Need help in finding a puppy (with my eyes open!)

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by Moni, May 7, 2007.

  1. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    I am new to this forum and found it by searching on a breed of dog that I was interested in. I thought I was "Dog-Savvy" as I have had dogs in my family my entire life. It is quite possible I could have been duped if not for a poster with regards to the breeder:

    http://www.dakotawinds.homestead.com/

    There was quite a lengthy discussion on this breeder and how she seems unethical. Obviously I don't want to get involved in this but I was interested in the "Hush Bassett". So, I guess I am naive and now I am looking for REAL help. :)

    Yes we have bought puppies in the past from the Humane Society and the pet store and from a breeder. I have had success in all of these but now I am trying to do much research in the area and do it the right way.

    We are looking for a puppy that has little to no shedding, good family dog as we have 2-13 yr old boys and an almost 3 yr old and we want to be able to have this dog in the house. I have ideas on dogs I like and don't like, but where do you start the search?? ANY ANY ANY information, please help. I thought I was on the right track as we were going to go to the above woman's house but now i don't know...

    Thoughts?? Thank you in advance

    ~Moni
     
  2. Gempress

    Gempress Walks into Mordor

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    You came to the right place! You have very specific needs, so I would go with a purebred. I think a standard poodle would be a good fit. Non-shedding, intelligent and a good family dog. Or if you'd like something a little smaller, go with a bichon frise. Also non-shedding, but robust enough to handle an active family.
     
  3. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    How do you determine who are good breeders however? A part of me wants to go get one of the puppies from this woman just to save them! Sigh..makes me so darn mad and sad at the same time. I have a soft heart for animals and to think she might be doing something unethical...If I had enough money I would buy the whole lot of them! :)
     
  4. Gempress

    Gempress Walks into Mordor

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    A good breeder will:

    -Have titles on their dogs and be proud of it. They want to produce only the best examples of the breed, so they'll only breed dogs with titles. Beware of breeders who say things like "Oh, all showing proves is that a dog can strut around a ring."

    -Have their dogs health tested and certified free of potential health problems. For example, OFA certification on hips to prove they're free of dysplasia. The health testing required can vary from breed to breed. Health testing can only be done after 2 years of age, so beware the breeder who claims his year-old female is certified.

    --They'll have a contract and a guarantee on their puppies. If it's a "pet-quality" puppy, they'll require it to be spayed or neutered. Beware of places that boast a 48-hour health guarantee! (Yes, you'll actually see that) Good breeders will often guarantee their pups for years.

    --Also, good breeders will often have a wait list for puppies, since they only have a few litters each year.
     
  5. Charliesmommy

    Charliesmommy I run with scissors

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    I always feel this way too, but you have to keep in mind that if you were to buy those pups..all that is going to happen is that this woman is going to breed a whole new litter of them. You'll just be supporting her!

    I would look around for a reputable breeder and then post about it on here. Chances are someone will be familiar with them.
     
  6. Gempress

    Gempress Walks into Mordor

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    For example, here's the site of a good standard poodle breeder.

    http://www.galeforcepoodles.com/

    The dogs are titled both in obedience and conformation, and notice the proud statement posted on the puppy page?

    This breeder even offers a lifetime guarantee on all genetic defects.

    That's what you're looking for. A breeder who is up-front with what he or she can offer: health testing, titles, and good dogs. Stay away from breeders who offer excuses or try to avoid answering questions about health and titles directly. Compare this site with that designer puppymill you posted, and you can see a world of difference.
     
  7. noludoru

    noludoru Bored Now.

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    I love the poodle suggestion for you... However, I have one more suggestion to make, and since you have dog experience this is something to think about. With several young children, can you handle a puppy at this point in time? Getting up every hour or so to potty train, the messes, chewing, etc? If you think you can't handle a puppy at the moment, it might be a great idea to think about rescue. A good rescue can help you find a dog perfect for you.

    Also.. if shedding is an issue.. I would suggest NOT getting a large dog. Even large dogs that have below-average shedding still shed more than medium size or small dogs that shed a lot. (By "large" I mean mastiff/st bernard size... the more surface area, the worse the shed)

    I'll try to think up some breeds for you, but my brain is fried at the moment, so I'll do that later when thinking isn't so impossible. :)
     
  8. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    Oh I agree about the large dog. I guess I wasn't clear. :)

    We are thinking a small/medium dog for the family. We thought for an adult size at the most 30-40 lbs would be good. That way it isn't such a HUGE dog in the house. My husband had a lhaso (spelling?) and said that they were a great dog. I have really only had big, big dogs (think St. Bernards, German Shepherds, Labs) so the Small/Medium area is new to me and exciting as well.

