Custody case of Justina Pelletier

[sparks19]

Thoughts?

http://www.bostonglobe.com/lifestyl...ssachusetts/puyPhesGkKE6rGLid2VM2L/story.html

This is UNBELIEVABLE to me. How can the powers that be just STEAL peoples kids from them because they disagree with a diagnosis? The girl was being treated by another hospital so it's not like she was just left to suffer but that's not good enough? NOW they have say in WHAT and HOW a child's illness is treated and even dispute WHAT that illness is between two hospitals? She's gotten worse. One judge filed a motion to have her move back to Tufts hospital which DCF refused to do and still hasn't done... the Pelletiers lawyer is calling for contempt of court but NOTHING is done? How can this BE? I wonder how many children who are TRULY abused are falling through the cracks right now while all resources are wasted on this kidnapping

 

[Greenmagick]

On the surface it seems asinine and crazy...my hope is that there is more to the story that the courts are privy to.

It can be a tricky line for sure...I am all for parents being the decision makers BUT sometimes someone needs to step in. This case certainly doesnt seem like one where that would be needed on the surface.....

 

[sparks19]

I don't know... with them refusing to send her back to the original hospital and her condition NOT improving under the care of BCH with their diagnosis of "it's not physical... it's mental" and locking her up in a psych ward... I'm hard pressed to see that this is any better for her.

 

[release the hounds]

I read about this before, and it's not all that uncommon. I think it should scare people, but sadly most don't seem to care.

I'm of the opinion that unless you're starving your kids to death, beating them bloody or abusing them sexually there should be NOTHING anybody else can say or do. They can be pissed, they can vent on message boards, they can talk to neighbors, they can shun you at the PTA and grocery store, but they should NOT be able to do or say anything else.

The Hopsital is way out of bounds. It is a parent's right to disagree with with them as a provider and to refuse care. It is their child after all, not anybody else's. I'd feel the same way if it was a parent refusing diabetic care on religious reasons, parents refusing chemo because they don't want to put their child thru it, or a parent that has been and wishes to continue to treat under another hospital and group of physicians such as this case. It isn't YOUR decision to make!

It's appalling how much power certain groups of people have over you these days. I can't imagine what the parents are going thru. The parents should have the right to sue every single board member of the Hospital and ever doctor that has performed medical treatment without informed parental consent.

 

[Greenmagick]

Oh I agree....It certainly does not seem that way at all!

It seems to be completely crazy and scary.

I just meant I hope there is more to the story because if not its a REALLY big deal!

 

[sparks19]

I read about this before, and it's not all that uncommon. I think it should scare people, but sadly most don't seem to care.

I'm of the opinion that unless you're starving your kids to death, beating them bloody or abusing them sexually there should be NOTHING anybody else can say or do. They can be pissed, they can vent on message boards, they can talk to neighbors, they can shun you at the PTA and grocery store, but they should NOT be able to do or say anything else.

The Hopsital is way out of bounds. It is a parent's right to disagree with with them as a provider and to refuse care. It is their child after all, not anybody else's. I'd feel the same way if it was a parent refusing diabetic care on religious reasons, parents refusing chemo because they don't want to put their child thru it, or a parent that has been and wishes to continue to treat under another hospital and group of physicians such as this case. It isn't YOUR decision to make!

It's appalling how much power certain groups of people have over you these days. I can't imagine what the parents are going thru. The parents should have the right to sue every single board member of the Hospital and ever doctor that has performed medical treatment without informed parental consent.

EXACTLY!!!!

Oh I agree....It certainly does not seem that way at all!

It seems to be completely crazy and scary.

I just meant I hope there is more to the story because if not its a REALLY big deal!

Yes, I know what you mean. It's a sad state of affairs when we have to hope it's worse than it seems so at least it wouldn't be so CRAZY!

 

[Dizzy]

All I will say is that I know cases of children in the system, children who have been adopted, whose parents have gone to the papers etc. I've read what is reported vs. what REALLY happened... And well.... It made me sick. Very sick and angry!!!!!! It does go both ways sometimes too I might add, but in the one I have direct knowledge of it was just outrageous what was being reported. I obviously can't say what because of confidentiality, but let's say people were painted in a victim light, and I can assure you the ONLY victim was the poor child who suffered abuse. The outcry from the public was similarly disgusted with the actions of the workers, which ooooooooooh how I'd like to see them read the evidence and see the photos!! Those "poor victims" would have been hung by the same public, I can assure you of that. But with only half truths (total lies) being reported, how are people to know?! I might add this was not a case of my own!!!!!!

Do NOT believe everything that is written. There's a lot of fact and opinions missing from that story to present a balanced argument. You can't make a judgement till you have everyone's version of events.

I can assure no journalist will have the facts. Or reverend. Or anyone else for that matter, other than those directly involved.

 

[Snark]

From what I've read and heard, yes, the parents have a reputation for being 'difficult', and yes, they did shop around to find a hospital, BUT, Tufts has a pretty darned good reputation and BCH refused to even discuss the girl's case with her primary physician. Then the court slapped a gag order on the girl's family - yeah, something smells and I don't think it's the parents.

It's frigging ridiculous - BCH stuck the girl in a psych ward, won't let her get any kind of schooling so she's at least a year behind, and the poor kid got to spend Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving, and her birthday by herself. She gets to see her parents (but not the rest of her siblings) for ONE hour a week, with DCF and security in the room. Parents aren't allowed to even take a photo of her. Yeah, that's SO much better.

