Malinois Breeder Recommendations

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by CharlieDog, Feb 29, 2012.

  1. CharlieDog

    CharlieDog Rude and Not Ginger

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    I'm looking at adding our fourth (and last!) Dog late this year or early next year. I am 99.9% sure its going to be a female mal. I live in Georgia, can you guys recommend some relativity close by breeders? I'd like to go meet their dogs beforehand and ideally I'd like to drive to pick my puppy up. So within ten or so hours of Georgia preferably.

    I'm not fussed on if they show their dogs or not, and I'm not fussed on if they do schutzhund, but I want to see them doing some kind of work like obedience or agility, tracking herding or something of that sort. Strictly show dogs is not really my thing, but if the dogs offspring are working I'd consider it.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Red Chrome

    Red Chrome New Member

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    The only breeder of Mals that I really like and can recommend is Dantero in CA. But there are a lot of others on here that have Mals and can recommend other breeders.

    Can I ask, Why'd you decide Mal?
     
  3. CharlieDog

    CharlieDog Rude and Not Ginger

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    I know German shepherds. I love them. And they're awesome dogs, but they're not as fast and flashy and snappy as malinois. Gsds think and then do. Mals once they know the command they just do. Not a terrible lot of over thinking. At least, from what I've seen and talking with people who have them and have had German Shepherds as well.


    I think it was Corgi power here on the boards who said that if you threw a ball off a cliff a gsd would run after it, get to the edge and try to find his way down the cliff. If you had a mal, you'd have a dead one because he would have thrown himself off after the ball.

    I'm looking for a competitive obedience dog/some schutzhund work. I've heard a lot of wonderful things about dantero dogs, but dantero is rather far from me. :/
     
  4. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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  5. JessLough

    JessLough Love My Mutt

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    Totally need a slorrel, Kim :D

    The people Aeri, Quarrel and Panzer came from is near-ish me. She added me on Facebook after Erin got Aeri. I wanna go see puppies, just cause :p
     
  6. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    lol They should be nice puppies, I plan to keep one or two or three (if only I had the time and money). They won't be bred for a bit and still have some titling to achieve though. If I wasn't waiting for this breeding I would get a pup from Stephanie.
     
  7. CharlieDog

    CharlieDog Rude and Not Ginger

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    I am most definitely interested in a Slorrel. For sure. :) I would actually prefer that :p I've seen a lot of both of your dogs and Quarrel here on chaz, and I am particularly in live with Sloan and her structure. (I also tend to like my dogs on the smaller end of the standard and it seems like Sloan is a little 'un) ;)

    But for real I am seriously interested in that.
     
  8. Aleron

    Aleron New Member

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    Just give you some general things to consider, no matter who you get your puppy from.

    Health - Parents should be OFA'd hips/elbows and have a current clear CERF. But the real issue you want to bring up is seizuring. Ask about parents/grandparents and their siblings. A litter with parents who are both over 4 and seizure free is much better than a puppy from a litter where the parents are both 2 and the breeder swears that seizuring isn't an issue in Mals, just the other Belgian breeds. I have heard that I don't know how many times, often followed by the person with the Mal saying "well I mean, he does have a sibling/half sibling/cousin/etc who seizures but that's the only one...". Also ask about immune issues and lifespan of relatives (they should be fairly long lived).

    Temperament - Know what you want ahead of time and stick to it. Not sure if you read the Laekenois thread where "No Touch Belgians" were brought up. Decide upfront what temperament traits are most important and which you'd prefer to avoid. Look for a breeder who's dogs live in the house and who's puppies are in the house at least some of the time and given lots of attention, enrichment and interaction. There's a lot of breeders involved with Mals solely as a sport dog and not because they are interested in breeding good Mals. I'd personally avoid breeders who have the attitude that the breed is only good for protection sport and you can't expect them to be any sort of companion at all. Mostly because I find that sort of attitude sad but also because such breeders often aren't producing the sort of dog I'd want or raising their puppies in the way I'd like.

    I will say that you may have a bit of a wrong idea about Mal temperament when you say: "Gsds think and then do. Mals once they know the command they just do. Not a terrible lot of over thinking." Good GSDs tend to be better thinkers than most Belgians IME. Most lack the easily frustrated, frantic tendencies the Belgians can have. I'd tend to say over thinking is actually problem for Belgians though, it's just that it manifests itself differently than it does in GSDs.

