Feminist.... Are You One?

[Greenmagick]

I think if a 13 year old cant understand having a feeling vs acting on a feeling we have much bigger problems on our hands......

I agree a LOT of pop music is questionable in its content. But then discuss it, explain to children why you agree/disagree/etc. Open a dialogue. Some, yes, I do think can be damaging but the songs do not drive society; they are a reflection of it.

 

[sassafras]

Splitting hairs, I don't think most 13 year olds are that deep to consider ooooh is she singing about an action or a feeling.

I don't think it's splitting hairs. And not only do I think 13 year olds are capable of understanding the difference, I think it's super important for them TO learn the difference: While that having a feeling like that isn't necessarily wrong and is part of being human, they need to learn how to find a different way to deal with those feelings instead of acting them out. Otherwise, what else are we doing with 13 year olds besides teaching them how to be adults who don't act on every impulse they have?

 

[release the hounds]

how many ho's you think I ran a train with? I could sing songs about it all day long. Find 'em, **** 'em and Flee you know. I still know the words to most of those songs. Still listen to them on occasion too because i think it's funny i ever listened to that stuff. How did it influence me? I surely knew the difference between a song's lyrics and treating people with respect. Just like I can tell the difference between a movie and real life. I suspect a good number of people can. In fact I'd say most.

 

[Dizzy]

I think if a 13 year old cant understand having a feeling vs acting on a feeling we have much bigger problems on our hands......

I agree a LOT of pop music is questionable in its content. But then discuss it, explain to children why you agree/disagree/etc. Open a dialogue. Some, yes, I do think can be damaging but the songs do not drive society; they are a reflection of it.

You could get deeper and look at what drives music though... Who controls what songs are released, on the radio etc... We are all puppets to some degree!!

Unless you wander off the beaten track of spoon fed society by exploring some of the other 'scenes' you can live your whole life believing what you're told (music is dumbed down... Probably more damaging than pink, rap and hardcore porn clips all mixed together lol).

Good parents open dialogues, most parents are pretty average though. They don't think about it in day to day living.

 

[Oko]

I think you're really underestimating 13 year olds mental capabilities.

 

[Saeleofu]

I don't think most 13 year olds are that deep to consider ooooh is she singing about an action or a feeling.

you can live your whole life believing what you're told (music is dumbed down.

So...I'll just let the quotes do the talking here

 

[Oko]

I think if a 13 year old cant understand having a feeling vs acting on a feeling we have much bigger problems on our hands......

I agree a LOT of pop music is questionable in its content. But then discuss it, explain to children why you agree/disagree/etc. Open a dialogue. Some, yes, I do think can be damaging but the songs do not drive society; they are a reflection of it.

I agree whole-heartedly! I had a lovely conversation with my ten year old sister about how 1D's 'What Makes You Beautiful' is saying you're only beautiful if you are self-conscious, and as long as this guy here thinks you're beautiful you should have great self esteem, because what guys think of your looks is totes the only factor...but wait, don't, because you're only beautiful if you don't know it.

 

[Dizzy]

I think you're really underestimating 13 year olds mental capabilities.

I'm not and have not said music will make kids turn into raging aggressive man haters or women beaters. I think greenmagic said music is a reflection on society.

When pop music talks about thinking about slapping people (or sex, hello Rhianna) then I assume that is a reflection on society...?

Specifically POP music churned out the the masses.

I'm not actually saying pink can't sing whatever the hell she wants to. I just find it mind blowing its on mainstream radio daily. Along with many other songs. Mainstream POP radio songs, now including more sex and violence (sorry, feelings ).

Its FASCINATING.

 

[~Jessie~]

To answer the initial question, no, I wouldn't really consider myself to be a feminist. In zoom's definition, yes, I am... but I'm so far from a bra burning, hairy legged woman full of girl power.

I think that most children have the ability to separate song lyrics from real life situations. Same with movies, video games, etc. I've never been one to buy the whole "violent video games make violent children." I've played video games from the time I was four years old. My friends and I would play Mortal Kombat when I was in elementary school. I've NEVER wanted to have a fight in real life... actually, it's always been quite the opposite!

One of my favorite songs at age 12 was Semi Charmed Life by Third Eye Blind. I remember my friends and I would blast it on the radio and sing along. For those who don't know, it's a song about crystal meth. Here's a good chunk of lyrics:

The sky was gold, it was rose
I was taking sips of it through my nose
And I wish I could get back there, someplace back there
Smiling in the pictures you would take
Doing crystal meth, will lift you up until you break
It won't stop, I won't come down
I keep stock with the tick-tock rhythm, I bump for the drop
And then I bumped up, I took the hit that I was given
Then I bumped again, then I bumped again
I said...

How do I get back there, to the place where I fell asleep inside you
How do I get myself back to the place where you said...

...Those little red panties they pass the test
Slide up around the belly, face down on the mattress

I've never done crystal meth, and the lyrics didn't appeal to me... but I loved the energy and beat of the song.

Most inappropriate content will go over kids heads anyway, and the stuff that they do understand won't make them want to go out and do it.

