Izzy got "jumped"

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by Izzy's Valkyrie, Oct 16, 2009.

  1. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    And by that I mean beat up at the dog park. :madgo:

    Backstory: August was lease changing month here at out complex and a new couple moved in upstairs from us that has a red and white pitbull. Pitbulls are BANNED in our complex or I would have one so that already irked me. I have th feeling they called her a "mix" which would have been fine, if she was well behaved. She's not. This dog will bark and growl at anything in the front lawn of our building from her owner's patio and growls from the other side of the door. She doesn't seem to be too bad on leash walking by but I tend to keep Izzy at a distance on purpose.

    Anyways, today we get to the dog park and I see a dog that looks exactly like the pittie from upstairs and a young woman who looks a lot like the one I see walking her. We get to the fence and the pittie starts growling *She seems to be fine with the other dog in the park at this point btw* I told Justin not to let Izzy off leash since I don't trust this dog.... And he of course lets her off because the pit stopped growling for a split second.

    Bad idea. The dog rushes into the gated entrance area and goes after Izzy and I am beyond mad at Justin and the dog at this point. But the dog was going after Izzy's neck and my poor submissive dog wasn't even trying to defend herself. She kept trying to get behind me and away from the freaking attack dog. So what do I do? I kicked the dog.... Which, by the way didn't phase her one single bit. Tell you what, I don't know what I would have done if my kick had gotten her attention because that is one well muscled pittie. Anyways, the owner is just kind of standing off from them for a few seconds seeing if it will stop while I'm screaming at the dog to get off. Eventually the owner grabs her after they break and Izzy goes in the park only to be picked on by the now very riled up other dog. UGH So we leave those heathens and go over to the small dog section (There wasn't anyone there)

    Thankfully the owner of evil dog left the park shortly there after and the barking dog mostly calmed down so we could go over when a nice BC arrived. Barking dog went after Izzy a couple times but didn't do much more than bark and snap (Which the BC wasn't having any of lol)

    But yeah, I was sooooo mad. And the fact that I know where this dog lives and the rule of the complex since I live here makes me wonder what I should do.... I mean, I guess the dog could be passed in as a service dog but OBVIOUSLY isn't well enough behaved to have that title and this is the first dog ever to go after Izzy and not let off once she submitted.... Should I ask my apartment complex about it? Is that some sort of evil back stabbing? I just don't think it fair to the dogs in this complex to have to worry about walking by this DA already banned dog.
     
  2. FoxyWench

    FoxyWench Salty Sea Dog

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    i hate people that "sneak" pets in already, and these people just sound like idiots, id personally write a letter to management.
    if this dog was at least somewhat well behaved, fine...id be annoyed (as its that kind of sneaking which gets ALL dogs banned)
    but the dog is obviously disruptive, and the dog attacked your dog even after yours submitted (which is just being a bully in doggy behaviour world), and all its owner/handler could do was stand there like a lemon...mabe she was in shock, but to stand there and do nothing when you can see theres a huge issue and potnetially deadly situation is just ridiculous...

    my biggest concern though is the fact that there blatantly breaking a rule that could result in ALL dogs being baned from the building, AND the dog is being disruptive...which will just draw more attention.

    i do want to say i love bully breeds, and i dont think banning a breed is right...BUT i also feel those that try to sneak their way around the rules just ruin it for all...
     
  3. Beanie

    Beanie Clicker Cult Coordinator

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    It might be evil and back-stabbing but if I were in your shoes, I think I would tell the apartment manager that this dog in your apartment complex attacked your dog at the dog park, and that you see it barking from the owner's patio, and now you're worried.
    I don't know if I would bring up the dog's breed though. That's sort of secondary to the situation IMO.

    Did this dog's owner even apologize?? I just don't understand why people are not falling all over themselves apologizing for their dog's behaviour, unless they are so busy trying to get their dog under control they don't have time to do so (which it doesn't sound like that was the case here.)
     
