Discussion in 'Dog Training Forum' started by tl_ashmore, Nov 5, 2004.
Heys guys. I just wanted to know what your opinions were on shock collars....
Well I personally do not have one. I have given a lot of thought to it and have seen it work on a lot of dogs. The cons are of course inflicting pain on your dog for misbehaving, and creating fear in them of the collar or being shocked. However, I have a couple close friends that used one and it literally only took about one day of using the actual shock for the dog to figure it out. The collar makes a beep as a warning first and the dog has learned that when it hears the beep, to stop doing whatever it is he is doing. Now, my friend does not use it at all, and only uses her commands, which were paired with the collar initally (drop, no, stop, etc..) Sooooo, I have come close to getting one but have not yet...I think I am too big of a weenie. My friend did try it on herself first before using it, and she said that it did hurt but just for a split second. I hope this helps....
Thanks so much. I was talking to my dad about my dogs, because they have been fighting here lately. He said that I should use a remote shock collar on the one that is starting the fights, and whenever she starts to growl at my other dog, use the collar. I am still pretty skeptical about these collars. I don't really know that much about them. Thanks for your input though.
what kind of dogs are yours? Mine are fighting for the same reasons...one dog is reaching 1 year old and has decided to become the dominant one...The other is OK with giving in to that, with the exception of food and treats. Well I wish one of us could try the collar out and let the other one know if it works on fighting!!! GOOD LUCK!
I have a pit bull and a Boston Terrier. The pit is fixing to be a year old, and the boston is about 3 years old.
that is so interesting......My dog that is about to be 1 is a Pit Bull also. My 3 year old dog is a mix. Rosie (in the picture) has this newfound confidence that hasn't been seen before. She has decided to be the head honcho, and Bailey isn't liking it. I am always worried that Rosie will end up hurting Bailey. So far the fights have been broken up before one gets hurt. The friend that I was referring to about having the shock collar that worked used it on a PitBull mix dog. Obie (the dog) walks the straight line so far after using it. The problem with Pitts, is that they have such a high pain threshold.
We're having to consider it also. Kharma is the original obsessive/compulsive herd dog. She won't stop when we call her off. She'll pause and look at us, then go right back and continue until she has all the cows where she wants them - whether we've told her to or not. It could be very, very bad if there was a cow trying to have a calf in the midst of one of her forays. I consulted with a friend who's a real Fila expert, and she told me that she'd had to resort to one with one of her males. Evidently he's so focused when there's a female in season that he'll go through safety glass, doors, fencing, etc., and has hurt himself a couple of times. The Filas have such a high pain threshold that they don't feel most collars, though, so she's going to send me some info on the collar she found that worked. I'll pass it on as soon as I get it.
I don't like the idea of having to do this, but sometimes you have to be able to get their attention in order to teach.
I used one on my black lab to show him where the property lines where in our yard. It took one day to train him. I have tried it on my yellow lab it doesn't phase him a bit. I gave up. As far as using the collar to stop dogs from fighting is a bad idea. A shock collar can increase the aggression in the dogs. If they are that pumped up it could back fire. Personaly I would use it for that reason.
Yeah, Serena, I've said that many times. Now that I'm dealing with Filas, I'm having to reexamine something I instinctively recoil from as a tool. "Hardness" is a requirement for proper Fila temperament. Looking at a possible life threatening situation has made me consider things I'd never entertain under normal circumstances. These dogs evidently don't even respond to the average shock collar, and remembering how Kharma bit the electric cattle fence (that makes the 2000+ pound bulls think again) - twice - after it shocked her when she was about three months old . . .
I don't want to have to use a shock collar on Beulah, but I don't know what else to do. I asked my dad about it, and he said that the collar will NOT increase their aggression during a fight. He said it could really work for me. I hate having to do this, but I am at my witts end. I've had to keep Beulah on a chain outside, and she absolutely hates it. She pulls so hard, that the collar has bruised her neck. I hate it, but I've got to do something. I don't want Beulah to end up hurting Dixie, but I don't want to have to get rid of Dixie either. There is no way I could get rid of Beulah. I got her from my uncle a few months before he died...
Amy sent me the name of the collar she's had to use with one of her males. It's Tri Tronic. I found a link with some decent information about their collars and a training video. Whoo! This stuff gets expensive!
