Teddy Bear 'Mohammad'
- Thread starter GipsyQueen
- Start date
I don't think you're reading the posts properly.
Nobody is CONDONING the act, but people are having empathy with the belief systems.
You know empathy? Put yourself in someone else's shoes and seeing the world through their eyes
Doesn't make it right or wrong.
Of course noone in the western world will agree to someone being punished for calling a bear a name - that is idiotic. But to the people who believe in this, then it is HUGELY offensive.
You have your beliefs, and you feel passionately about them, and will fight for them - they're doing no different.
The point I was making earlier is that this is a mistake that should NEVER have happened in the 1st place... But it has, so we have to deal with it.
Nobody is CONDONING the act, but people are having empathy with the belief systems.
You know empathy? Put yourself in someone else's shoes and seeing the world through their eyes
Doesn't make it right or wrong.
Of course noone in the western world will agree to someone being punished for calling a bear a name - that is idiotic. But to the people who believe in this, then it is HUGELY offensive.
You have your beliefs, and you feel passionately about them, and will fight for them - they're doing no different.
The point I was making earlier is that this is a mistake that should NEVER have happened in the 1st place... But it has, so we have to deal with it.
Oh so you mean how other countries other than the US and Canada don't look down upon BYB's and puppy mills because it is normal to them? Yet people on this site seem to get more upset about that then they do about the idea that a group of people want a teacher put to death because of a Teddy Bear name. it's just culture right?
See here's the thing.... Everyone wants to compare islam extremists to christian extremists.... Ok Fine.... yet a few years ago a guy displayed a jar of urine with a crucifix in it... yet I didn't hear about a group of Christians screaming to have him put to death.
I understand that cultures differ.... but everyone screams bloody murder when christians try to force their beliefs on someone else (IE: say calling for the murder of someone using Jesus' name in vain) yet when a "minority" group or a different "culture" does it it's OK because they have different beliefs?
I have to call bluff on this one.
See here's the thing.... Everyone wants to compare islam extremists to christian extremists.... Ok Fine.... yet a few years ago a guy displayed a jar of urine with a crucifix in it... yet I didn't hear about a group of Christians screaming to have him put to death.
I understand that cultures differ.... but everyone screams bloody murder when christians try to force their beliefs on someone else (IE: say calling for the murder of someone using Jesus' name in vain) yet when a "minority" group or a different "culture" does it it's OK because they have different beliefs?
I have to call bluff on this one.
The fact that we don't impose economic sanctions and call for U.N. resolutions against governments which treat thier citizens like this is a reflection of just how firmly connected we are to the Mid-east oil teat.
I would also add that tolerating this conduct is one of the biggest failures of true Liberalism (the Truman variety) in developed countries.
Islam will not change or modernize, it has too many safeguards built into it's political ideology for that to happen. It must be marginalized, vilified and eradicated.
I would also add that tolerating this conduct is one of the biggest failures of true Liberalism (the Truman variety) in developed countries.
Islam will not change or modernize, it has too many safeguards built into it's political ideology for that to happen. It must be marginalized, vilified and eradicated.
Islam and muslims can change and modernize, if the rest of the worlds cultures push for it and the muslims want it. A minority of muslims want to impose sharia law not only on their fellow muslims but infidels as well.
The Christian faith modernized and changed with the rest of the worlds modern cultures, in some cases Im sure they led the change.
The Christian faith modernized and changed with the rest of the worlds modern cultures, in some cases Im sure they led the change.
I'll agree with you there. I was in a class with a Muslim who was raised to be.. well, he was on the extreme end of Islam. He actually lost it and started screaming, cursing, and gesturing, and threatening my friend Alex with bodily harm when Alex told one of those 'three guys walk into a bar' jokes and the joked-upon one was Muhammad. So yes, you'd hope she would have been smart enough not to do that when she was in a country full of Muslims... even though I don't consider naming something after someone idol worship... and I don't think anyone here would, either, and IMO anyone in an 'evolved' (sorry I'm stealing your words there, Puck) society.
I do not, however, agree with punishing her for it. She made a dumb, but NOT unforgivable mistake (IMO.. clearly not to the people there) and just needs to be escorted back to Britain, not barbarically punished. How insane.