  4. Amber

    Amber New Member

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    I wouldn't call the dog evil..DA may come naturaly. As for the owner, they are being very irresposible and setting a bad example for the breed. Is talking to the owner an option? I know some people are just ignorant, but maybe this person just hasn't had the education or the opportunity to be educated on the breed. If this isn't an option, I would also suggest talking to your management. Getting the dog kicked out shouldn't be your first priority, though, because it would be even sadder if the dog went to a shelter and died because no one took the time to train it.
     
  5. Xandra

    Xandra Active Member

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    Honestly, I understand why you're pissed and I'm not trying to dismiss the situation.

    It is normal for dogs to bark at people off the patio. Should they be trained not to, of course. My dog will bark at people in our front yard. A couple times he barked at the neighbours from the deck when they got too close to the fence. I tell him to be quiet and he obeys... if he were in an apartment he would certainly be inclined to bark off the patio and at people passing in the hallways. That's just him being a good dog... but a little misguided.

    Most people who have dogs are not uber into dogs. They just have dogs as pets and that's fine. It could be that this dog lived in a house before and isn't used to having so many people in its space. It needs some training... now the owner could be trying and not know how, or she could not see it as a problem... yet.

    As for the dog park incident, well, sometimes dogs get into spats. This is a pit bull. If it was actually trying to attack your dog your dog would be pretty messed up.

    The owner sounds like she probably doesn't know much about dogs. There are a lot of people who consider dog disagreements "dogs being dogs"... is it because they are inherently rude and don't care, sometimes. I think a lot of the time though, it's someone who doesn't really know what is considered proper dog etiquette.

    Personally I wouldn't call management on her. Live and let live, right? I would go over there and explain that her pit bull is noisy and she needs to work on that, and say that it isn't a good idea to bring dogs with an inclination for aggression to a dog park.

    Is she polite and accepting of advice? yes/no
    Does she take what you say to heart and put an effort in? yes/no
    No to either of those and go to management.
     
  6. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    Beanie: We didn't really give her time to apologize. She also didn't seem surprised or to care that the dog was growling through the fence :wall: But after the second dog showed unkind intentions as well we just turned around and left. I don't care if you're sorry, if you know your dog can be DA, why would you let it growl and intimidate another (Younger) dog at the entrance?! I wasn't taking chances though and she did at least have the good sense to leave the park right after we did. (Which, I think may have been due in part to me saying "That's the dog from upstairs" and she didn't want trouble)

    Now, I know the dog is a pitt or at least a pitt mix that lives upstairs. I know for a fact that it barks at any dog it can see outside the window and her owner has to take her inside for it to stop. I do not know for a fact that it was the same one at the park. I mean yes it had the same colors and the owner was the same age/sex/hair color but I can't honestly say for sure that it is the same dog. I don't want to cause trouble based on a dog fight with a separate dog. However, this dog is disruptive and obviously of a banned breed. Urgh, I almost want to go upstairs and knock on their door but it looks like they're gone (Lights are all out). Not that it would help, what am I going to do, ask if it's the same dog then tell them I'm reporting them and give them a headstart to move the dog? Yeah no.

    I think I will write a letter to/visit the office and see what, if anything can be done. They've already threatened to take away our dog rights since some people were being slobs and not picking up their waste :mad: They really don't want to ban pets though because they'd lose half their residents as their biggest selling point on their web page is their "Pet Friendliness".

    Thanks!

    ETA: I missed two other posts when I was typing this sorry if you guys didn't get responses!

    I could go see if it's the same person but honestly, not a lot of people will care. It's sort of like, why bring public problems into their household? And if it isn't the same dog I'm going to feel like an idiot.

    The dog may not being aggressive on the patio but is is a banned breed and they aren't allowed for the same reasons Rotties, GSDs, and Dobes aren't (Idiocy in my opinion). I have a thing for following the rules and it bothers me when people overtly break them. I guess if I didn't have this bad experience I would be letting it go but now I'm worked up.

