OB Question

Discussion in 'Dog Training Forum' started by JennSLK, Aug 1, 2008.

  1. JennSLK

    JennSLK F150 and a .30-06

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    I have been working with Jazz a bit at home. When you are healing the stop the dog is suposed to sit with thier front feet parallel to yours correct? Well 80% of the time Jazz sits a good 6 inches back from that. When she does do it right she gets TONS of praise and when she doesnt I ignore it.

    Any suggestions?
     
  2. corgipower

    corgipower Tweleve Enthusiest

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    I've never paid attention to the dog's feet when I halt. The shoulder/neck should be lined up with your leg. The feet of a dane would be further forward than the feet of a chi.

    If she's heeling in the correct position but is behind you when she sits, she might be rocking back into her sit. She needs to learn to tuck.

    Here's an article on how to teach the tuck sit ~

    http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2001b/compsits.htm
     
  3. JennSLK

    JennSLK F150 and a .30-06

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    Thanks. That might be what shes doing. How many marks off would it be for sitting behind?
     
  4. sit at heel is a basic position that dogs should be well schooled in. It is an important building block that you will use in all advanced work, same as sit front.

    You should take the time to school your dog so that she knows and understands where heel is, and how to find it and get in position from anywhere, and the same with front.

    I work this as a game with my dogs all the time. As they progress I make is harder and harder for them to find heel and front. The payoff is a game of tug, or a small food reward, or a fun game of fetch for a release.

    I teach dogs at least 4 movements that help me help them get in proper heel position.

    I teach them in this order:

    Get Up (move forward)
    Get In (move towards my left leg)
    Get Back (move backwards)
    Get Off (move away from my left leg)

    I teach these using food to lure, and sometimes a lightweight touch stick to help the dog move in the right direction.

    The best advice I can give you is DO NOT BE IN A HURRY TO GET TO THE RING. Spend the time you need to teach your dog the basics, and make sure she understands them before moving on.

    It will make all your work in the future so much easier and more pleasant.
     
  5. bubbatd

    bubbatd Moderator

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    I may be wrong ...( it's been a while ! ) but it seems when they said " Halt " I moved my forward foot back to my other foot , which did put shoulder to my leg .
     
  6. noodlerubyallie

    noodlerubyallie Sprayin' the spiders

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    Something else to consider may be how you walk. Do you walk in a straight line or tend to "spoon out" (as my trainer calls it)? I usually "spoon out" when I walk, so I was constantly cutting off my dogs when we are walking/heeling, so they would get behind or ahead of me, and in turn, tend to not sit in the correct position. Does she sit on her own, or do you give her a "tug" to remind her to sit? If you have to remind her, are you pulling back or pulling up? Pulling back could make her sit back on her heels, essentially sitting back instead of sitting "down". When you are asking her to "halt," are your shoulders parallel? If they aren't, then she could be taking the signal from you and sitting back of heel position. Like Red said, heeling and sit at heel are the basis of most everything advanced you'll ever do, so make sure you take your time! I'm in the same boat, I really want to rush because it's fun (and I'm a little overcompetitive!) but my trainers like to remind me of my errors and things that my dogs do that aren't automatic or exactly right so I have to slow down and make sure that what I am doing is telling my dogs the right thing to do.

    Have fun!!
     
  7. JennSLK

    JennSLK F150 and a .30-06

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    Usually I dont have to remind her. 9 times out of 10 she does sit on her own. We are just starting with this. I dont expect her to be ready for her CD untill next summer. It all takes time. Agility is more our thing. but I would like an CD on her
     
  8. NRA, I often choose marked parkinglots to train in so I can walk along the lines. LOL!! So many times if you can get an educated observer, many of the issues one has with their dog have to do with handling.

    :D
     
  9. Hillside

    Hillside Original Twin

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    Dobes tend to like to settle back when they sit. Saga does it and that is what we are working on right now. WHen I am using a leash, I hold it in front of my body a bit. (It looks like I am going to give somebody an uppercut, but just my elbow is bent.) I might drag out the clicker and see if I can polish it up a bit that way.
     
  10. Sch3Dana

    Sch3Dana Workin' Dog

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    Once you are sure she is doing a tuck sit, I would recommend doing many reps of one-step halt, using food to lure her into exactly the right position. Practicing just that part of the routine over and over again helps a lot as you both get used to the movement and it is the same every time. You should practice until she can do one-step halts with perfect fluidity and no help from the food (but still rewarding every correct halt).

    Then, when you start practicing from real heeling again, I would reward every single correct halt and if she starts to sit too far behind, don't wait for her to settle- start heeling again. This stops her from doing the wrong behavior and prevents her from earning her reward. And, if this happens, pay attention to your footwork and handling- most handler halt terribly- inconsistent, bumping into the dog, not using the same movement every time, so the poor dog is dancing without a partner. If you are this handler- practice halts from heeling without a dog until you are perfect and smooth every time.
     
  11. Hillside

    Hillside Original Twin

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    I forgot to add, that when doing the leash method that I am using rewards when she hits it right.
     
  12. corgipower

    corgipower Tweleve Enthusiest

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    That can get points taken off for handler error.

    Yup. That helps build muscle memory.
     
  13. Jenn, I am working on this with my puppies right now. I will see if I can get my hubby to get some video of how I am doing it, both with the puppy who is learning, and with Penny who knows the exercise and how to find heel etc.
     
  14. noodlerubyallie

    noodlerubyallie Sprayin' the spiders

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    Thanks for the advice, Red :)

    My trainer was literally pulling on one of my legs during class because I SUCK at walking straight lines. I think walking with a clenched butt (LOL) and sucking in your chest seems to help! (or maybe my dogs are just embarassed and don't want to walk behind??) The lines on our mats the the club really help too.

    It's all about practice, practice, practice!

    (Hillside, it's on beotch!!!)
     

  15. I just wanted to touch on this one thing.

    My instructor always advised me not to train for the mistake! Don't take away the reminders. Remind her EVERY SIT. Help with the leash, help with food, help with smiles and praise.

    When I am readying a dog for trial, I work sits and fronts a LOT, with LOTS of rewards, and I try not to allow the dog an opportunity to get it wrong. You are working on building muscle memory, as someone mentioned earlier, so stop putting her in the position of forgetting and making a mistake.

    Hope I can get a clip for you so you can see how we do it.
     
  16. JennSLK

    JennSLK F150 and a .30-06

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    Thanks Red. I am working without a trainer. The closest one is a min 2hr drive. The one I did go to to I only whent to 2 classes. She didnt know alot, was a byb, and used mostly corrections to train.

    The video would really help. I cant wait to see it.
     
  17. Sch3Dana

    Sch3Dana Workin' Dog

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    If you are training alone, I highly recommend Terri Arnold's books, Steppin Up to Success. It's a three book series and incredibly detailed. Terri is the best obedience trainer I have ever seen. And the books are the best training books I've ever seen. I've heard the videos are only so so, but I've never watched them.
     
  18. DanL

    DanL Active Member

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    We had the same issue with Daisy. Because she's so large, when she sits, even if her feet were in the right spot at the start, she'd end up too far back. We had to lure her well out in front and then when she sat she'd be in the right spot.
     

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