It's like telling a kid "I'm so hungry I could eat a horse" and then they bring home a horse for dinner. They're not going to take everything literally. Kids can easily separate "I'm so mad I want to slap someone" and actually doing it.

 

[Oko]

I'm not and have not said music will make kids turn into raging aggressive man haters or women beaters. I think greenmagic said music is a reflection on society.

When pop music talks about thinking about slapping people (or sex, hello Rhianna) then I assume that is a reflection on society...?

Its FASCINATING.

I'm not saying all songs on the radio are suitable at all, some are downright awful. But in this case she's not slapping him. She feels like slapping him. I sometimes say I felt like slapping someone, when recounting a frustrating encounter with someone. It's an exaggeration. I'm saying, I think a 13 y/o can understand the concept of exaggerating.

To answer the initial question, no, I wouldn't really consider myself to be a feminist. In zoom's definition, yes, I am... but I'm so far from a bra burning, hairy legged woman full of girl power.

As brought up earlier, Zoom's description...that's much more 'normal' feminism. There's this stereotype of 'crazy feminists' that people like to use, especially to brush off feminism as over the top...and feminism does not mean not shaving your legs. It means the choice to do what you please with your own body hair.

 

[Dizzy]

I'm not saying all songs on the radio are suitable at all, some are downright awful. But in this case she's not slapping him. She feels like slapping him. I sometimes say I felt like slapping someone, when recounting a frustrating encounter with someone. It's an exaggeration. I'm saying, I think a 13 y/o can understand the concept of exaggerating.

That song was just the current one I keep hearing and finding really annoying because REGARDLESS of whether she is doing or thinking, if it was a MAN singing (same lyrics) it I don't believe it would be on the radio...

Back to my original point

I'm talking mainstream radio.

It seems ok men can sing about women as sex objects and women can dream about man hating!

If women are ok to sing about men like that, then we have no grounds to say men can't sing about women's bodies...

Hence my point. We don't need feminism, we need HUMANISM!

 

[Zoom]

As far as music goes and how sh*tty it can be and still not get banned, I present Exhibit A: Chris Brown.

There are a nauseating amount of WOMEN who defend that walking POS, just because he can sort of sing.

How it became ok for someone to put their SO in the hospital, TATTOO their beaten face onto their NECK and still have WOMEN fall all over themselves to defend his actions...this is why I am a feminist.

 

[Dizzy]

As far as music goes and how sh*tty it can be and still not get banned, I present Exhibit A: Chris Brown.

There are a nauseating amount of WOMEN who defend that walking POS, just because he can sort of sing.

How it became ok for someone to put their SO in the hospital, TATTOO their beaten face onto their NECK and still have WOMEN fall all over themselves to defend his actions...this is why I am a feminist.

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurgh.

Pop stardom is sickening at its best. He represents the worst of the worst.

Footballers are also notorious for DV, but are treated like gods amongst men. And are worshipped by men, women and children alike.

 

[Oko]

I'm talking mainstream radio.
It seems ok men can sing about women as sex objects and women can dream about man hating!
If women are ok to sing about men like that, then we have no grounds to say men can't sing about women's bodies...
Hence my point. We don't need feminism, we need HUMANISM!

It is 'feminism', but considering it's meaning is not 'ra ra boys suck, girls rock' (not saying you think that, just some people totally miss the point and think it's a bunch of man-haters lol) and is 'equality for both' (and for the matter, people that don't identify as either), my feminism is humanism. The unfairness in our culture for guys drives me just as nuts as for girls.

But you've also got to factor in other factors besides the music, like rape culture and violence towards women. There isn't some big problem with girls slapping their boyfriends, that I'm aware of, which makes it much less inflammatory for a girl to sing about *wanting to*, wheras there is a double standard for guys because it's more sensitive, yes.

So I think we pretty much agree.

And oh gosh I'm tired, factor in other factors, hm? Yes, hafta try that lol.

 

[sillysally]

No one is blaming music for domestic violence.

I'm suggesting if a man sang about slapping or WANTING to slap a woman there would be outcry.

Don't even get me started on objectifying women!!!

And music IS society. It is identity. Identity comes from upbringing, culture, peers. Music, fashion, peer relationships, etc etc etc.

If you don't think these things have patterns you're blinkered!! Music and lifestyle can and often do go hand in hand.

You can't BLAME anything, but you can do the maths and look at what society is and how it relates to identity, popular culture, morals and ultimately actions.

You can definitely look at groups who like different music styles and identify different behaviour patterns. Easy peasy. Look at music through the ages.... You're telling me punk music had no influence on society? Or rave scene? Or mods and rockers? Or even the Beatles!

You can't BLAME anything, but people listen to music they relate to and feel comfy in that niche.

Anyway, I'm rambling.........

Actually, Eminem has a song that was in pop radio for quite a while about an abusive relationship and he certainly wasn't driven off the air...

