HELP! Good Beginner Dog For These Conditions?

[DanL]

What RD said is true - most people looking to break into a house don't want to deal with a barking dog. It's going to attract unwanted attention, so they move on to the next target. So in that respect, our Pug is a great protector because he barks at anything out of the ordinary. If someone decided to come in anyway, he'd bark at growl at them but he'd never get closer than 15'. I'm not sure that someone would shoot a dog either. Gunshots usually attract attention. Of course, if someone is under the influence of something, shooting a dog or having a dog barking at them is not going to matter much.

My wife and I were talking last night. Daisy was barking at something outside. She says "someone would have to be nuts to come into this house after hearing her". I agree. And if they did, not only do they have to deal with her (not that she'd bite anyone, but she is very intimidating with her size), then you have Gunnar waiting in the wings. A bicep bite or a frontal bite on the pectoral at the armpit from him is going to tear the muscle right off the bone, and at that point, most intruders are not worrying about anything but getting the heck out of there.

 

[HoundedByHounds]

ah see Akitas are not a spitz breed, to me any more than a Chow is...they are Primitive breeds.

One way to avoid destructiveness is to get an ADULT rescue rather than a pup. They are past all that...and if they are not...you will know RIGHT AWAY.

 

[bubbatd]

Ollie's bark sure is greater than his bite !!!!

 

[Lizmo]

Great post Dan!

I agree with what RD said. Most intruders are not going to wait to deal with a barking dog -especially if it's a very deep, long bark. Like a bigger dog (English Mastiff, Pyr, Newfie, ect.)

 

[AgilityPup]

I might seem crazy for this, but I would have a Great Dane. I've got Sasha, who is a dark brindle, and is VERY house/Shay protective.

Now, I couldn't tell you if she actualy WOULD bite, but I CAN tell you, she will NOT let a strange person into the house without me telling her it's okay. And she is very good about "You get in the other room!" When I am trying to open the door to let the person in.


But as they have said, I don't think you want a dog that IS going to bite right off the bat, but something that gives a warning, then if the person is still taking steps forward, is willing to protect if necessary.


I know what you mean, I live in a place with quite a few creepy drunks, kids who think it's "cool" to throw a rock through someones window... Or chase our stock to the point of death, and I tell you, having a dane that weighs more than I do, and me telling people I know "Oh yeah, we weighed Sasha, and she weighs more than I do!", just loud enough for the people who do all this to hear, has kept us pretty safe. Even during halloween!

I hope you find the right breed for you, however, PLEASE get this dog proper training, because, with Sasha, she didn't have it, and we went through a stong problem when she "bit" a woman (who we hadn't let in) who was trying to open our door to get in.

 

[pafla]

I cant think of a breed that would be good in doing actually protection without it being high energy,in need of lot of training and who doesnt ask for experience in handler.I can understand the desire to have a dog for protection.I spend each year two-three months at seahouse part out of season.Since most house around us belong to turists I would never feal comfortable without my dogs.My dogs are very territorial but in little one it isnt what you desire.I got her as 15 year old and when she was three months old we had my brother girlfriend visit-she was the first visitor-she barked,growled and attacked her leg.She is a terrier-daschund mix and she is fear aggressive from the day I got her.I spend a lot of time doing desentization,socialization and training and made big steps with her.But she is still a dog who by my opinion on her own teritory if pushed to far would be a potentional biter.My other girl is shepherd mix who is confident and well socilazed but very territorialy protective.In sea all visitors are halted in midle of yard dogs circle,growl,bark and prety much treat people like intruders.they stop on command.Both dogs are not really high energy level but somewhere in the middle are walks are around three-four hours a day in open woods.And they still dont have the energy level of GSD-s,belgians or dobermans.They are obedience trained and work competative obedience and rally obedience.What I am saying is that for me a dog who has potentional to bite is for most people to much to handle.My dogs are never left unsupervised in yard,if we have visitors when I am not home they are removed to my room.I always watch them.They are pack and act as pact and for all obedience a dog who would back up a bark isnt supposed to be in hands of unexperienced owner.You may pull it through it all depends on your character and how much time and money you are willing to invest in dog,and the said dog temperament.
Bulmastiffs sound like good choice-those I have met are gentle giants who scare people of with they looks,but not all dogs off same breed have the same temperament.But they still ask for a firm but fair handling,and need to be obedience trained.Some of the other giant breeds who are actually very sweet in character woul also probably be a good choice.