    I also want to put in a word for ABMC rescue, who seem to get puppies in at least a few times a year. A puppy from rescue could certainly suit your needs as well, so definitely consider them. Most rescue Mals comes from not-so-great "working breeders" or "working breeder wanna-bes". As such, you can often find a puppy in rescue who has good drive and a sound temperament. They always have plenty of adult dogs available too :( http://www.malinoisrescue.org/

    Good luck with your search!
     
  9. stardogs

    stardogs Behavior Nerd

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    Obviously I'd highly recommend Stephanie/Sinova Kennels and even if you feel that's too far (we drove the 15+ hours from NC and it was a looong trip though totally worth it!), Stephanie is a great resource - she is very honest about what the breed is and isn't and is easy to chat with about pretty much anything!
     
  10. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    I'll definitely keep you updated. I *really* like Quarrel and I think Sloan is near perfect. We're hoping to improve each of them with the breeding. Maybe downsize the ears a bit too. LOL (Denis gets so annoyed every time I say this and said he hopes the puppies have twice the size of Sloan ears. :p)

    I do agree, definitely look into rescue too, you never know what might grab you.

    I will add, Backup is *not* a thinker and it's not nearly as fun as it sounds. I regularly leave training (and trials lately) crying. I once thought I wanted that no thinking just go go go dog, now I want bravery, courage, and a brain.

    He's a very, very hard dog to reach and he flusters easily. He's filled with nervous energy, overly driven, and uncomfortable with being wrong which makes free shaping of any sort like torture most days.

    He's quick to spaz, moves like a border collie on the hunt, and does not maintain a clear thinkers head. These things make him, imo, less than ideal.

    On the flip side he'd probably make a fantastic SWAT dog. You can physically manipulate this dog into any position and he'll hold it, sometimes I call him my gumbi dog. He learns best through force. He would be that dog that runs into a fire storm for the bad guy and *maybe* thinks about it after his tail is burnt off and he has the bad guy under control. In the right hands he might be an amazing dog for strict bitework but asking him to branch out and think is often painful. He has drive for days, but in the end that's not enough for a companion sport and or working dog. He will regularly cut open his face around his eyes because when he's upset in the car he spins in a frenzy and slams into walls at full speed.

    Now Sloan and Quarrel are **** brilliant dogs. Sometimes this is more troublesome. Backup will *not* challenge a crate when the door is shut, Sloan and Quarrel know how to unlatch their crates. Also when training the dumbbell retrieve Backup was a breeze, you just send him and he'll pick up anything, literally. We had to convince Q and S that this wooden block wasn't boring. It wasn't hard when they realized the game of get that - trade for this (tug) was awesome but they're no garbage goats (that is what we call Backup when he's loose in a field, he'll come back with any trash he finds and offer it for a game of fetch).

    The nice thing about S & Q is their ability to think. I train better this way and because of that Sloan picks up things incredibly fast (Denis puts more pressure on her than I do but she still succeeds with him). Would they (the thinkers) be good SWAT dogs? Maybe, maybe not, most likely Sloan would look at a fire storm and say WTF?? and Q would look at his dad and bark and bite him. LOL

    Another example I guess is Speed Retrieve in Dock Dogs. We showed Backup where the bumper was once and he zoned in and no matter what I did, no matter how I moved, what I said, Backup was clicked in. So I sent him, and sent him again, and again. He never had a problem from day one.

    Q was shown the bumper and he zoned in and did okay in practice with someone calling him to the end of the pool and reminding him this is where it is. Again, he did better the second time. After that though, in competition, where no one could show the dog where the bumper is Q got lost. Dad raised his hand to signal the laser starter and Q got distracted by dads movement, grabbed dads hat and tried to play with him.

    Sloan was shown once and she went up to the bumper and said... meh... I've seen better. LOL

    They also both needed a lot of convincing to even try extreme vertical and Backup saw the bumper and just went with no regard for self.

    Now, with some training they'll both be successful. They both jump 25 feet in big air with minimal training and Sloan doesn't even track the toy, if we could get her to target who knows what she could do.

    I guess my point is, from someone with a dog that would literally jump off a cliff for his ball, it's not all it's cracked up to be. There is a happy median between bark bark bark not even gunna try it and weeeeeee bye bye doggy. LOL I would look for the happy median if you want to maintain some sanity.
     
