Fear aggressive Pit Bulls

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by PitBullLove, Nov 13, 2013.

  1. SevenSins

    SevenSins APBTs & One Crazy Banana

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    One of the two incidents that you're claiming is causing "negative perception" of my breed and particularly causing you to be "wary of Pit Bulls." It seemed to me that your first thought was to think of the APBT negatively, but not the other dog/breed, or its irresponsible owner.

    I never said it wouldn't cause an issue. I said more likely than not, an unleashed dog running up to a leashed Pit Bull and being attacked would not be heard about (and, frankly, shouldn't be), whereas if a person ran up to a HA Pit Bull and was attacked, it would be a headline.

    Nobody ever claimed otherwise.


    Nope, just responding to what it seems like you were saying. It's not really my fault if other people aren't clear in their intentions.
     
  2. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

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    It seems as though seven sins does that with a lot of people's posts.

    Anyway if the dog in the OP's siggy is the one in question, he doesn't really look like a bully to me, maybe a bully mix? But to me he looks more like some kind of hound mix.
     
  3. Dizzy

    Dizzy Sit! Good dog.

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    Any dog killing, injuring or maiming any other dog, no matter the circumstance (and PARTICULARLY if the dog that causes injury is a high profile breed) will cause negative press because I can GUARANTEE you the story will be told with a different twist by every party involved - innocent owner, guilty owner and bystanders.

    Everyone will have their own version of events and I highly doubt anyone will walk away not having something to say about the high profile breed dog. Personally I think a dog attack towards a leashed dog is totally unpredictable, and often unavoidable, but EVEN SO, the crap thing is it will have shock waves. You can't be blasé about it.

    I do agree that I would be far more stressed owning a HA dog than a DA dog, as I see more humans in my life than dogs, and situations where dogs are present are far more manageable to me than ones where humans are present. For ME in my life.

    I'd rather not own either DA or HA dogs though!!!!

    Can't advise on the op really.... I think I'd be questioning if I was the right owner for the dog tbh.
     
  4. SevenSins

    SevenSins APBTs & One Crazy Banana

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    Nope, and I've never twisted any of yours around either. You simply don't get to pull "know what I mean, not what I say" around me. ;)
     
  5. Laurelin

    Laurelin I'm All Ears

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    I said I'm wary based on my experiences. I said nothing about your instance at all. And it's true, I'm sorry. If my dogs are around and I don't know the pit bull owner well then I'm pretty darn wary. There are a couple other breeds I'm a little extra wary about too also based on experience.

    We had a GSDx growing up that had issues with other dogs to say the least. He sent two dogs to the emergency vet and both times was on our property. However, I look back and think once the first incident happened, they probably should've been more proactive about keeping a repeat from happening. The second dog was a golden who was walking off leash and ran up to play and our dog gave him an injury needing 60 stitches. Now, should the golden have been off leash and running amok? No, but our dog severely overreacted in my opinion. The golden owner actually admitted fault but that's a lot of liability with a dog that would lay into another like that over a dog just coming over to say hi. It's not something I'd want to manage... which was my attempted point. I'd much rather deal with the dog that snapped when you groomed them or snapped when you grabbed the collar. My lifestyle means my dogs are taken with me a lot of very dog-centric places. It just wouldn't work.

    Anyways, sorry for being unclear.
     
  6. SevenSins

    SevenSins APBTs & One Crazy Banana

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    Hell I'll pull APBTs completely out of the equation and use Laurelin's currently non-existent sighthound as an example.

    You're walking your sighthound on leash. Suddenly, a small off-leash dog runs past yours. Your dog snatches it up and kills it. Do you think that this is a "problem" with your dog or whichever sighthound breed it is? Should people be striving to breed this trait out? Do you think it does or should cause a negative view of the breed? Should your dog be euthanized or medicated because of this? Or do you chalk it up to your dog possessing a breed trait and someone else being an idiot, but it's not your fault the incident happened?

    Same question, but replace "small dog" with "child" and we'll assume that the dog "only" bit the kid in the face but didn't actually kill it.
     
  7. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

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    While that very well may be, in this case I thought that Laurelin's post was very clear. I wasn't referencing my posts in that statement. You do have a tendency to be needlessly rude.

    You have a lot of knowledge on the large mastiff breeds as well as the bully breeds, I do not understand why you choose to respond to people with rudeness and snark instead.
     
  8. SevenSins

    SevenSins APBTs & One Crazy Banana

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    Something to be said here about a pot and a kettle...

    There is absolutely nothing "rude" about anything I've posted in this thread.
     
  9. StillandSilent

    StillandSilent New Member

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    I think that this is a case that could go either way. What the op needs to do is talk to a behaviorist, and then take a very hard look at things. Clearly the situation as it is has become dangerous. There have been multiple bites that are escalating. That leaves 2 options.
    1). Op euthanizes the dog. This way everyones safety is gaurenteed, but leaves the op devastated and wondering what if.
    2)op works with the dog, who may or may not ever be safe. They may live a happy life together, or he may bite someone else and be pts. There's no way of knowing.

    The situation ks complicated by the living arrangements. Roomates not only mean themselves, but their visitos/family/friends coming over. It only takes one mistake.

    Op, I think you're in a tough spot. To me, either choice could be correct. I love my Gambit, but living with a dog with his issues can be exhausting. Do you want to spend the next 10 or 12 or 15 years always watching and advocating? Only you can know when its too much.

    I know the joy and the heartbreak of a dog like yours, though not quite as severe, so I would stand behind whatever you choose. I euthed one ha dog, and I kept the other. Both choices came down to me in the end, since I was the one living with it.

    I wish you peace with whatever you choose.
     