 

[noludoru]

To the OP, first and foremost any and all puppies will have lots of energy. The first year they WILL require lots of daily walks, good runs, and lots of play time. Are you prepared to provide the adequate excersice that a pup needs, or are you willing to look into a more mellow adult dog? Personally, I think a pup does not suit the requirements that you are searching for.

Yes, there are several breeds that have a natural protection drive, but many of these breeds have very high prey drive, high energy levels, or higher than daily walks anyhow, they require good runs. If I had to pick a breed that would suit you I would suggest again an English Mastiff, but they aren't for every dog owner. They have large vet bills, drool a lot, and are VERY big. However, an adult is very laid back and content to lay on the couch all day long. Their size alone will make any intruder rethink facing up to a 200 lb dog and testing whether or not they will react. A mastiff was originally used for guarding, although the temperament is much more relaxed than it once was, they still have the instinct to protect if they absolutely must. Typically a Mastiff will get in between you and whatever is causing the threat thus causing the threat to leave before they have to become reactive.

Noccy, a lot of the livestock guardians and mastiff breeds have lower exercise requirements. If you're okay with a really big dog, why not look into a female English Mastiff? They're obviously a lot larger than a Rottweiler, but they're generally rather agreeable dogs and the ones I've been around were not difficult to control, despite their size.

Agreed! Especially the bolded parts, lol. I think an English Mastiff would be a VERY good breed for you to look into, especially an adult or older rescue. Chances are if you get the dog from a rescue (VS a shelter) they will already be housebroken, basic obedience trained, and the foster parents should know the basics of the dog.. whether he/she is good with cats, destructive, low or high energy, etc.

I also think a retired racing Greyhound would fit the criteria you are looking for, possibly even more so than the Mastiff. They are smaller (but still LARGE dogs) and admittedly Greys aren't as much of a visual deterrent, rescues have many of them so there will be plenty of dogs that will fit in with your lifestyle. While Greys aren't nearly as intimidating as, say, a Doberman, one snarling and/or barking certainly will be equally intimidating. I would back off from ANY dog snarling at me, regardless of size--because even a small dog can do considerable amounts of damage if they are determined--and your average robber would, too.

Both have low exercise requirements and you can get both as adults. Saintgirl pretty much covered the WHY of getting an adult vs a puppy, but I'd like to bring in one other facet of that... it's HARD to find a good breeder. Unless you want to monetarily support abhorrent establishments such as puppymills (and pay thousands in vet bills later, especially with large breeds) and further their exploitation and irresponsible breeding of more dogs, it's not going to be easy or (relatively) cheap to get a puppy. Most well-bred medium-to-large breed dogs are 1,000+ and even after you've found a great breeder you will most likely have a wait of at least several months for your puppy, if not far longer. If you go to any old Joe Schmoe who bred Fifi to the neighbor's Rex because he wanted some cute puppies, that's not applicable. But, once again, you don't have a good chance of getting a healthy dog because god knows where Fifi and Rex came from, and their parents before them. Probably no health testing at all, and who knows about temperament.

 

[DryCreek]

Before you decide on any breed, I would suggest finding out if there are any Breed Specific Laws where you live and if your insurance company has a banned breed list that they won't cover. It may end up limiting your choices.

Talk to a few local Vet offices and maybe the police station as well. They may be able to steer you in the right direction towards finding reputable breeders or trainers.

Gives you an opportunity to check out your options for which Vet Clinic you will be using and it's never a bad idea to meet your local police as well!

Good Luck!

 

[Lilavati]

My experience is that ANY dog, other than a toy, is something of a deterrant. I feel safer with Sarama with me (and she's only knee heigh and 50 lbs) and most of the people I've talked to say things like (you're going out after dark, bring that dog . . . meaning Sarama).

That said, your neighborhood sounds scary enough that I'd lean towards a large dog . . . but again, I think ANY large dog is a deterrant, except perhaps a golden retriever. And black dogs to seem to me more frightening, followed by brindle. My mother had a standard poodle when she lived alone in a bad part of town, because she was kept in a puppy clip, no one realized that big shaggy dog was a poodle . . . so they just thought big dog and kept away. So, I think any big dog would work.

I would hestiate on any of the guardian/protection breeds, because it sounds like YOU are scared. The dog will pick that up, and act (in its mind) appropriately. You don't want a dog that thinks that everything around is a threat (because no matter where you live, that's no true) and worse you might move somewhere safer and be left with a dog that many would consider dangerous. Since you are a beginner, I'd lean towards something large, dark and looks more scary than it generally is (though most dogs will move to protect you if you are threatened): a big black lab or black standard poodle (though neither is low energy), a dark colored great dane, a Newfie, or a number of other breeds that I don't know enough about to name.

