Tail Docking ?

[chinchow]

I hate when government comes in to dictate citizen's lives, including how their animals should look.

And who are you to say that an animal needs to have a part of it's body taken away?

There's no reason for it to be done these days. The health risks are mostly myth. I have more then enough experience, facts, studies, common sense behind me to prove that. Having a tail doesn't send a dog into damnation.

There's too many loose ends with people who say that certyain breeds need to be docked to save their tails. Just too many.

It's nothing but the owner wanting it done, mostly for looks. And that's a shame.

 

[dr2little]

I had a little cocker pup in my last set of classes. At first I honestly couldn't place what was so unusual and so freaking cute about him (although they're all cute), it finally dawned on me....he had a long natural tail. It was truly the cutest little cocker I'd ever seen, he just looked whole and right, and boy did he wag that tail....the whole glorious thing.

 

[Zoom]

Shannerson does have a point though. When you throw in a trait that has been ignored for countless years, what do you judge as the "proper" version? Ears are easy enough, but there are huge tail variations. I'm mean, just in Aussies you can have a naturabl bobtail, a full tail, or a tail that is anywhere in between. What is proper, then? What version of that tail makes for a better specimen of the breed? How do you judge that?

And then what...we will further narrow gene pools that are already too restricted. We've heard the speculation that the Doberman might go extinct in the next 25 or so years because of all the problems already in the breed. So what happens when we take out a huge chunk of healthy breeding stock because they don't have the new tail requirements? It's the same for all the tradtionally docked breeds...the number of dogs that would be disqualified will be huge and I think a terrible hindrance on all future breeding plans.

 

[bubbatd]

LOL!! Dr2.... I did have my son " docked " ....almost 50 years ago ! I've never asked him about it .... but my grandsons were " docked " too .

 

[dr2little]

LOL!! Dr2.... I did have my son " docked " ....almost 50 years ago ! I've never asked him about it .... but my grandsons were " docked " too .

This is smelling like a brief hijack but..when I had Jordon, it was during a phase where people were not er..um..docking. I almost had it done anyway because his dad was done, but when they came to get him I couldn't let him go.

The kicker was, when he was 13 I sent him to jewish summer camp due to the superior medical facilities and his fatal allergies and asthma. Long story short, the letters home from camp were more about how he was the attraction in the shower rather than what a good time he was having. Guess I should have told him he'd be the only turtle neck in a camp full of t-shirts.

 

[bubbatd]

That's a riot !!!!!

 

[RD]

BB, wouldn't you rather see the government put more energy into enforcing laws that harm animals more? Abuse, puppy mills, etc.? Look at how poorly those are enforced already. What good is making new laws going to do? Why are people spazzing over procedures that only last a few minutes when people are doing FAR more invasive, more disrespectful and downright cruel things to their dogs?

I'm glad my dogs have tails, but if I got a breed that was traditionally docked, I'd like to have it docked. The ears are optional - I like soft, floppy ears and I don't think that uncropped ears spoil the appearance of the breed.

And going back OT - I never knew that was why sporting breeds had their tails docked like that. My grandpa had a Weim with a full tail and a Weim with that half-docked tail and the difference in their pointing was tremendous. The one with the full tail would go on point but didn't look nearly as obvious and snappy as the docked dog. Some may have been breeding, but the look of the tail seemed to have something to do with it too.

 

[Brandyb]

I have two docked dogs, and I had a docked and cropped dog. The docking I can live with, as it really causes no pain to the dog when done at such a young age, but the cropping is another story all together. Lets just say I would never (by my own choice, my hubby is a different matter) get another cropped dog again.
The thing that many seem to forget in this debate is that the tail and the ears of dogs are MAJOR communication signalers, and by altering these, there are quite a few dogs that can have problems with dog on dog communication. I really think that both are unnessessary proceedures, 9 times out of 10, done soley for aesthetic purposes (steming from some historical fables) and nothing else - seeing as how on this side of the world it is very very rare for an undocked/cropped dog to go up against a cropped/docked dog in the show ring and win. For example, why are german shepherds and malinois not docked and cropped when in personal protection jobs, but rotties and dobermans are?
I can understand the crop on some terriers for hand holds, because is you don't grab the base (or thicker) part of the tail when pulling the dog out of the quarry's hole, you risk breaking or damaging the tail. But if your dog is a house pet, or some sort of sport competitor, I really don't see the point, and actually, it is benificial to have a tail in a lot of high speed, agile sports. Tails are used for balance ... if you slow down any film of any animal that has a full tail while running, twisting and turning, you will see just how important the tail balancing is to the over all performance of that animal (ie. the cheetah).
Just my thoughts.

 

[RedyreRottweilers]

Tail docking and ear cropping are the first footholds for ARistas.

Next comes mandatory spay neuter and BSL restricting or eliminating certain breeds.

Just another step towards their ultimate goal of no domestic animals.

