Returning a dog to the breeder - Questions/Rant

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by Teal, Aug 27, 2011.

  1. darkchild16

    darkchild16 We are Home.

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    Pictures are pretty damning. The pictures tell the story line.

    It just takes using a little common sense. What would the breeder gain from posting this?
     
  2. Barbara!

    Barbara! New Member

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    There are no facts, there is no proof.

    She didn't refuse to do anything. Her vet is 30+ minutes away, and it was 10 o clock at night. I don't really constitute that as refusal.

    As I said earlier, there is just as much "proof" from the breeder as there is from Teal.
     
  3. sassafras

    sassafras mushinois

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    Well FWIW I don't think it was done maliciously, either. But neglect doesn't have to be malicious. In fact, more often than not I think neglect isn't malicious but more of a "path of least resistance" kind of thing until bad becomes normal. And allowing a puppy to get into that condition is neglect in my book.
     
  4. Agreed.
     
  5. darkchild16

    darkchild16 We are Home.

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    Teal wont do whats necessary to show the time date for one. The puppy doesnt look healthy in those pictures. EXIF data does not get faked (at least that I have ever heard of) and to top it off a PUPPY cant fake its age. ESPECIALLY a large breed.
     
  6. yoko

    yoko New Member

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    The breeder has pics of the dog and vet records. I'm sorry I'm not super record keeper but I have all the vet records for both of my dogs. Even if I lost them I could email over for more copies.

    So while you jumped in this thread convinced teal did nothing wrong, for me based on the fact that they can't even provide a single pic when the breeder has pics with the date info and vet records which teal continues to refuse to produce I totally am on the breeders side right now.
     
  7. Barbara!

    Barbara! New Member

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    Where are these vet records? I haven't seen any. And once again, Teal did not refuse to produce anything. That logic makes no sense. My vet office is closed in the middle of the night...idk about yours.
     
  8. ~Jessie~

    ~Jessie~ Chihuahua Power!

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    I don't think the neglect was done maliciously. Reading Teal's posts in the beginning of this thread show she wanted nothing to do with the dog, though. She referred to him as "it." She mentioned it was "tough" to give the dog basic care (basic care, to me, means food and water at the very least). Judging by the pictures from both parties (Teal's shots from 2 days before Dianna took him, and Dianna's shots from the day she took him), the puppy looked emanciated.

    I've looked at Dianna's photos from the day the puppy went to live with Teal, and there is a night and day difference in that puppy's appearance. He had a shiny coat, bright eyes, puppy fat, etc. Since Dianna said the puppy gained 28lbs in the 2 weeks after she retrieved him from Teal (and the updated pictures from Dianna do not show an overweight dog), it's quite obvious that dog was being starved.

    Most often, neglect ISN'T done on purpose. Look at all of the people who get in over their heads by rescuing pets- just turn on Animal Planet and watch Animal Hoarders and you'll see how much these people "love" their pets. There was a woman who gave up her HOME for her 150 rabbits. She lived in a camper in the backyard because the rabbits took over her house. The home was disgusting, the roof leaked, there wasn't any power, and those poor rabbits were living in squalor. And she REFUSED to rehome any of them because she was giving them such a wonderful life.
     
  9. yoko

    yoko New Member

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    How about this teal puts in the effort needed to simply uncheck a box and I'll put in the effort to get the vet papers posted.

    I'm not the one who has to convince anyone remember?
     
  10. Whisper

    Whisper Kaleidoscopic Eye

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    Well, wow.

    I am having a similar emotional response as you. There seems to be some sort of disgust directed at this puppy. How on earth could any interaction with that lovely boy be "hell?" Not to mention the frequent references to him as an "it."

    I am loath to accuse someone of starving their dog, and Teal's dogs have always looked fantastic to me in photos. Except this puppy. I guess I'm also sensitive to it, because when Fable was sick she got very, very skinny, and I had someone I've known almost my entire life angrily asking if I fed her. That hurt.

    But I don't see any reason for the breeder to lie about receiving the dog from Teal in this condition.
     
  11. Barbara!

    Barbara! New Member

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    But yet you are condemning her for being unable to post vet records when the breeder hasn't either. No double standards here, please.
     