    And what if they ban all dogs because of an incident this dog may cause in the future? I'm not giving up my dog for this poor show of ownership.
     
  7. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    Also: I do have to say I resent the fact that it wasn't a "real" attack by a pitt if my dog didn't get messed up. Uh, no, I just didn't give the other dog time to do damage. The whole thing was over in a minute or less and Izzy has an awesome thick ruff with extra hair and skin that the dog was going after.

    I know you said you weren't dismissing it but that seems like an ignorant comment to me. Doesn't matter what breed the dog was, if it's biting, growling and barking and not letting go with a purpose, it's attacking mine.
     
  8. Xandra

    Xandra Active Member

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    I'm sorry. I got the impression that it was snarling and snapping and no actual holds. I completely retract what I said about it being a "spat" and feel that it is a more serious issue.
     
  9. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    Sorry, I just really got upset when it happened because I honestly was afraid of punctures from this dog. Didn't mean to jump on you. :) I'm pretty sure Izzy's bruised :( But nothing some extra loves won't help.

    On the bright side, shes not afraid of other dogs and is still very loving, not acting off at all.
     
  10. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    I have to say I'm kind of uncomfortable with the language in your original post- the dog being "evil" and such. The dog is just being a pit bull. It's not her fault she's owned by idiots. As for your last sentence, well, what if she were not a banned breed? Would it really change the situation? And you want to own a pit bull?

    This is yet another example of why I don't like dog parks, why I'd never take a dog of any breed to a dog park, and why pit bulls don't belong in dog parks. That poor dog was set up to fail from the beginning. And even though she had a hold on your dog, that she didn't leave puncture wounds says that she was using some amount of restraint, even though your dog has a thick ruff. Dogs who want to put holes in other dogs do so, no matter what the breed.

    I don't know whether I'd report the dog or not. Is this dog park in your complex or is it a separate park? Because if the dog was off leash in a dog park where any dog is allowed, well, it sucks and it's not at all appropriate that the dog was there, but fights happen at dog parks. If the same event happened in your front yard when your dog was leashed and the other dog was illegally offleash, I'd absolutely report it, but you were both in an offleash dog park, and IMO being there means accepting some level of risk.
     
  11. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    I called the dog evil based on what she did to my dog and not her breed. I'd have made the same post if there was a poodle attacking my dog at the park there is absolutely nothing breedist about my post. If any dog that I had to live in close proximity to attacked my dog it would be evil to me and I would be approaching the management about the situation. The dog's breed was brought up because it shouldn't be in this complex in the first place per the rule which the people living here expect to be followed.

    Lucky you having the option to take your dogs places that they can run without a dog park. There is not a single place in my town that allows dog's off leash that is not a dog park and I'm not going to confine my dog indefinitely because of the chance of a fight. She's been there for months with no problems and is a regular, this dog is not *shrugs* There have been other scuffles at this park but never with my dog because all she does is submit and everyone just gets on with it.

    The dog park is separate from my apartment complex which is why I am also dis-inclined to tell the management about the fight. However the dog is somewhat of a nuisance and technically a disallowed breed. If everyone else can follow the rules and not own a pittie /rottie/gsd/perceived aggressive breed or not live here if they do, why can't these people?

    Also, I'm not about to go out and get a pitt bull as soon as I get a place that allows them. I would have looked into rescuing one from a shelter if they had been allowed though because I know they need good knowledgeable homes. And just because I call the one dog, that happens to be a pitt bull, evil doesn't mean that's how I think of the breed as a whole. If I called a chihuahua evil would it even be an issue?

    The majority of the dogs at my particular park are pitts or pitt mixes and they have no caused any serious problems. I have no issue with the breed, They're actually my favorite to love on in the park.
     