Next time I'm pissed, I'll lay my fist at the drywall
Next time? There won't be no next time!
I apologize even though I know its lies
I'm tired of the games I just want her back
I know I'm a liar
If she ever tries to ****ing leave again
Im'a tie her to the bed and set this house on fire
I'm just gonna


Dizzy, it might be a cultural thing, but in the US there most definitely are songs plays on pop radio about men beating women. There are also songs about women killing the men that beat them. When the Dixie Chicks song "Goodbye Earl" first came out it was banned from many country stations. There is also a Miranda Lambert song about a woman preparing to gun down her abusive boyfriend after he's released from jail.

 

[Dogdragoness]

To answer the initial question, no, I wouldn't really consider myself to be a feminist. In zoom's definition, yes, I am... but I'm so far from a bra burning, hairy legged woman full of girl power.

I think that most children have the ability to separate song lyrics from real life situations. Same with movies, video games, etc. I've never been one to buy the whole "violent video games make violent children." I've played video games from the time I was four years old. My friends and I would play Mortal Kombat when I was in elementary school. I've NEVER wanted to have a fight in real life... actually, it's always been quite the opposite!

One of my favorite songs at age 12 was Semi Charmed Life by Third Eye Blind. I remember my friends and I would blast it on the radio and sing along. For those who don't know, it's a song about crystal meth. Here's a good chunk of lyrics:



I've never done crystal meth, and the lyrics didn't appeal to me... but I loved the energy and beat of the song.

Most inappropriate content will go over kids heads anyway, and the stuff that they do understand won't make them want to go out and do it.

It's like telling a kid "I'm so hungry I could eat a horse" and then they bring home a horse for dinner. They're not going to take everything literally. Kids can easily separate "I'm so mad I want to slap someone" and actually doing it.

Yes, that's like I loved the coolio song "gangsta's paradise " back in the day but I never wanted to be a gangster because of it ... I just liked the beat of the song ... Still do

I like Katy Perry's "ET" which is essentially a song about sex (which is ESP obivous r you have seen the music video)

Also drugs / sex in music is NOTHING new. Example, just turn to any classic rock station & listen for a while, but just in case you don't have one here are a few examples:

Drugs:
Dr. Feelgood - Mötley Crüe
Welcome to the jungle- Guns N Roses
Puff the magic Dragon - The beetles
Most of Pink Floyd's songs
Most of Led Zeppelin's songs
Give me shelter- Rollint Stones

Sex:
Satisfaction - the Rolling Stones
Hot for Teacher - Van Halen
Panama - Van Halen
You shook me All Night Long - AC/DC
Girls Girls Girls - Mötley Crüe

I'm tired so thats all I can think of off the top of my head right now lol

 

[Red.Apricot]

Late to the thread, but I absolutely identify as a feminist. The movement IS about equality. Being a feminist doesn't mean I don't shave my legs (I do--I like feeling silky). Being a feminist means I don't think the state of my legs should have any bearing on my worth as a person.

 

[RD]

I'm an equalist in all aspects, including gender roles. I'm all about the power of choice, and the power of tolerance for the life choices of others.

I think the word "feminist" gets a nasty stigma attached to it because of the bigots who sneer down their noses at passive women who don't WANT to put their career before their families or their joy in life. Unless you legitimately want to, you don't have to spend your life advertising the fact that you're DOING THINGS like a MAN WOULD in order to prove that you're a man's equal.

Equality is great. Activists with sticks up their asses and loudspeakers for their inner monologue are not.

Music, IMO, is not the reason for gender inequality. There are just as many hugely popular songs which glorify women as there are seemingly derogatory songs which objectify them.

 

[oakash]

Eminem has three songs that are about abusing women, and two of them are him hypothetically killing his wife. If a man sang the song instead of Pink the only difference is that no one would say anything about it. The Beatles have a song that is basically just threats to a girlfriend. There's loads of songs about abuse that allowed to be played, and you're right, they're not all sung by men, but Pink's line in that song is about restraint, not following through with the action.

I've never outright said I'm a feminist, but I am for equal rights for men and women, because women are still treated like Sh!!. For all the reasons that Zoom stated, I am a feminist.

 

[Dogdragoness]

Actually, Eminem has a song that was in pop radio for quite a while about an abusive relationship and he certainly wasn't driven off the air...

Next time I'm pissed, I'll lay my fist at the drywall
Next time? There won't be no next time!
I apologize even though I know its lies
I'm tired of the games I just want her back
I know I'm a liar
If she ever tries to ****ing leave again
Im'a tie her to the bed and set this house on fire
I'm just gonna


Dizzy, it might be a cultural thing, but in the US there most definitely are songs plays on pop radio about men beating women. There are also songs about women killing the men that beat them. When the Dixie Chicks song "Goodbye Earl" first came out it was banned from many country stations. There is also a Miranda Lambert song about a woman preparing to gun down her abusive boyfriend after he's released from jail.

Oh yeah "I'm gonna go home & load my shotgun, sit by the door & lite a cigarette. He wants a fight, well, now he's got one ..." OMG I love that song!

Also the one by lady antabellum called "I need you now" could be interpreted As a "booty call" song (" it's a quarter after one, I'm a little drunk & I need you now...")

If you want a "rah rah boys suck, girls rule" artist ... Google Taylor swift :/ (who I hate with a flaming passion) I find her songs more annoying then all the sex, drug & woman/ man beating songs put together