I will fight for my right to dock, and for the right of others to crop if they so desire, until my last breath.

The government has NO BUSINESS meddling in my personal dog affairs.

 

[whatszmatter]

is docking tails and cropping ears really that big of an issue for some of you that you need to spend your time, and gov't time and money on this?? Aren't there bigger fish to fry? I mean the midwest is still a disgusting pool of puppy mills, what's being done to stop them? Not much.

I personally don't like Docked tails, but who am I to say that someone needs to stop doing it? Its not maiming, its not killing its not abusing the animal. It's done when they are very young. It can hardly be considered even minor surgery. It has no lasting effects on the dog other than how it looks. Its done by professionals and by people that love and care for their animals better than most, so what's the deal? Why does everyone find it so necessary to stick their noses into someone else's business all the time?? I"m sure there are a few things in your own lives that need cleaning up and your energy would be better spent on yourself instead of some one else.

 

[Maxy24]

i do not think docking or cropping should be outlawed as this would make people try to do it on there own. I also do not think it is necassary for a house pet to have these done to them. It's sorta like when i was a kid my mom making me have a nose job because she liked small noses better than big ones. As far as docking goes i don't really know how that is done but i understand they di it very young so maybe it does not cause pain i don't know about that one. As far as cropping goes it does not seem like there is any good reason to do it.

 

[Miakoda]

Tail docking and ear cropping are the first footholds for ARistas.

Next comes mandatory spay neuter and BSL restricting or eliminating certain breeds. Unfortunately, spay/neuter laws for 'pit bulls' & Rottweilers are in place everywhere & are more common than outright bans

Just another step towards their ultimate goal of no domestic animals.And just another step in gaining popularity for election time.

I will fight for my right to dock, and for the right of others to crop if they so desire, until my last breath.

The government has NO BUSINESS meddling in my personal dog affairs.So true!

I'll fight too.

 

[chinchow]

Oh the cosmetology!!

 

[BostonBanker]

BB, wouldn't you rather see the government put more energy into enforcing laws that harm animals more? Abuse, puppy mills, etc.? Look at how poorly those are enforced already. What good is making new laws going to do? Why are people spazzing over procedures that only last a few minutes when people are doing FAR more invasive, more disrespectful and downright cruel things to their dogs?

Mind you, I never said they should be illegal; I said I don't think they should be done. I really don't get why it is neccessary.

And I'm not sure the government is doing a bang-up job of dealing with puppy-mills anyway. It's not like they are putting a ton of money and energy into that, which would suddenly be withdrawn if docking/cropping were illegal.

I guess I'd like it to be optional for dogs to be done, including show dogs. And then I'd like to see some breeders stop doing it, and win at shows, and therefore make un-docked/cropped the new cool look that gets rewarded.

Of course, I'd like Santa to pay off my credit card bill and my truck payments, too.:lol-sign: Like I said, I don't like it and I don't think it should be done - it doesn't mean it should be illegal.

 

[chinchow]

Showing Rottweilers in Europe ..... all of them with tails and you have to admit that it's a pretty sight!

I agree! They are absolutely gorgeous, and have a bit more personality.

 

[happyhound]

http://www.cdb.org/

Council of Docked Breeds website - scroll down some for photos of sporting dogs with damaged natural tails.

My GSP's tail is docked and I wouldn't have it any other way. In the field he is wag-master and if it was natural I'd be dealing with a bloody tail constantly.

Here's another nifty link..
http://www.shorthairs.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=3107

 

[~Dixie's_Mom~]

I wonder why some "breeders" choose to dock mixed breeds?

Before we knew better, we had a Silky/Yorkie litter, and we had their tails docked because both the Silky Terrier and the Yorkie have docked tails. Our vet docked them VERY short though...I don't really like it, but I don't really care. Here's a picture of all three of the dogs tails...

Left to right:

Lucy-Silky/Yorkie, very short tail.

Dixie-Yorkie, medium tail. (I believe the standard is half).

Zoey-Shih-Tzu, natural tail.

 

[chinchow]

Happyhound, there's studies that go against the number of damaged tails in undocked dogs.

Think about how many other field breeds are not docked traditionally...and there is no higher damage rate in them than anywhere else. Should we just dock all breeds, because it MIGHT happen? Should we dictate what our pets look like, what body parts they are allowed to have, just because of what may possibly be a result?

 

[chinchow]

Our vet docked them VERY short though...I don't really like it, but I don't really care. Here's a picture of all three of the dogs tails...

You should care, it may not show in younger age, but in older dogs with tails that are docked wrong, they can easily begin to deveolp sacral arthritis, and that is not a walk in the park for them.

 

[~Dixie's_Mom~]

You should care, it may not show in younger age, but in older dogs with tails that are docked wrong, they can easily begin to deveolp sacral arthritis, and that is not a walk in the park for them.

I meant I don't care about appearance. I've never hear of anything like that...do you know of a site I where I could read up on it?