Help with "stand"

Discussion in 'Dog Training Forum' started by elegy, Jul 23, 2008.

  1. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    Ok, I need to teach Mushroom to stand. I don't care if he steps his front feet forward, I just need to teach him to go from sit to stand.

    When I taught Luce, she made it easy. I used a lure and a clicker and bam there it was. Mushroom, not so much. A lure produces a bunnyhop forward in sit or some other sort of dive forward. I'm afraid to try to click for butt leaving the floor because it happens so fast and I'm not a good enough clicker trainer for that.

    I've tried the plan to just hang out and wait for him to get up, but if he knows I've got the clicker or any kind of reward on me, he'll throw all kinds of different behaviors at me, one after the other, getting himself more worked up and frantic as nothing works.

    I've also tried stepping into him and making him back up, but I just get a backwards butt scoot and no standing.

    He's a very dedicated sitter. :rolleyes:

    The only other ideas I've got are ones involving physically manipulating him, either with a hand under his belly or a leash. I'd rather not go that route if I don't need to.
     
  2. corgipower

    corgipower Tweleve Enthusiest

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    Well, if you don't care if he steps his front feet forward, how about if you have him sitting at heel and take a half a baby step forward. Just enough that he gets up and click.
     
  3. dr2little

    dr2little Moderator

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    The way that I use a lure to teach stand in order to avoid the ever common bunny hop is to use the lure like a magnet. I put the lure ON the nose and lure very slowly, never taking the lure more that an inch or two away from the nose. This way, there's nothing to jump forward for. Dogs nose is steal...lure is magnet.:D
     
  4. Maxy24

    Maxy24 Active Member

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    I was gonna say what Doc said, just hold the treat right in front of his face so he's working at getting it and slowly pull it forward as he's trying to get it from your fingers and he should stand then click and release the treat.
     
  5. Ohm

    Ohm A Unit of Resistance

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    do you have a low table that you can have him sit on? if you do, sit him on the edge so that when you lure him he has no choices but to stand or fall off if he creeps forward in any way.
     
  6. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    Cider was into bum sliding.. She auto sat so well, that any movement resulted in a super fast sit back down. Too small a step her bum barely left the floor..

    We ended up taking a step forward and me putting a toe under her before she could sit down again.. Awkward as heck.. But gave me an extra moment to click.. Worked for us, not the greatest way to have done it though. Also used a broom handle a few times so my foot wasn't always involved. When she partially got it, i could put a finger on her belly and she'd quit trying to sit..

    We now have a very nice stand.. If only she wouldn't wiggle all over for the stand for exam part ;)
     
  7. bcmoffatt

    bcmoffatt totally normal

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    The way I learned it, I had the dog in a sit in the heel position, and I'd reach my right foot behind me and under under the dog, just in front of his rear feet as I'd give my hand signal for stand. When the dog pops up in surprise mark and reward.
    And so on from there, fading out the toe poke, adding the verbal command, et cetera.

    ETA-- I had to practice up against a wall to get it nice and straight. Now him bum pops up nice and straight, while his front legs stay put.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2008
  8. bubbatd

    bubbatd Moderator

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    No clicker in my day , so it was just a signal to come forward , a signal to stop and a signal to stay . Then a reward .
     
  9. adojrts

    adojrts New Member

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    I use my hand target. Petie would scoot forward as well, he already knew how to hand target, so I put the two together and it worked very nicely for the stand.
     
  10. lizzybeth727

    lizzybeth727 New Member

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    I do the same thing, but instead of stepping forward I step backward. It's easiest if you work against a wall at first, of course, and if your dog knows "back" that helps, just take a very small step backward. If your dog doesn't walk backward already, you can just start in heel next to a wall, turn your shoulders into your dog and take a small step backward. If he moves back in any way, he'll probably have to pick his butt up off the ground.
     
  11. corgipower

    corgipower Tweleve Enthusiest

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    Yea, a lot of good different ways of doing it posted here :D

    The way I posted isn't how I do it with my dogs, but I've done it that way with other people's dogs. I teach it to my dogs by kneeling next to them and gently lifting under their bellies with my left hand while I use a lure in my right hand. I fade the lifting very quickly and then fade the lure and I have a hand signal for stand as a result.

    But I hadn't posted that way because the OP didn't want to do it like that :D
     
  12. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    So, somehow (not exactly sure how), we have had success. I think I have dropped the food lure (or hand target- either works) lower and held it there longer, and that has gotten a stand instead of a bunny hop. Now to solidify it and fade that hand out of the way a bit.

    We had to do stands today in our first rally class and I just about panicked! But somehow, when I asked for it, it was there. Miracle!

    Thanks to everybody who made suggestions!
     
  13. Dekka

    Dekka Just try me..

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    I didn't lure it with Kaiden or Dekka. I would teach them to stand by my hand or foot 'helping them' LOL Dekka's stand cue is me lifting my left heel.
     
  14. dr2little

    dr2little Moderator

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    Just to add to my last post, the way that I use the lure is to pinch it between my palm and thumb in an almost open hand so that I can fade from the 'magnet' with a lure, to the open hand sweep forward (hand signal for stand) without the lure. Like the hand signal for stand in this link but a forward sweep.
    http://www.deafdogs.org/training/signs.php#signs (2/3rd's down the page):)
     
  15. Roxy's CD

    Roxy's CD New Member

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    It's been an awful long time since I posted here but as I was checking for PM's I saw this. :) And couldn't resist!

    Not sure if it will work for you, but I've had a lot of success with it, it does produce the preferred style of stand for obedience, the backwards motion where the front feet remain stationary, so the end result is your dog is still in heel position, rather than half a foot in front of your leg.

    Does she know how to back up? Very simply I started with using the hand signal (more or less a target at my side), not the verbal cue to back up, and immediately reward marked as soon as the hind end popped up. Most puppies/dogs back up if you put a piece of food right in their nose a push gently back, immediately popping the food in their mouths.

    A few steps backwards is okay in the beginning as well. It's teaching them that stand is a backwards motion instead of a forward one, in case you ever get to utility where they have the moving stand.

    The signal eventually just turns into your palm moving towards their nose like a button. :)

    It produces a very neat, tidy stand with a smart hand signal.
     

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