We usually just go ahead and take her out just in case and 9 out of 10 times she will pee... but I think it's just coincidence.

    We have cleaned up all her accidents within minutes of them occuring but have just used oxy clean or those bleach wipes... maybe i need to go ahead and get those items you mentioned to neutralize the odor she can smell that maybe we can't smell. I guess I will just have to shampoo all the carpets and start over.

    She has even peed all over our brand new couch on several occasions when she showed absolutely no signs of having to potty. So, needless to say... she is now banished from the couch. She is the most lovable puppy ever and I can't wait for the day she learns to potty only outside...lol.

    I think I will take that divider out of her kennel, put her cushy little bed back in there with her toys and a tshirt with out scent on it. And try putting her in the kennel several times a day with the door open until she goes in there willingly and it's a safe haven for her. Maybe she has just decided to think of that kennel as a torture chamber and that's why she's acting out by messing all in it time and time again. So, if she's not forced to stay in it she may actually want to go in it after she decides it's not such a bad place after all.

    Well, I guess I've taken up enough of everyone's time. I want to thank all of you for replying to my post and I truly appreciate the great advice you've been giving me. I am not throwing in the towel yet... now I gotta convice hubby she's worth working with.

    Oh, and on that note... my nose tells me she just did a dookie load in her kennel. Time for yet another bath and kennel cleaning. But I love my puppy.... I just have to keep telling myself that...lol.
     
  19. filarotten

    filarotten Moderator

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    The one thing I have learned with Brutus my fila baby is you cannot be impatient with them when you are outside. He learned to go potty in two days, I would say potty and he would go. Never had a dog do this before. Problem was when he came in he would go again. So we made sure he pottied twice before he came in. We also took him out every 20 minutes, had a small bladder I guess for the first two weeks. He actually mastered the bark or whine to poopie within a week. He has finally learned to bark to go potty but we have to be quick or he will start to tinkle. I also took him out every time he would bark so he would get the idea that if i bark i go outside also.Hope this will help. The main thing is to stay calm. I know it can be frustrating we were all tired. He would have to go out about 2:30 everynight. And again about 5:00 am. We actually put him in bed with us so we would know when he started getting restless. Thank god he now makes it until 6:00 a.m. You might also want to clean up any spots with a stain and urine remover. Also Brutus is getting so big he would rather sleep in his bed. Thank goodness for that. He was a bed hog!
     
  20. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    Maybe the problem is that she only drinks when outside. So she goes out to pee, but drinks again, and as soon as she's back in she wants to pee again. I would give her water inside, and take her out 20 minutes after she drinks.

    But I wouldn't worry about confusing her with different training methods. As long as she gets praised when she goes outside, it's fine. I wouldn't worry much either about using the crate as punishment. When you send kids to their bedroom because they did something stupid, do they hate their bedroom? No. They're just annoyed they can't be with everyone. I really don't think it's different for dogs, I've used it to isolate my pups a lot and they still go in there to sleep.

    I would definitely stop using the crate for potty training though. The whole point of it is that they don't pee in it, so if they do, it's pretty useless to use it for this reason, and it gives you more work because you have to clean the crate AND the dog. So yeah, make it as big as you can so that she doesn't lie in it at least.

    But you seem to know what you are doing :) It's just going to have to take lots of patience.
     

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