Fake service dogs

Discussion in 'Dogs - General Dog Chat' started by Shakou, Feb 20, 2013.

  1. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    4,168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    2
    Location:
    Gillett/Flower Mound TX
    A valid point: I am phobic of spiders but they still sell: plush spiders, spiders in pet stores, fluorescent / bright light gives me a migraine, ill behaved kids (sorry but it's true) ... & i know i am not the only one who is bothered by those things ... But they are still there, those things.

    Case & point? Just because a person "doesn't like" something doesn't mean it should be banned. I to have broken my fair share of laws including taking my dog to places they are "technically" not allowed.
     
  2. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I've said it again, as have so many other people: If you want to drag your pet with you, work to change the laws, as disabled people had to work to change the laws to allow access for handlers with service dogs. Until that point, DO NOT drag your pet into a place it doesn't belong. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of law. Unfortunately it's a law many of you seem to consider yourselves above.
     
  3. Zoom

    Zoom Twin 2.0

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    40,739
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Denver, CO
    I'm wondering how many people who are on the side of "i'll take my dog where ever I d*mn well please" are willing to ignore "Employees Only" signs and just waltz right into any old section of a business, because hey, it's not hurting anyone, right? Surely those signs only apply to the unemployeed and homeless, because technically if you have a job, you're an employee, right? Same with "No Trespassing" signs. Ignore those "because you can" and see what happens. Take an 8 year old into a R-rated movie and then b*tch up a storm because you can't take your "well-behaved" child any place you feel like.

    SD handlers have had to, and still have to, fight an uphill battle for access and frankly I'm appalled at some of the opinions in this thread disregarding those who ACTUALLY have a horse in this race.

    Sure, I'd love to be able to take Sawyer with me everywhere and he's proven that he is so well-behaved in public that most people don't even know he's there. I took him into the tasting room of a local brewery (dogs are allowed, BTW) and even though it was elbow-to-elbow, very few people even realized he was there unless they happened to look down as we squeezed through. However, I don't have a documented disability and whatever impairments I might deal with aren't to the point that I require a service dog. Do I feel calmer, less stressed out and less likely to want to murder people if I have him with me? Sure. But that still doesn't classify him as a service dog and I would be a right b*tch to try and claim otherwise and force my way into inappropriate access.
     
  4. Locke

    Locke Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2010
    Messages:
    1,919
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    It makes me angry when people sneak their pets into places that prohibit pet dogs, and when those people admit they have done so, I have spoken out about it.

    HOWEVER

    I also hold the opinion that a well behaved pet is not necessarily detrimental to the image/status/access of SDs, mostly because I would just assume that a well behaved dog in a public space where dogs are not allowed = SD.
    Do I think it's okay for that person to do it? No. Not at all.

    I have a problem with people generalizing how "fakers" act and look. As many people on both sides of this conversation have experienced, SDs can appear as "fakers" and "fakers" can pass as SDs.
     
  5. OwnedByBCs

    OwnedByBCs Will Creep For Sheep

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2012
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    5
    Location:
    Colorado
    Home Page:
    This is *exactly* how I feel.
     
  6. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    VERY well said, Zoom! :hail:
     
  7. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    4,168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    2
    Location:
    Gillett/Flower Mound TX
    While I agree with some of your post, i do not agree with "a well trained pet doesnt belong in public" why? because its the law? becaue "big brother" says so? meh, i am a self admitted rule breaker, I have taken my dog to many places where dogs arent allowed (fairs, flea markets, & other types of open-air marketplaces) & was never once kicked out or questioned, i ddidnt even attempt to fake my dogs being service dogs (it was clear they werent) what I DID however, was spend MANY HOURS training them to behave... amazing how much that makes them invisable.
     
  8. release the hounds

    release the hounds Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2008
    Messages:
    4,381
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    7
    Location:
    Midwest
    I don't need to wonder, people follow laws they want to, and break ones they don't. I haven't met a person alive that is above this.
     