I said it CAN increase aggression in dogs.The directions/training manual that came with my shock collar had a paragraph on the reasons why you shouldn't use the collar. That was one of them. Its one of those things that can happen. Training a dog with a shock collar can back fire.There also is a well know dog trainer in my area that has a radio talk show and she said the same thing. Can you speak to a dog trainer to come in and help figure out why these too fight.Talk to your vet. I would hate for you to make the situation worse because of the shock collar.
Please read link
Thanks for the link, Millie. It's a good article.
I think the message toward the end of the article is what we're having to struggle with: "Only in a handful of cases, where all else has been tried and failed, and when the condition is potentially life-threatening, can the use of such devices ever be justified [sic]"
None of us here actually wants to resort to this kind of technique; we're finding ourselves in situations that are potentially life threatening for our dogs. Most of us have a pretty good handle on what's causing the problems at this point, too, we've just had no significant results using less "shocking" techniques.
I'll share a part of the e-mail my friend (who is an expert with the Filas) sent me when I asked her advice:
"Tri Tronics that is my advice for such a serious and dangerous problem. Not a huge fan of shock collars but in a couple situations it has been the last and only solution.
I have a male that when Betina is in heat he literally rips through chain link, etc. He causes himself an amazing amount of harm in doing so, but when he is hormone crazed he feels nothing even when his head is swollen twice the size and bleeding. Have to use the collar a couple times, but it has made all the difference. Nothing else worked.
Granted, the $350 is a lot, but other brands do not hold up or even work any where near as well. And even though I haven?t had to use it for livestock training I imagine it would work well for that since the level is easily adjusted and they do not even feel the lowest levels at all."
I know WHY the dogs are fighting. They are just trying to establish dominance in the house. Both of them want to be TOP dog, and they are not backing down about it. I don't want to have to use a shock collar, that is just a last resort.
I own a shock collar and it only comes out when totally necessary and that means usually in the field with the hunting dogs like a rabbit dog who likes to run deer it is impossible to break them of running deer without a shock collar and sometimes that don't even work anyways I have used it on my Dobes to train them to the boundries of the yard and took like one day maybe two but not very many pokes and they were done leaving the yard my mom also had a Dobie that as soon as you let him out of the door he would run down the driveway and onto the road and she lives on a highway luckily he never got splattered it took him lilke four days to learn to stay in the yard I love a shock collar when it is used correctly don't get me wrong I am a firm believer in using praise and food and a clicker and only use one when it is absolutelly needed
Okay. Then my advice would be to take each one to obedience training and establish yourself as the pack leader. You are the top dog,neither one of those dogs should be. Good Luck.
I totally agree. But I can't tell by this post what has been done in the past. The question was about shock collars and I gave my advice. Maybe I should have asked more questions about the history of training that hasn't worked. Maybe the dogs haven't had any training or poor training or very good training that hasn't worked. I am just throwing out suggestions. I didn't think the obedience training suggestion was out of line at this point. Just because the dogs are still fighting doesn't mean they have exhausted all other forms before resorting to a shock collar. I have a very stubborn dominant dog,I know how hard it is.
Thank you all for your advice. I didn't mean to stir up any problems. I just wanted to know what everyone thought about those collars. Believe me, I don't want to have to use a shock collar. That is absolutely a last resort. I had just talked to a guy that used one on his German Shepards, and he said they work great. I have also been told that the dogs will continue to fight until one or the other establishes dominance, but I don't want to take the chance of the smaller one getting hurt or worse. I'm just trying to save my dog. Plus, I am just a single girl living by herself, paying her own bills. I don't know that I could afford obedience training.
You know, it's not absolutely necessary to have an "expert" personally help you with an obedience training course. Now might be the time to go to the library or bookstore and check out some of the books and/or videos on training that Serena's recommended, the Monks of New Skete's training, or one that catches your attention and sounds effective and do it yourself.
After all, behaviourists and trainers are relatively new in the history of dog ownership. Granted, they're a great help, especially since our lives are so hectic now, but with a sense of commitment and determination to understand and teach your dog, there's no reason you can't do it on your own.
And far from stirring up anything unpleasant, I think you created an atmosphere where it was possible for several of us having frustrating problems with stubborn critters to air that and discuss some possible solutions. Thanks.
I have been doing some research on the internet, and I just don't know about some of these "so called" trainers. Some of them tell you to put your dog on Prozac. Others tell you to keep the aggressive dog muzzled. That is no way for a dog to live...
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