You might also think about one of the bull breeds (absent BSL) but if you do DON'T get them from someone who claims they breed great guard dogs, etc. You're too likely to get sucked into the 'pit bulls are vicous/macho dogs crowd of breeders. But they are powerful dogs, and many, many people are afraid of them, even if they are complete lovebugs. Get one from a respectable, responsible breeder who breeds for some other purpose (or from a shelter, lots of nice ones need homes).

Keep in mind its better to frighten people off than hurt them, especially if they aren't actually dangerous (you don't want a lawsuit on your hands!).

 

[Bahamutt99]

Before you decide on any breed, I would suggest finding out if there are any Breed Specific Laws where you live and if your insurance company has a banned breed list that they won't cover. It may end up limiting your choices.

:hail:

 

[Boemy]

Also, since you're a high school junior, what will happen when you go to college? Is your dad really prepared to take care of the dog all that time?

 

[mrose_s]

I havn't read gthe entire thread but i was also thinking some sort of Mastiff breed, I'm not familiar with a lot of them but I think I've read that a lot of work has been put into bullmastiffs and they are a great family dog and an exellent judge of character.

Several things though, if you can't move due to lack of funds, what if the dogs gets very hurt or very sick and requires urgentand expensive medical assistance?
What will happen when you got to college?

My boy is ACD/kelpie. I would trust him with my life, you'd have to be an idiot to come near someone with a blue dog so he allows me to walk at night. No way would I suggest him to a first time dog owner, he is high prey drive, high energy, stubborn and difficult when he wants to be. He has issues with other dogs but thats my own fault.

Our best girl is Sophie, 40kg, white and brindle. Her shoulder is almost to my hip. She's protected us when needed numerous times but she is still the only do I leave out when I know the Pizza man is coming, she doesn't have to bark. I go over, open the door, start sorting out food/money and she will usually wander over and look the pizza guy up and down, wait by my side for me to finish then go back to bed as I get dinner ready. I like having her there, I know if need be she'll look after me but she's the perfect lady when there is no threat. I would trust her with dogs, kids, adults and the elderley. I would also trust her to help me when I needed it.

Sophie is a BoxerX (maybe some mastiff in there somwhere - and a lot of other things)
harry is ACD/BC, suspicous of everyone
Buster is ACD/kelpie, completley aloof untill needed
Mac is whippet/kelpie/foxy. She just reads off the other dogs and reacts the same as them. But when out alone with my sister at night and she spots a suspicious person she hnkers in close and gets quite suspicious.
Everyone of them exerts themselves when needed.

I personally would pick a relativley easy breed atfirst, perhaps an adult shelter dog.

 

[maybe532]

Well, since you don't have a yard and therefore will have to walk the dog I'd go with a larger breed since you'll need a sense of protection when out and about. I would look into rescuing an adult mastiff or any of the giant breeds mentioned. Pure breed rescues should be able to tell you if they are good with cats or not. Their bark should deter any intruders and they tend to have lower energy requirements than the smaller protection breeds. You could also consider english bulldogs. They look fierce yet are low energy and I don't think they are too much for a first-time dog owner. They cost quite a bit but you should easily be able to find an adult rescue. They do have some health concerns but most breeds seem to.

What kind of dogs do your neighbors have? Have those dogs helped deter break-ins?

I was reading last night that an untrained protection dog (such as a german shepherd) will usually go for the leg on an intruder, making it easy to kick them in the head or shoot/stab them. That alone makes me think those types are a bad idea unless you have the funds to train them properly. But if you are just looking for a dog that intimidates other people and therefore keeps them away then you have more options. Any giant dog or any large-sized dark dog is pretty intimidating.

 

[showdawgz]

Maybe, an untrained protection dog is more dangerous than a trained one. Through training the dog learns self control and to hold the bad guy at bay rather than going in for multiple bites to undesignated areas. They learn to target the bite. They is no telling where a dog will bite if they have a strong civil drive, so may go for the leg others for the neck, others for the hip (i've seen them all). My young male (never done formal protection training with him) went for the throat when my friend decided to run up behind me screaming and yelling when he knew that dog was very suspicious and sharp (thankfully I am always on guard when I'm walking my "sharp" dogs) and pulled him back, but he targeted the neck/face area).

This is NOT the kind (sharp/suspicious) of dog the OP wants, because you have to be very careful with these types of dogs who will bite with very little agitation. You need a very confident environmentally sound dog. A dog that will sit back and wait until they need to bite, not just jump in a bite. Mace is that type of dog, he will just sit back and wait for the situation to get bad. Anyone can run up behind me but Mace will only warn them to back off and trust me his presense is enough to make people think twice, and then if they proceed he will bite. But I have yet to meet someone stupid enough to overlook Mace's bark/growl.

