Kelpie vs Koolie vs BC vs English Shepherd??

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by FG167, Apr 18, 2012.

  1. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    I love hunting line goldens, they are seriously stellar dogs. I feel sorry for people who haven't interacted with them.
     
  2. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

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    how does a McNab fit into this thread?
     
  3. ~Tucker&Me~

    ~Tucker&Me~ and Spy.

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    Oooh I love McNabs :)
     
  4. Shai

    Shai & the Muttly Crew

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    Me too which is why I had to ask...seems some people tend to use the phrase to mean a superhappy doofus who just bounces around and makes love to the whole world all day long

    And I mean they may have those moments but they are also always looking for work and when work is available they are a sight to behold. Focused, very attached to their handler especially when that person is one who has earned their respect, working in what can vary from hours of tedium to controlled chaos with multiple dogs running at once...constantly thinking though in a different way than herders...

    Okay I could go on but I've derailed this enough already I'm sure (sorry)
     
  5. Linds

    Linds Twin 2

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    I think it has a lot to do with age and maturity. Like I said, they turn on later in life and so when they are younger their "Life is a big GAME" tends to make stimulating environments explode their brains until they come into themselves and learn to deal with it.
     
  6. Sit Stay

    Sit Stay Not a Border Collie

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    Totally took that in the wrong way then, I apologize. I agree - most of the time I see "Golden Retriever personality" thrown around it's meant in reference to a happy, bouncy, goofy, super people and dog friendly type. Definitely not my ES, LOL.
     
  7. PWCorgi

    PWCorgi Priscilla Winifred Corgi

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    I would absolutely own a working bred Golden. <3
     
  8. Equinox

    Equinox Active Member

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    This was my impression of English Shepherds as well. Me and Sit Stay have exchanged quite a few PMs and thoughts and it sounds like we both prefer the same type of dog, me as a German Shepherd person and her as an English Shepherd person. My GSD Trent and her ES Quinn have very similar qualities, and are both around the same age. I think Koolies are more like Border Collies whereas English Shepherds are more like German Shepherd Dogs.

    More, as Linds said, a jack of all trades breed rather than a specialist. I believe they are protective when need be, although generally I see them as less actively defensive or aggressive in comparison to German Shepherds. In some senses I see them as having a few traits similar to Guardian type breeds in terms of their demeanor around their family.

    Sit Stay definitely should correct me anywhere I'm wrong, though, everything I know about the breed comes from her and websites she's directed me to. They are a breed I really see myself with in the future.
     
  9. Well, as an outsider, I can offer a mostly unbiased review of the Koolie breed. From what I've seen, they are slow to mature, the boys moreso than the girls. But once they do, they are really solid working dogs. They approach their work with the same enthusiasm that you see in every other aspect of their lives, and pure joy to be working will go a long ways when they have to continue on through discomfort and distractions. They can be incredibly focused, and they're very handler oriented. They have enough energy to keep on going all day long...and then some. From what I've seen, they seem to bond very tightly to their handlers, but they're also quite friendly and social. They're quite agile and confident, which could cause problems if you don't put the proper time and training into them. Oh, and they're incredibly noisy. :p But most herding breeds are noisier than I'd like.
     
  10. FG167

    FG167 New Member

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    So, would I like this breed better do you think? You know Kastle, more or less, and are aware of what I like/don't like in him...I think ;)
     
  11. OutlineACDs

    OutlineACDs Crazy Dog!

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    Yeah, I think that was the intent. Other than color (15 yrs ago), the standard for the kelpie and the ACD was essentially the same. The dogs were of the same height and weight, used over rough terrain in Australia. I think kelpies were developed more for lighter stock, and yes, to be less assholish. :)

    The BC stockdog trials will let anything trial if it works like a BC, so the working style has probably changed some over the years, but they were developed as a more upright, looser eyed dog than the border collie. I've seen a few work, and I haven't seen what Laurelin describes, some can be crouchy, but not near the extent of a BC.
     
  12. stafinois

    stafinois Professional Nerd

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    My in-laws have an English Shepherd that will be a year old next month. She came from a breeder/farm who raises sheep and cattle, and her parents seem to handle the stock quite well. Her parents are as the breed should be, all purpose farm dogs. They herd the stock, guard the farm, work as pest control, and will even tree varmints. My in-laws have retired and sold off their stock, but Cassie is still a nice well-rounded country dog.

    I've never watched her interact with strangers, as it's always just us when we are out there. I'll have to ask about that.