  9. Saeleofu

    Saeleofu Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2009
    Messages:
    9,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Taking a dog to a place dogs aren't allowed IS faking your dog being a service dog. Service dogs are not required to have a cape, vest, harness, or anything identifying them as such. By being in a place they're not allowed to be, your goal is to make other people think they belong there, and thus faking them being a service dog.
     
  10. Xandra

    Xandra Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    3,806
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    no the goal is to take the dog somewhere, not to slight service dogs. If I saw a dog on a leash walking with someone at a market I would NOT think "oh a service dog" and I doubt many people would.
     
  11. Dogdragoness

    Dogdragoness Happy Spring!!!!

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    4,168
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    2
    Location:
    Gillett/Flower Mound TX
    Exactly, if anyone here is without sin (as in, having NEVER broken a rule, policy or law EVER) then please, go right on ahead & cast the first stone.

    I am NOT talking about those who knowingly fake their way into stores just so they can take their dog in, yes I think that we are all in agreement that this is wrong.

    what I am not agreeing with is the adversity to people (me included) taking their dogs to "technically dog friendly" places even though they "arent allowed" (Not talking about Walmart here) I think they even should be allowed in resturants, beecause I mean I eat in the same house with my dogs & I havent died yet... we as a society IMHO need to get over ourselves. I have seen some people's hygiene practices & I have to say that any person who says that dogs are "too dirty" needs to look at their own species before saying that :/.

    About the comment of "dragging my dog along" You make it seem as though it is a miserable time for them & they hate it ... when in fact, my dogs (cant speak for anyone elses, just mine) love going on outings with me, you should see them when i get their leashes, because they know they are going on a "car ride" to somewhere fun & exciting :).

    though I did tear a stupid lady a new one when she rounded the corner at PetsMart (back when I was younger & a WHOLE LOT less patient) & actually tried to order me & my dog to move so she could get by with her appearently dog phobic kid, my response was: "**** you, lady, this is Pet'sMart, not Toy's R Us" LOL.
     
  12. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Messages:
    10,233
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    Wait. What?
     
  13. Flyinsbt

    Flyinsbt New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2012
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    3
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I think it's a little excessive to assume that every time someone takes a dog somewhere it isn't allowed that the goal of the person is to fake their dog being a service dog. Way back in one of my posts, I mentioned the Latino families I sometimes see in the grocery store with a couple kids and a little fluffy dog in their shopping cart. Are they deliberately faking a service dog? I highly doubt it.

    In Florida, back in December, I walked with Tess into a cafe. I'm pretty sure that in Florida, as here, it would be illegal for my dog to be in the cafe as she is not a service dog. However, it was allowed for my dog to be on the patio, which is where I was going, I walked in to place my order rather than wait on the patio because it was way hotter in Orlando than we were acclimated for, my dog was panting heavily, and I wanted to get some water for her ASAP. I didn't figure she'd be mistaken for a SD; she wasn't wearing any kind of SD gear, I don't look disabled. I figured I'd be taken for someone who was either vague on the law, or just kind of rude; either of which was okay for me, as my priority was my dog's safety. And I don't think she was mistaken for a SD, the person I placed my order with shepherded us back to the patio pretty efficiently after I'd done so.

    I deliberately broke that rule, not with the intention of faking anything, but with the intention of breaking a rule, that I figured I could get away with long enough to meet my goal of protecting the health of my pet.

    How about another scenario? On another occasion with Tess, I was trying to pick up my vehicle from the tire place, it wasn't ready when it was supposed to be, so I was sitting in there, leafing through a magazine, with Tess lying at my feet. (on a down stay. They have popcorn there for people waiting for their vehicles, so I wanted to keep her away from it, and not have her notice it and start mooching.) As far as I know, there is no rule stating she can't be in there. I didn't see any such sign. However, I also didn't look super hard for such a sign. It's possible that there was a "no dogs" sign posted in a poorly chosen spot. So if there was actually a rule against it, my well-behaved dog could somehow have been mistaken for a SD, I suppose. (or even if I'm correct that it was not against the rules, the fact that she was behaving so well could have fooled someone into thinking that.)