  12. Maxy24

    Maxy24 Active Member

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    They probably got rid of their dogs ;)
    If a pit bull owner needs to rent they are in trouble. I'd bet they couldn't find a place that allowed pit bulls, almost no place does. So they could dump her in a shelter like most people do, rehome assuming they had enough time and could find someone willing to take a dog aggressive pit bull, live on the street with their dog or sneak him in and hope no one noticed. Not saying this person actually faced this problem but it is a VERY real possibility.
    I also want to mention that if you do report them there is a very real possibility the dog will end up dead, if the people are not willing to move I'd say doggy goes to nearest shelter. I don't know what your shelters are like though, perhaps they are mainly no kill.

    I would personally have a talk with the owner about the dog park incident. Perhaps tell them if you see them at the dog park again you will report them to housing.

    pit bulls are a commonly DA breed, this behavior does not make the dog evil. I think that is what elegy was saying, that you consider DA dogs evil, Chihuahua or pit bull being DA does not make the dog evil. I understand you are upset and perhaps feel the dog was at fault in some way. But it was not a dog problem, this was an owner problem. They should not have brought their dog to a dog park. DA dogs are fine, when they are not allowed to act out their DA, it's the owner's job to not let that happen.

    I am not trying to take this person's side, perhaps I'm speaking on behalf of the pit bull since his owners are too stupid to make sure he and his breed are not tarnished by his behavior.
    I am very sorry that you had to go through that and am very glad your dog is okay. I hope you have no more incidents like that and hope you and your neighbor can resolve this issue without any hard feelings.
     
  13. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    well, yeah, because i don't see dog aggression as making a dog "evil", and if you want to own a pit bull in the future, i think that's something that you really need to understand.

    i am lucky to have a yard and to have access to my parents' yard for my dogs to run, but if i didn't, i'd find other ways to exercise them. people with dog aggressive dogs do it all the time.

    and i'm not saying that's what you need to do, but i cannot for the life of me understand why you'd loose your dog in a park with a dog who makes you uncomfortable and who you feel had taken issue with your dog previously.
     
  14. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    I don't even think all DA dogs are evil. DA dogs do fine if treated properly and kept in one dog house holds. I called this one dog evil because it specifically attacked my dog. That is the only reason.

    I realize I should have clarified this earlier. For all I know this dog is not DA. It didn't seem to be bothered at all by the other dog playing in the park with it and seemed happy enough to be there with the hound mix. I think the recognition of Izzy as a dog from the apartment complex that she could never get to was somewhat of a catalyst. If this dog has no problems with other dogs I understand it is not DA, that fact that it has a personal problem with my dog does make it a problem for me despite it's breed, not because of it.

    And trying to make me feel bad about reporting a dog that shouldn't be here in the first place isn't going to change my course of action. I know how things can go for a pitty in this town (There are actually a lot with great homes here since they are not banned from all complexes) and there are other (cheaper actually) places these people could have lived. This is beside the fact that in this particular place they are not an accepted breed, simply complex, not town, rules.

    Heck, there's a dog living next door that is what looks to be a purebred Eskie that appears to hate everything around it but the owners keep it on a short leash, don't take it out if there is another dog in the lawn and gives people a wide berth and I appreciate that. A person with a dog that is ill behaved probably knows it, this lady didn't look like an idiot. I am still wondering if it was something about Izzy in particular that set her off.

    In the end, it is up to me what I do about this issue and I will take input into consideration. I may just change dog parks to avoid later confrontation with this dog in particular but the instant something happens on apartment property the dog will be reported no questions asked.

    ETA: In response to Elegy, I did not want Izzy loosed in the park honestly, I wanted to go to the small dog section and get away. Believe me, I wanted nothing to do with the dog. My idiot boyfriend let her off her leash and opened the door. He's not allowed to go with me to parks anymore.
     
  15. Renee750il

    Renee750il Felurian

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    *sigh* It would be nice if you could keep the complaint to the dog's actions and not the breed :( Not blaming you if you can't, but you know how it is . . . ((((((HUGS))))))
     
  16. sillysally

    sillysally Obey the Toad.