But.. correct me if I am wrong.. isn't Sudan the country that let a woman be gang-raped because her relative allegedly had relations with a priest or something? I'm probably mangling that story.. but that was the gist. WHY are we friendly with countries that condone that sort of thing?
I do not, however, agree with punishing her for it. She made a dumb, but NOT unforgivable mistake (IMO.. clearly not to the people there) and just needs to be escorted back to Britain, not barbarically punished. How insane.
But.. correct me if I am wrong.. isn't Sudan the country that let a woman be gang-raped because her relative allegedly had relations with a priest or something? I'm probably mangling that story.. but that was the gist. WHY are we friendly with countries that condone that sort of thing?
I agree with Nolu. Why do we feel the need to be friendly and accept a country who slashes people as a punishment or lets a women get gang raped? We don't accept it - and we don't have to, because we are, like I've said before as a whole, we are a modern world. Our religion and other religions have changed and evolved, why can't they? Change isn't always a bed thing.
And there is the real answer... Energy independance, NOW. Lets mine all the energy we have, NOW. Build nuke plants, drill ANWR...whatever it takes. If we can become energy independant.... We no longer become slaves to those animals.
All the while doing the above, get real serious about alternative energy. REAL serious, like lets have a "leader" give us a 'moon shot' speech about becoming energy independant.
All the while doing the above, get real serious about alternative energy. REAL serious, like lets have a "leader" give us a 'moon shot' speech about becoming energy independant.
They're humans.
You dehumanise them to make your hatred more rational, but they are human beings.
There are women, and children, and good men living there.
There are good morals as well as bad ones.
They're not so different to us. People in the west have tortured, killed, maimed in the name of their religion. Still do.
I think that you have a very bitter view of humanity. You want to change the world? Want to make it a safe place for your daughter? Try making friends and not enemies.
You dehumanise them to make your hatred more rational, but they are human beings.
There are women, and children, and good men living there.
There are good morals as well as bad ones.
They're not so different to us. People in the west have tortured, killed, maimed in the name of their religion. Still do.
I think that you have a very bitter view of humanity. You want to change the world? Want to make it a safe place for your daughter? Try making friends and not enemies.
And puck, I am sure you will reply with some "well thought out" reply about how I am wrong and you are right - but you won't sway me. I have no doubt I won't sway you.
All I can say is I am THANKFUL that I am not alone in the way I think. I hope the bitter kind of thinking dies out - when they've all barrackaded themselves in, or fought each other to the death....
In the meantime, I hope the people who are educating keep on educating. This isn't a political incident - it's a lesson. Everytime something happens we learn something about a culture we don't really understand. And the more we learn, the more we can communicate.
I am just glad the woman is safe - and I know she has had nothing bad to say about the people who arrested her.
All I can say is I am THANKFUL that I am not alone in the way I think. I hope the bitter kind of thinking dies out - when they've all barrackaded themselves in, or fought each other to the death....
In the meantime, I hope the people who are educating keep on educating. This isn't a political incident - it's a lesson. Everytime something happens we learn something about a culture we don't really understand. And the more we learn, the more we can communicate.
I am just glad the woman is safe - and I know she has had nothing bad to say about the people who arrested her.
Don't try to analyze me Dizzy. You obviously have no idea where I am coming from on this issue.
Yes, they are humans and as such, have the same basic rights all humans do. Also, I do not hate them. Actually, I want what they want... For them to have their part of the world all to themselves. Really.
Yes, I have a bitter view of some parts of humanity. Wanna know why? I have been up close and personal with these people. I was there when we were TRYING to help them, feed them and all that. And they still tried to kill us... Why? Because we were infidels on their piece of dirt. I lost good friends trying to help those people, so please spare me your book knowledge lecture. Go there, talk to them... Not the safe places but the places where the true belivers are. Try and "educate" them... Try to make friends with them. Just like you have been saying in this thread, OUR ideas of right and wrong do not apply to them. But I do know what has happened when we try to play nice with them, over and over again....
Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me.
What are you trying to say by putting well thought out in quotes? Also, I am not trying to say you are wrong and I am right. I just hope to get you to see where I am coming from on this and it is NOT from hate. You, like most people who think the way you do, have great intentions and only want to help. The difficulty is turing those good intentions into positive results. I pray that you find a way to achieve your goal, because I don't want to fight them anymore.