  12. kady05

    kady05 Active Member

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    Does anyone else find it a little odd that the breeder waited until 14 months later (pup went back Aug. '11, it is now Oct. '12) to share this information with anyone? I know quite a few breeders, and if ANY pup of theirs was returned in that condition, they'd be blasting it all over the place.

    What breeder takes that long to reply to an email? I assume the Fila community it pretty tight nit.. how did no one hear about this and say anything when it actually happened?

    The whole situation is just weird. I'm not saying I'm okay with a pup ending up like that, but I don't know.. just strange that it would take so long for this info. to come out.
     
  13. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

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    It's also been explained to her how to restore the time stamps to her photos, which hasn't been done. Nothing has been done.

    The whole start of this thread is weird.

    First, Teal posted asking for advice on how to contact an unresponsive breeder, but didn't post the breeder's name. She said she'd talked to the breeder on the phone a week ago and not heard anything back. Understandable if she wanted to give the breeder some privacy.

    So in the interest of helping her contact the breeder (which she asked for advice on) people easily dig up breeders name and start posting her contact info. She gets upset about that.

    People advise her to send snail mail notices to the breeder and she goes on with a long excuse about how she doesn't know the breeder's mailing address and has only been to her house.

    People post the mailing address for her, which they found on the breeder's website listed under CONTACT INFO (seriously? how hard is it to find that when you've supposedly been desperate to make contact for a week?) OP makes a bunch more excuses.

    Someone privately advises the breeder about the situation, then the breeder drives several hours to go pick up her puppy. Finds it's in awful condition. Takes photos of the awful condition (which are timestamped corresponding with the date of pickup as PROOF), takes the puppy to the vet, and then to his new home where he proceeds to gain 28 lbs over the course of the next two weeks.

    Then everything is quiet until the breeder speaks up about the abuse her puppy suffered and supplies evidence of his condition.

    Just looking at the beginning of the thread, it feels like Teal knew he wasn't in great shape and was trying to start something to cover her butt in case pics came out. The whole tone of the original post was "well I tried so hard to get him back to his breeder, his breeder is so unresponsive, what an irresponsible person, la la la," Notice how everybody found different options for contacting the breeder and all she does is make excuses about why and how that doesn't work for her? And how fast the breeder jumped on it and pulled the puppy when she found out?
     
  14. Red Chrome

    Red Chrome New Member

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    Good post. I do not know the breed and have very little passing knowledge of them other than they are pretty,majestic looking dogs of mastiff type.

    I never once said this was done intentionally but it did happen. If a puppy was going down hill then he needed more care till he was able to go somewhere that could and did turn him around.
     
  15. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    The Fila community is . . . odd. And is used to keeping things close to the vest. Secretive, even. It's the nature of the beast. Part of it is being extremely protective of the breed, coupled with a natural intensity and reticence. Part of it is because things can get really nasty really fast and there's always one of the fringers who wouldn't hesitate to jump up and start pointing fingers at her for placing the pup in a "bad home" to start with.
     
  16. ~Jessie~

    ~Jessie~ Chihuahua Power!

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    Agreed!
     
  17. Miakoda

    Miakoda New Member

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    Some people belong to the breed of the month club.

    Look....a gamebred APBT! I need one of those! Now I'm in!!!

    Wait! People are fawning over those built dual registered AST/APBTs! I gotta get me one!

    A Bull Terrier? WHAT?!?! I must have one!

    Wow.....Salukis are super rare! Sign me up, sista!

    Dude. That's one of those fabled Filas! I'm gonna get me one, too! Hey, everybody! Look at meeeeeee!!!!!!

    Hmmm....the Malinois sure seems to be the new cool talked-about breed. Hey, you! I wanna buy a puppy!
     
  18. Red Chrome

    Red Chrome New Member

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    I do know the breeder also had a major surgery too. That could explain some of the time loss.
     
  19. Red Chrome

    Red Chrome New Member

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    Great Post Mia!!!
     
  20. Barbara!

    Barbara! New Member

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    OH LOOK,

    A completely off topic post attacking Teal personally. Totally productive and it totally proves your point!
     

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