    With regards to your puppy comment, that is true so maybe i don't want exactly a 6 week old but a 3 month old or older? I don't have a clue what age is appropriate to adopt anymore. I have been researching rescues (most productive day personally, not so much work-wise heehe) but it is hard when you are not sure what type of dog you want.

    If you think of any good ones, send them my way. I saw these Whoodles and Wheaten Terriers..very interesting dogs.
     
  9. Charliesmommy

    Charliesmommy I run with scissors

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    Prepare for the upcoming lecture about mixed breeds....I'm too tired to give it, but I'm sure someone will..... :)
     
  10. Herschel

    Herschel New Member

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    Whoodles are another "designer dog" bred by unscrupulous breeders that are just looking for profit.

    I was just about to suggest a Soft Coated Wheaten Terrier for you.

    Have you looked at:

    http://www.wheatenterrierrescue.org/

    The Soft Coated Wheaten Terrier Club of America. http://www.scwtca.org

    I am familiar with this breed so please PM me if you have any specific questions.
     
  11. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    Thank you for the links. I am looking at them now.

    Actually, thinking about it, wasn't "Whoodles" the name of an 80s Cartoon??
    <insert explitive>! I am showing my age! :lol-sign:

    What question to the group? How do they determine prices on these pups? Seems like they differ so much. Is it by demand?
     
  12. Herschel

    Herschel New Member

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    For mixed breed "designer dogs", the price is based on the amount of profit that the seller thinks he can make. Puppy mills produce in mass quantities so they can sell each dog to a pet store for $200. The pet store can turn around and show 10 dogs in its window and sell them for $2,000.

    Reputable breeders price their puppies to cover their value, their guarantee, and all of the work that has gone into ensuring that they are great specimens of their breed.
     
  13. otch1

    otch1 New Member

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    Hello Moni! I am hoping you'll go to akc.org and make a detailed list of potential breeds to suite your family. Then print out a list of sanctioned shows coming to your area. With that information, hit a few dog shows this summer and meet breeders in your area. You'll want to stay away from breeder/brokers like Dakotawinds, puppymills, petstores and such. Rescueing and purchasing a puppy from someone deliberating altering the breed standard, (and in a very negative way) trying to create designer breeds or mass producing puppies, only keeps them in business, as others have stated. While a St. Poodle or Wheaton terrier are lovely dogs, they are not breeds I'd recommmend for someone with a 3 yr. old, anyone with allergies or someone that lives in a harsher climate. Neither of these breeds meet all of your criteria. Look up the Hunte coorporation and the many negative articles attached to their company and the puppy mills in your area, that they support. That should give you the incentive to hit the shows, talk to breeders and have a "hands on" experience with the breeds you're considering. Good luck!
     
  14. wolfsoul

    wolfsoul I Love My Belgian

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    I know you aren't looking for a big dog, but I have to agree that a standard poodle would be great. :) How about an American cocker spaniel? They have a terrible reputation for being bad with children but if you get one from a good breeder you should not have that trouble -- they are very very sweet dogs with a very family oriented temperament. I see many of them, being a dog groomer, and the ones that come from show breeders all have excellent temperaments and have very loving demeanors. Personally I would skip the wheaton -- they are terriers by nature, very similar to schnauzers in temperament. They have a large need for exercise and are prone to jumping up and doing other things that show off their athletic ability. In my own experience they wouldn't suit a child household as they are less tolerant of touching and handling and tend to be jumpy and easily spooked.

    Someone who does alot of showing/trialling is likely to charge more as these hobbies are very expensive. If their dogs are high in demand, they may charge more. But most of it is just personal preferance. I could charge $1500 for my dogs but I feel that is unfair to the potential owners I really become friends with and so I charge much less.
     
  15. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    Unbelievable isn't it really? Maybe I really am naive about all of this. So if I understand this right:

    Puppy mills are those people that just mass produce any type of pup and sell to pet store.