The world needs people like you Dizzy... But it also needs people like me.
First you insult my intellect and now you wish death upon me... I am sure thats not what you meant, but that is how I see it.
It is indeed a lesson. And I agree. Education is the key. Education and change the way Muslims treat women. Basically, until Islam moves out of the 8th century, this will never get better.
Of course not... She is not that stupid.
Yes, they are humans and as such, have the same basic rights all humans do. Also, I do not hate them. Actually, I want what they want... For them to have their part of the world all to themselves. Really.
Yes, I have a bitter view of some parts of humanity. Wanna know why? I have been up close and personal with these people. I was there when we were TRYING to help them, feed them and all that. And they still tried to kill us... Why? Because we were infidels on their piece of dirt. I lost good friends trying to help those people, so please spare me your book knowledge lecture. Go there, talk to them... Not the safe places but the places where the true belivers are. Try and "educate" them... Try to make friends with them. Just like you have been saying in this thread, OUR ideas of right and wrong do not apply to them. But I do know what has happened when we try to play nice with them, over and over again....
Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me.
What are you trying to say by putting well thought out in quotes? Also, I am not trying to say you are wrong and I am right. I just hope to get you to see where I am coming from on this and it is NOT from hate. You, like most people who think the way you do, have great intentions and only want to help. The difficulty is turing those good intentions into positive results. I pray that you find a way to achieve your goal, because I don't want to fight them anymore.
The world needs people like you Dizzy... But it also needs people like me.
First you insult my intellect and now you wish death upon me... I am sure thats not what you meant, but that is how I see it.
It is indeed a lesson. And I agree. Education is the key. Education and change the way Muslims treat women. Basically, until Islam moves out of the 8th century, this will never get better.
Of course not... She is not that stupid.
The only way Islam can become civilized is if they (Muslims) go against the teachings of Muhammed IE: the Quran and the hadith(s) must be rejected, and we all know that's not gonna happen. If the Brits wouldn't have came to the rescue ... that lady would have her head off for the publics enjoyment of their prophet's teachings in the Muslim world. Sad but true.
As per the Muslim world reading how the infadels spared this ladies life ... how ya think they like us now?
What they need is their own country's to practice Islam as Muhammed teaches it, in moderation of course. They can too thank the American Soldier for aiding them and forcin' them along that very path to civilization. Wether they like it or not.
Good postin' Puck.
Ohh shucks, I forgot for a sec I'm a lady when I posted this ... off with my head naw.
As per the Muslim world reading how the infadels spared this ladies life ... how ya think they like us now?
What they need is their own country's to practice Islam as Muhammed teaches it, in moderation of course. They can too thank the American Soldier for aiding them and forcin' them along that very path to civilization. Wether they like it or not.
Good postin' Puck.
Ohh shucks, I forgot for a sec I'm a lady when I posted this ... off with my head naw.
I have yet to see anyone condoning the punishment, just an attempt to look at it in their perspective.
Dizzy I agree with you completely. I'd keep replying but I feel like I am banging my head up against a brick wall.
All I hear is typical us versus 'them', which is ridiculous. Islam is a varying religion with different sects and differing beliefs- some more strict than others. Muslims are individuals who also have varying beliefs. Shocking, I know. Muslim countries also vary in their laws (and how 'westernized' they are) and the ways they deal with issues like this. To paint them all with one brush stroke is ignorant. I, nor anyone else here, is saying there are not horrible things done in the name of Islam or that they happen far too often, but instead we are trying understand why this happens and to point out that generalizations based on these instances do no good.
All I see here is hate and I really do not want a part of it.
Dizzy I agree with you completely. I'd keep replying but I feel like I am banging my head up against a brick wall.
All I hear is typical us versus 'them', which is ridiculous. Islam is a varying religion with different sects and differing beliefs- some more strict than others. Muslims are individuals who also have varying beliefs. Shocking, I know. Muslim countries also vary in their laws (and how 'westernized' they are) and the ways they deal with issues like this. To paint them all with one brush stroke is ignorant. I, nor anyone else here, is saying there are not horrible things done in the name of Islam or that they happen far too often, but instead we are trying understand why this happens and to point out that generalizations based on these instances do no good.
All I see here is hate and I really do not want a part of it.