    Again, not an attempt to pass my dog off as a SD. If I think my dog is allowed where I am, even if she is mistaken for a SD, it's still not fakery. There was no such intention.

    Unless someone tells you they are deliberately faking, or unless you are a mind reader, attributing motives is simply guess work.
     
  14. Greenmagick

    Greenmagick New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2011
    Messages:
    3,199
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    9 not counting ducks, chickens, and fish
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Classy :rolleyes:
     
  15. Shakou

    Shakou New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2011
    Messages:
    790
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It probably wouldn't bug me so much if people just did this rather then lying.
     
  16. sparks19

    sparks19 I'd rather be at Disney

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    28,563
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    3
    Location:
    Lancaster, PA
    Home Page:
    Totally nO horse in this Race for me but this stuck out...

    You said you wouldn't think "oh dog in a place whete dogs aren't allowed would not equal service dog". Really? So you would see dog in dog forbidden place and think awww someone brought their pet? Or would you think that dog had a reason for being there or just not think anything of it because most places whrete you see dogs where dogs are not allowed would have a reason to be there other than PET.

    You may not conciously think it but I would bet anything that somewhere you figure the dogs is there for a reason
     
  17. Romy

    Romy Taxiderpy

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2006
    Messages:
    10,233
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    It sounds like the way you handled it was pretty good. Because you'd already had her outside it was strongly implied that the dog was a companion.

    When Strider was in training I had really good success just poking my head in and saying, "hey, is it okay if I bring my dog in?" Nobody ever said no for some reason. They often thanked me for asking. Even food service places where technically they weren't allowed indoors, but I figure it's their cafe and if they give permission and want to risk a health inspector waltzing through the door at that moment that's their lookout.

    That gives the establishment the option of refusing (which they don't have when someone just walks in with an unmarked dog) and then they're aware it's not a SD. I think it's just overall polite.

    One lady at an antique store was like "YES! I'd rather have a hundred dogs in here than most people's children." :rofl1:
     
  18. AdrianneIsabel

    AdrianneIsabel Glutton for Crazy

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2010
    Messages:
    8,893
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    2 Pit bulls and 2 Malinois, We like to stay busy.
    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Home Page:
    No way, I have never broken any law, ever.

    Truth be told anyone who has ever taken a dog into a place of business is actually only criminal of trespassing if said business owner denies access.
    Legally speaking there is a difference between entering with a dog and claiming said dog is a service dog when they are in fact not.

    We've all trespassed in one way or another, it is an interesting point no matter the moral right of the topic.
     
  19. Xandra

    Xandra Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2009
    Messages:
    3,806
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    If I see a dog on a leash on an airplane or in a movie theater, I'm probably going to think there are some special circumstances because there's no way you could bring your big pet dog on a plane and it would be difficult and nonsensical to sneak one into a movie theater.

    If I see someone walking a dog around a no-dogs market though, like in my post, or sitting on someone's lap in a pub, with no vest or anything... nope I honestly wouldn't think service dog. I'd think someone didn't want to leave their dog in the car or something.

    ... or like, when I brought my dog into the atm part of the bank at 1 am (the only time I've brought him into an establishment that wasn't a pet store)... yeah I don't expect any passersby thought "oh hey look at the girl with her service dog," I expect they thought "oh someone brought their dog into the bank." Or, even if they didn't articulate it in their heads, I imagine that's how they perceived it.
     
  20. Flyinsbt

    Flyinsbt New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2012
    Messages:
    886
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    3
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I tend to just take the assumption that it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission. Though I wouldn't usually try to take my dog into a place where dogs aren't supposed to be, I used to do that with my bicycle when I used it for transportation. Just take it in, on the assumption that they'd tell me to put it outside if it was a problem.

    And I tend to assume, if I see a dog without a SD vest in a place where dogs aren't supposed to be, that it's probably someone using that same theory. We have to remember that most people don't know the laws about SDs, and aren't likely to even consider that they might be mistaken for such.
     

Share This Page