    [​IMG]

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  13. Toller_08

    Toller_08 Active Member

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    I've never owned any of these breeds, but some of my reasons for wanting/getting a Koolie next year is that the breed:

    - Does not seem prone to dog reactivity or aggression at all
    - Is known for a stable temperament and thus should not be spooky with noises, things or people (or anything else) and if spooked, should recover well
    - Is known to be friendly with strangers (after Dance, I am trying hard to avoid having another shy dog)
    - Is not quite as creepy crouchy in their herding style (doesn't really matter, but my preference is for more upright)
    - Is high energy with seemingly good off switches
    - They live to have fun and appear to have a huge zest for life
    - Does not seem to be as prone to neurotic, OCD behavioural tendencies when compared to certain other herding breeds

    And there are probably more reasons that I just can't think of right now. At home I had a document that I made to compare what I'd learned about Aussies, BCs, Koolies and Kelpies when I was trying to decide which one would fit me best, and Koolies came out on top. I knew I wanted a herding breed, but there was always just something that didn't quite fit until I decided to look into Koolies more. They all seem to have a lot of similarities also, and to be honest, I could see myself with all four of those breeds, but right now there are certain behavioural issues I am trying hard to avoid. Koolies just seem to fit the bill perfectly from everything I've read and been told about them. I am so obsessed with the breed. I never thought I'd be as obsessed with another breed as I was about Tollers, but I think Koolies might have almost surpassed that now, haha. It's taking everything in me (and a strict mom) to wait a year for my Koolie puppy.
     
  14. Linds

    Linds Twin 2

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    You should find that document Toller and post it! Would be very interesting.

    Soon I hope I can give a better idea of Koolies, it's hard when I only have my boy and all the rest of my info comes second hand from all the friends and breeders I know.
     
  15. RD

    RD Are you dead yet?

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    I am so interested in Koolies if it weren't for the excitement barking! I love their looks, love their work ethic, love that they aren't quite as quirky as border collies OR as emotionally connected (a big plus for a future service dog)... Just the **** barking!

    I think my boyfriend's perfect dog would be a Koolie. In a couple of years I'd like to talk him out of a GSD and into a Koolie.
     
  16. Linds

    Linds Twin 2

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  17. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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  18. Equinox

    Equinox Active Member

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    Keeping in mind you are getting a sport mix and Jason is thinking of getting/will be getting a Malinois next... it depends :rofl1:

    I generally would lump them in the same group as German Shepherds, whereas sport bred dogs and Malinois would be in a different group. Actually think that Maliraptor referred to the breed in your thread as the "original sport mixes"! LOL

    English Shepherds, to me, aren't really a "busy" breed. More methodical, with those thinking qualities, and controlled even when working instinctively. Just as I would not get a German Shepherd for competitive Flyball or Disc Dog, I would not choose an English Shepherd as a specialized sports prospect. Easy to live with for most people, so long as they are well managed, but without a doubt still high energy, active dogs. Highly handler oriented. Like German Shepherds, some are hard, tough dogs while others are on the softer end of the scale, but I don't believe handler aggression is ever an issue (quoting Sit Stay here, "tough enough for cattle and smart enough for sheep"). Probably higher thresholds in defense, and fight drive/active aggression is not a trait being bred for, but these dogs still Get Things Done.

    I remember someone on the German Shepherd forum posting about their English Shepherd, mentioning that her dog once slammed her out of the doorway and chased off a cougar sneaking around to the side of the house. Intuitive, tough dogs capable of intelligent disobedience and acting on a threat - the same person mentioned that her dog's grandsire stood down a raging bull, and had an uncle that treed a bear at 7 months of age. I know Sit Stay has mentioned Quinn to be an "old soul", and that I see the breed having gentler (for lack of a better word), Guardian type qualities but they are definitely working dogs. Think generic, all around farm collie. I don't think the breed has changed much as a whole. Sit Stay mentioned to me before that they were not bred specifically for herding, but rather for guarding flock (including their family) and hunting vermin.
     
  19. PWCorgi

    PWCorgi Priscilla Winifred Corgi

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    I would be way more interested in a Koolie if it weren't for the barking. :lol-sign:

    If I am going to have a dog beating the snot out of my eardrums, it is GOING to be a corgi :rofl1:
     
  20. mrose_s

    mrose_s BusterLove

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    BARK BARK

    [​IMG]
    5 by Buster-Quinn, on Flickr

    Gotta be the barking and overfriendliness that puts Koolies down a bit on my list. Even with all Quinn's quirks and oddities, I love her full on BCness and I love all the things that make my mother so glad she chose a Koolie.

    Now I have the conundrum of weather to get a kelpie or BC next. Lucky I have a few years to decide.
     

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