 

[Amstaffer]

For the Beginner I would say the Newfoundland. Newfies are very big and usually all black (some people find that more scary) and have very deep barks and growls. However unlike Mastiffs they are IMHO more stable and more forgiving of the inexperienced owner. I think Mastiffs are great dogs (EM) but I don't think they are really what I would call a "beginner" dog. Mastiffs are guardian dogs where Newfies are rescue dogs; being a rescue a dog gives them a "softer" outlook on the world.

I would go to a Newfie rescue or Petfinder.com and see what you can find.

Goodluck and keep us posted on what you end up doing

 

[ihartgonzo]

The main point of my post was to try and quell this myth that any dog will protect, it's simply not true.

I totally agree... with your whole entire post.

One really good example, is a Chow/GSD mix who belongs to family members. This dog (Bruno) barks menacingly at ANYONE who enters the house; even me, who he has known since he was a puppy. He even acts kind of scary sometimes... lunging to get to you, roughly mouthing you if you're playing with him, and pretty unpredictable behaviors. The owners liked it that way... they always bragged that, for sure, Bruno would protect the house.

Well, a few months ago, their house was robbed. I don't even think they locked the door, they thought Bruno would scare away anyone. They found Bruno just hanging out in the garage... the robbers obviously had no problem putting him in the garage, and going about their business. I definitely was not surprised, he's pretty much a "dumb", unreliable dog, to be perfectly honest. I would not trust my belongings or my life to him, ever!

My BC, on the other hand, can be very intimidating to suspicious strangers... and I have actually witnessed him protecting our house, when a flower delivery guy decided to walk in! He didn't touch the guy, but he was about and inch away barking his head off, and if the man hadn't frozen in his tracks, I'm sure Gonzo would have acted on it. I would trust Gonzo to protect me, if I did live in a sketchy neighborhood, but I don't feel he's quite "the norm" for his breed. He's extremely drivey.

I also agree that very large breeds with a predisposition to protect, like Newfies or Mastiffs or Great Pyrenese, would be a very good option. Most of all, you want a dog with a stable temperament, who is loyal and bonded to you... that will almost guarantee protection. I don't recommend typical working protection breeds, like GSDs or Mals, unless you're willing to dedicate a LOT of time and work training, working, and exercising it.

 

[milos_mommy]

i don't often recommend a puppy for a first time owner. also, with an adult dog, you can be sure he's okay around cats. Most shelters and rescues will cat-test dogs to see how they react.

A lot of very large dogs are not high-energy. Obviously they need exercise, but nothing strenuous. A large dog that's very mellow will be just as intimidating to a predator as a collie or something.

Rotties are pretty high energy. I immediately though bull-mastiff, when reading your post, but they can be a bit difficult for first-time owners.

Boxer fits perfectly, but they do need a bit of exercise. Depends exactly how much time and space you have for exercising.

Breeds such as St. Bernards, Bernese Mountains dogs, Newfoundlands, Great Danes, etc. aren't as high-energy as some smaller breeds. Even though they're massive, they do well in apartments.

 

[milos_mommy]

For the Beginner I would say the Newfoundland. Newfies are very big and usually all black (some people find that more scary) and have very deep barks and growls. However unlike Mastiffs they are IMHO more stable and more forgiving of the inexperienced owner. I think Mastiffs are great dogs (EM) but I don't think they are really what I would call a "beginner" dog. Mastiffs are guardian dogs where Newfies are rescue dogs; being a rescue a dog gives them a "softer" outlook on the world.

I would go to a Newfie rescue or Petfinder.com and see what you can find.

Goodluck and keep us posted on what you end up doing

couldn't have put it better myself!

 

[Boemy]

I definitely agree, a lot of people find black dogs scarier. I had a ridiculously friendly black lab mix and people would still fearfully cross the street to avoid us.

I would go to a shelter and look for a medium to large adult dog with a laidback temperament who's good with cats.

 

[Renee750il]

To an experienced, highly confident owner, I'd say an adult rescue Fila. Obviously, that's not practical AT ALL in this case.

Hounded's Akita suggestion has, I think, a lot of merits. One of the best protector/guardians I've ever had was the Bear, the adult GSD/Akita mix I got from the pound. He was also steady and reliable enough to be certified as a therapy dog. He and my big blue cat, Gonzo, were totally companionable from day one.

It does sound to me like an adult rescue could be the perfect choice.