    I believe I understand the "designer dog" idea. However it is kind of interesting how people think that by breeding 2 types will only bring the positive traits and no negative traits. That part doesn't make sense to me. And wouldn't you think you would need SOME type of training in this area, not just put 2 dogs together and say "well do your thing" and out comes this "perfect designer puppy" with a name that sounds like an Italian pasta??

    I am a little unclear about "brokers" however. Can someone explain further?
    And DakotaWinds in SD, this place people on here have heard of before?

    This all leads me to another questions, why aren't there regulations against this type of stuff?

    Yes I realize I may be pushing my total # of questions allowed in one day, but this is incredible information everyone is giving me. If I would not have followed my gut and posted, I could very well have been on the way to SD to get a puppy!!

    Thank you so much!
    ~Moni
     
  16. jason_els

    jason_els New Member

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    Oh yes, we know DakotaWinds. Use the search function to dig-up some of the old posts concerning them.

    Training doesn't matter. People are willing to order dogs off the internet. Dogs who have had no socialization at all and frequently come with kennel cough, worms, or even parvo. These mills just do not care. They're there to make money off of a trend.

    There are regulations against inhumane treatment but frequently the minimum requirements to pass inspection are horrible for the dogs and there are very few inspectors. Some states only have one inspector. Other states, like South Dakota and Minnesota and Pennsylvania, don't have strong animal protection laws so that's where the millers go to operate. It's just awful.
     
  17. BostonBanker

    BostonBanker Active Member

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    We had a wonderful Bedlington terrier growing up, and they meet some of your requirements. A nice medium size, basically non-shedding (I know all non-shedding breeds shed some, but we never saw a stray hair in the house), and he was great with us kids, although I think I was more like 9 when we got him. They are supposed to be one of the softer terriers temperment wise. They do need regular clipping, and some people don't like the look (although we altered the bits we didn't like over the years.

    [​IMG]

    Good luck with your search! It's always nice to see people learning before they buy, rather than after!
     
  18. Gempress

    Gempress Walks into Mordor

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    Keep asking away! We don't mind at all.

    First of all, the puppymill question. A puppy mill is basically an entity that produces large amounts of puppies as a commodity. While some puppy mills do sell to pet stores, there are many that do not.

    Puppy mills can pull a chameleon act. They feature websites with such tidbits like "Our family has been raising puppies for 20 years!", and often have pictures of their children cuddling the pups. But further investigation will show up to 15 or more breeding females housed in kennels, with anywhere from 10-20 puppies available for sale at any given time.

    And it's important to mention backyard breeders in this one. Backyard breeders, while not as bad as puppy mills, also have a negative impact. Backyard-bred pups are the ones you see most often listed in the newspaper ads. Backyard breeders, while not necessarily trying to make money off their dogs, are ignorant as to what responsible breeding is. For example, they have an AKC registered dog and decide to breed it, they want the kids to experience the miracle of birth, or they wanted Fluffy to have a litter so they can "have a pup just like her." Once again, these are breeders to avoid.

    For your designer dog question, you hit it right on the head. Designer dog breeders point to such things as "hybrid vigor" or, with all the poodle crosses, call them "non-shedding"...even though a goldendoodle puppy is just as likely to shed like a golden retriever as it is to be a non-shedder. It's all about the merchandise and how they sell.

    As for regulation...well, it's pretty nonexistent. Dogs are considered by law as property/merchandise. Breeders are expected to comply with FDA guidelines (for the big puppy mills, anyway), but those are the same guidelines for all livestock: food, water, shelter and health care. That's about it.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2007
  19. Moni

    Moni Looking for a new puppy

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    Wow the internet makes it so much more easier to research this stuff. :)

    I found some puppies here at a local rescue shelter that might be of interest to our family. Yes I understand the time involved in training puppies. Lord knows growing up our family did its share of it. I will probably need to research house training for them.

    Anyway, need some opinions on the American Staffordshire Terrier. Does anyone have experience with this breed? Growing up we had German Shepherds, Labs, etc so I am totally unfamiliar with this type.

    Here is a link to the pups my hubby and I are looking at:

    http://www.geocities.com/kishmackin/Puppies.html

    Thanks in advance!

    Moni
     
  20. AnimalLoverCatRescuer

    AnimalLoverCatRescuer New Member

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    I personally love pits of any sort so I would say they may work well. They need good training and socialization because they tend to be dog aggressive if not raised right. They are supposed to be great family dogs otherwise. They just get a horrible reputation. Good luck with your search!
     

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