  11. Kat09Tails

    Kat09Tails *Now with Snark*

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    I just wanted to chime in and mention rescue. There are a surprising number of mals going through shelters in the south - especially Florida for some reason. I know several people who have picked up really nice dogs from the Miami shelter and shipped them to other people around the country for sport prospects.
     
  12. release the hounds

    release the hounds Active Member

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    I very, very, very, much agree with this post.

    There's lots of good and bad in any breed and I tend to think people get enamored or repelled by a few experiences.

    I train with lots and lots of good Mal's, but I have also seen more than my share of insane, frantic, easily frustrated nerve bags that I wouldn't want to live 10 seconds with let alone 10 years.

    LIke said earlier, go find the dogs, observe them. As much as you can and get dogs from places that produced those dogs. It's the same with Shepherds or any other dog.
     
  13. Panzerotti

    Panzerotti New Member

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    I absolutely love your posts describing the Mals that you know. It is a fact that Mals can be insane, and one can breed with the best intentions and still end up with crazy dogs with (what some may see as) less than desirable traits..... it's the breed. I like that you don't try to sugar-coat the breed....they are definitely not the dog for everyone. My parents and sister have no idea why I would ever choose to live with a dog like Panzer, lol.

    That being said, I really like Stephanie, where I got Panzer. She is very honest about the breed, her dogs, and what she likes and breeds for in Mals. She is incredibly supportive post-puppy purchase as well. However, she will also caution that some of her pups/breedings are not the best for first time Mal owners.

    Another breeder that I really like is La Forge... http://laforgemalinois.homestead.com/index.html
    I have met 4 dogs from Konnie, and they are all very very nice dogs. The ones I've met are all very social, if you're looking for that in a Mal, and great workers.
     
  14. Panzerotti

    Panzerotti New Member

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  15. CharlieDog

    CharlieDog Rude and Not Ginger

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    Thank you guys for the links. I've been checking rescues here periodically and while I've seen a few, I haven't seen any that would fit in my home. And no puppies, which I think would have the easiest time integrating into my house hold. And I'm only able to add a female at this point. I think another male especially would make home life incredibly difficult for Ozzy and Knox both :p
     
  16. stardogs

    stardogs Behavior Nerd

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    Keep in mind that some rescues won't place dogs in homes planning to do bitework with their dogs. That (plus wanting the benefits of a purpose bred dog's genetic foundation and allowing me to alter the dog on my schedule) is one of the reasons I went to a breeder instead of rescue for my malinois.
     
  17. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    I need a female for the same reason, stoopid boys.
     
  18. CharlieDog

    CharlieDog Rude and Not Ginger

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    Yeah, I like girls, but I do prefer boys. :p

    This is also the reason I'm looking at breeders more than rescues. I'd prefer to alter on my own time and having the option to keep the dog intact until maturity and beyond is important to me. Bitework is also something I'd prefer to not be told I can't do just because the rescue doesn't like it/feel its acceptable.
     
  19. Maliraptor

    Maliraptor Bite me.

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    The first link is in Florida. :)

    Second link I have known for years and she is very honest about her dogs. As some of you may not know, I sent Quarrel's dad to the second link kennel to get his dog. I think he is pretty pleased. ;)

    I have a female being bred to our Stud dog this summer, but we are pretty far away from you, in Southern California.

    I want to add one other thing- Each of these kennels suggested have a definite "type" of Malinois they are known for. Find out the truth, and make sure this is the kind of dog you want to live with, and deal with. Some are known for the "Don't Touch Belgians" and others are known for super social but VERY driven dogs. And as always, each litter will vary a great deal. There is a difference also, between a dog bred primarily from Ring lines, (also matters WHICH ring, French ring and NVBK vary greatly) and a dog bred for IPO. Or perhaps a dog bred for conformation, or agility, or all around.

    So, do your research. :)
     
  20. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    D'oh flipped Ivan and Ellis after I c/p'd the links. Thanks :)

    Yup, he's extremely pleased (and thankful for the direction) with Q. He's a really nice dog, now if only his dad would show that in IPO instead of just DD. LOL JK

    (I'm actually going to start helping him in agility for the fun of it. I'll be interested to see how he comes along)
     

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