  10. sassafras

    sassafras mushinois

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    But again, this dog doesn't have a history of unprovoked bites? The dog seems to have some body/restraint issues and possible response to punishment/restraint (being "shown" his urine accident) but if I get bitten by a dog once for grabbing its collar, then I grab its collar again later without working on touch sensitivity or being reached for... that isn't an unprovoked bite, surely?

    If that is the expectation for this dog (that it should tolerate something it has shown it doesn't tolerate in the past without the issue actually being addressed as far as I can tell) then I agree it's probably not the best household and the decision in this situation would seem to be obvious. And I wouldn't necessarily fault someone for making that decision in their own individual circumstances... especially here where there are apparently roommates who don't really seem to fully grasp the situation.

    But I honestly don't understand why this particular dog is being lumped in with dogs who bite "unprovoked?" :confused:
     
  11. JacksonsMom

    JacksonsMom Active Member

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    I've had the same experiences and it's very sad. Because I've never been one to be prejudiced towards ANY breed, and I will usually always stand up for a Pit Bull, but I am extremely cautious around them and won't let my little dog go say hello to a Pit Bull that I don't know. And that probably makes me look like 'THAT' person, or a snob, but I can't risk my dogs life after what I've seen some Pit Bulls do, and how I've seen them act in the dog parks around here. There are a lot of "it's all how you raise them" people that attend our dog park who probably make a worse name for pits. But I've seen some very scary body language going on in a lot of pits I see around other dogs.

    I have to say that I've never seen a HA pit though. I don't worry about them for my own sake, more just my dog. I am not sure what I would do if my dog was that unpredictable AND a pitbull. I definitely don't envy your situation and feel for the OP. :(
     
  12. sassafras

    sassafras mushinois

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    Yes but those things can happen whether you have an HA dog or a DA dog or an intact dog, too. And just because other people put higher value on the life of a dog than a person, it's ok to gamble with other people's dogs lives? "Oh it's ok for me to manage this DA dog, because it's only going to attack another dog, not a person." If that was YOUR dog that got attacked or killed, would you think that the owner keeping/managing a DA dog was responsible?

    Again, I don't think managing a dog with issues is necessarily easy, nor is it responsible for every household to do so. If someone or their roommates/family members aren't going to take management seriously then yes, the situation can be dangerous and euthanasia might be the best choice in THOSE circumstances. All I'm saying is not under EVERY circumstance or in every household, just because of a dog's breed.

    But at the same time I think it's a really artificial construct to make managing a dog who has bite triggers into some insurmountable obstacle while simultaneously hand-waving DA away because the exact same mistakes can be made with managing and someone is going to pay for it. Just because it would be another dog instead of a person, makes the risk worth it? I truly, honestly cannot internalize this dichotomy.

    That's exactly what you do. I've only done it twice, but in neither instance did the child persist after I've physically body blocked and yelled DON'T PET MY DOG, nor did the parents complain. They knew they weren't watching their own kids. Not in response to any particular incident, although Pip does have stranger danger and I'm not completely sure how he would react, but I don't allow kids to pet ANY of my dogs without my express permission and in a controlled manner. It's really not that hard if you are willing to stand up to people and be perceived as rude.
     
  13. DenoLo

    DenoLo New Member

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    I've body blocked kids before too. They got the hint right away. If they were robot/zombie kids that keep coming at us despite body blocking/Stop sign hands/ DONTPETMYDOG I'd probably just spin my dog in the other direction and go in the opposite direction.
     
  14. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

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    You can yell and block as long as your don't put your hands on the kid, I have stepped btw a kid and my dog and yelled (very loud) DONT TOUCH MY "PROPERTY"!!) and I wouldn't hesitate to do it again, someone has to teach them to ask before they touch something that belongs to someone else.

    Like I said ... I am not a petting zoo.
     
  15. SpringerLover

    SpringerLover Active Member

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    Not that I'm part of this thread but... you'll never convince me that predation behavior (sighthounds) is the same as aggressive behavior.

    /soapbox
     
  16. Babyblue5290

    Babyblue5290 Happy Meal. Yum.

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    I just had to say I agree with the above. I would euthanize this dog but only because after reading the description of the dog and the bite incidents I don't believe the op has the ability to safely manage the dog. That's not meant to be a stab at the op. I believe that there comes a point that you need to take a serious look at your dog, his problems, and your ability to handle those problems. It's hard to say you don't have the skills to handle something like this, especially when you're dogs life is on the line. If I ever thought one of my dogs was a danger to those around me and I want capable of handling it I would have to make that hard decision.
     
  17. SevenSins

    SevenSins APBTs & One Crazy Banana

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    LOL Yeh I get that one a lot from sighthound people too. Apparently "well that's different" because while their Borzoi would "only" run down and kill the neighbor's toy Poodle if given half a chance, mine would actually run down and kill their Borzoi.

    It only "counts" if a dog will engage and potentially dispatch one bigger than it, of course.
     
  18. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

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    I don't think your APBT's could catch a sight hound ... Just saying.

    Prey drive is not the same thing as DA, I have a dog who has a lot of prey drive (actually they all do) and they will kill: rabbits, squirrels, mice, and other varmints and even cats if they are foolish enough to wonder into my yard. But they get along swimmingly with other dogs.
     
  19. sillysally

    sillysally Obey the Toad.

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    So you don't think there is a difference between a dog that would go after a small dog under specific, prey drive triggering circumstances and a highly DA dog that would go after any dog under any circumstance?
     
  20. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

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    This.

    It took some training to convince Josefina that small screaming/ yippy dogs are NOT varmints xD, now she knows they are dogs, so does that mean she is a ticking DA time bomb? Please.
     

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