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    ^This. Dogs that are not sociable with other dogs are not "evil," even if they go after *your* dog. I don't think for a second that the dobe that keeps trying to get Jack at class (Jack is also submissive and will not do a thing about another dog attacking him) is doing so because he is "evil." He is doing so because he is dog aggressive and the owner does not properly control him.

    Personally, I would not report the dog. First of all, you are not even entirely sure its was the same dog. Second of all, the only offense the dog seems to be committing other than being a pit bull is barking from her house at people passing by. That's pretty normal dog behavior. Dogs that love other dogs and adore all people often bark at passersby from their homes. The owner (if it is even the same dog) took her to the DP, which was dumb, but does not let the dog off leash in the complex, etc.

    BTW--I HAVE had dogs "jump" Jack and Sally in this manner before, so I understand it's upsetting, but if the same thing happened to one of my dogs there is no way I would then run to the management about it.
     
  17. Lizmo

    Lizmo Water Junkie

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    If you're not sure it's the same dog, I personally don't think there is anything for you to do.

    If you were sure it was the same dog/owner, then yes, I would report it to managment ONLY because they are not obeying the rules. That's just me. I don't like liars.
     
  18. Izzy's Valkyrie

    Izzy's Valkyrie Very Food Agressive

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    Evil –adjective
    1. morally wrong or bad; immoral; wicked: evil deeds; an evil life.
    2. harmful; injurious: evil laws.
    3. characterized or accompanied by misfortune or suffering; unfortunate; disastrous: to be fallen on evil days.
    4. due to actual or imputed bad conduct or character: an evil reputation.
    5. marked by anger, irritability, irascibility, etc.: He is known for his evil disposition.

    By these definitions of evil, my one sentence that is apparently setting people off is not incorrect. I did not say the dog attacked Izzy because it was evil, it's actions in attacking her were evil in the literal sense.

    The only reason the breed of this dog matters is because of the apartment's rules. I would have mentioned the breed of the dog no matter what it was when describing the incident. The post would have been shorter because I wouldn't have had to be living near this dog but that would have been the only change. I've wondered if I should report the Eskie next door because it's either reactive to everything or leash reactive (I think it's the latter) and could be hazardous to other tennants.

    I'm really not trying to further demonize Pitties, they have enough to deal with as it is. My stating the breed was simply an observation.

    I haven't seen the dog in the neighbor's window/on the patio since yesterday, I wonder if they're keeping her deeper in the house now *shrugs* Unless something happens again on apartment property with this exact dog, I'm not going to report them. It would be unfair of me to report a dog that for all I know has never been to the park and is otherwise well behaved outside it's loud mouth because of one bad experience with a similarly patterned/built dog.

    That said, I'm done here :)
     
  19. pawzaddict

    pawzaddict New Member

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    I understand the frustration, however, I do not think its your business to rat out a neighbor until their dog has actually done something harmful at the apartment, you have made it clear you are not positive if it was the same dog. If the barking is annoying you, which I understand its annoying but its a dog, then tell the front office that, not "oh I think its a Pit Bull" ...my dogs barked over the balcony at my old apt and I saw nothing wrong with it as long as I brought them in if it became obsessive. I agree with the poster who said this person may have not been able to find another place and why should someone get rid of their pet just because its a particular breed? Times suck right now and too many Pit Bulls are losing their lives as it is.
     
  20. Miakoda

    Miakoda New Member

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    Thank you, elegy.

    This dog is not evil all because you chose to not like her "breed". Don't take out your frustration and anger on the dog when it should be directed onto the owners.

    I've owned some severely DA dogs in the past 13 years. NEVER have I had a dog attack someone else's dog. But I have had other people's dogs, never another "pit bull" mind you, attack my dogs.

    Take the issue up with the owners. They are the irresponsible ones in this situation.
     

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