 

[sparks19]

From what I've read and heard, yes, the parents have a reputation for being 'difficult', and yes, they did shop around to find a hospital, BUT, Tufts has a pretty darned good reputation and BCH refused to even discuss the girl's case with her primary physician. Then the court slapped a gag order on the girl's family - yeah, something smells and I don't think it's the parents.

It's frigging ridiculous - BCH stuck the girl in a psych ward, won't let her get any kind of schooling so she's at least a year behind, and the poor kid got to spend Christmas, Easter, Thanksgiving, and her birthday by herself. She gets to see her parents (but not the rest of her siblings) for ONE hour a week, with DCF and security in the room. Parents aren't allowed to even take a photo of her. Yeah, that's SO much better.

Right? If it were the parents doig all these things people would be screaming "abuse... Neglect" but when DCF and all mighty BCH does it... It's a ok? DCF hasn't followed through with one court demand and yet No backlash? WTF?!?!

DCF claimed "medical care abuse" by the parents for takig her back to the hospital where she had already been seen an not allowing BCH to lock her up in psych. Yet... They eventually released her from BCH all together and put her in the system without the medical care they said she had to have and removed her for. THEN the court said she had to be returned to tufts and DCF never even called or made and appt and refused to send her back to the original hospital. Sounds like a lot of backtracking and cover up by BCH and DCF, IMO!

 

[Paviche]

Do NOT believe everything that is written. There's a lot of fact and opinions missing from that story to present a balanced argument. You can't make a judgement till you have everyone's version of events.

I can assure no journalist will have the facts. Or reverend. Or anyone else for that matter, other than those directly involved.

This is kind of where I'm at with this case, too. Taken at face value? Yes, it's absolutely appalling and unfathomable that something like that could happen to the family.

But the flip side is, we are only getting half of the story. BCH can't say anything because of patient confidentiality, which puts them in a really shitty spot where they can't defend themselves at all because they can't talk about the case. So as horrible as it all sounds, I'm really reluctant to take sides because we just don't know the full story, only what the parents are telling.

 

[sparks19]

The parents were put on a gag order almost immediately.

And why would the court
Order the child to be sent back to Tufts and DCF ignored it?

 

[release the hounds]

This is kind of where I'm at with this case, too. Taken at face value? Yes, it's absolutely appalling and unfathomable that something like that could happen to the family.

But the flip side is, we are only getting half of the story. BCH can't say anything because of patient confidentiality, which puts them in a really shitty spot where they can't defend themselves at all because they can't talk about the case. So as horrible as it all sounds, I'm really reluctant to take sides because we just don't know the full story, only what the parents are telling.

And the parents were put under a gag order. And it shouldn't even matter. If the parents were that horrible CPS should be involved and there should be criminal charges filed against the parents. If not, then the hospital should have no say.

 

[sparks19]

And the parents were put under a gag order. And it shouldn't even matter. If the parents were that horrible CPS should be involved and there should be criminal charges filed against the parents. If not, then the hospital should have no say.

That's what I'm saying! Since when can one hospital just outright over rule another hospital and then take all parental rights away?

She was GETTING MEDICAL CARE... That's what this is about. Nothing about physical abuse or neglect... Just one hospital treating a physical illness and then another hospital deciding it's a mental disorder and to hell with the diagnosis and treatment she was getting... Take her away and lock her UP! They LOCKED HER UP in a psych ward for crying
Out loud!

 

[joce]

All I can say is working on a psych unit you would not believe what we hear!

Families can convince outside people we are awful and blah blah but we can not say what is really going on. If people only had a clue sometimes. Personality disorders are rampant and drama drama drama, woe is me etc etc. Read up on them.

And drs will treat and operate on people with somatic illnesses all the time!

So with this story? Who knows. But hospitals do fight with each other over things especially when drs don't want to be proven wrong about something.

 

[sparks19]

Hospitals can argue all they want but they should not be able to just be like "well... we don't like your diagnosis so we're kidnapping her from her family. sorry about your luck" and the girl has gotten WORSE under their care. That's why the court ordered her transferred BACK to the hospital that was treating the physical condition... but they refuse? WHY and why isn't they court treating this as contempt of court? The girl isn't even GETTING medical care other than the basics in the system now... she's been removed from the psych ward and is just in "general custody". It's BS.

The idea of stealing a child from her home because of a disagreement on medical treatment (NOT and absence of treatment, mind you) is INSANE... perhaps they should be in the psych ward

 

[Snark]

And in all of this, has anyone heard if the judge, the doctors or the DCF have EVER asked the girl what she wants? She's a teenager! She's not a little kid! She should have some say in what they're doing to her. Oh, yeah, BCH declared her a mental case... So what happens when she turns eighteen? They just kick her loose, having lost 3 years of her life? Providing, of course, she's still alive...

Yes, there is probably more to the story, but this has been badly handled all the way around. I'm sorry, but I just don't trust DCF, especially after reading stories where children are given back to drug addicted or abusive parents to later wind up dead.

 

[Greenmagick]

Yes, there is probably more to the story, but this has been badly handled all the way around. I'm sorry, but I just don't trust DCF, especially after reading stories where children are given back to drug addicted or abusive parents to later wind up dead.

Well, and that's my hesitation with this story. The default, to a fault, is to keep the children with their parents. So USUALLY when they really are taken there is a valid reason.

However, yes, it can very much depend. I also have heard a couple horror stories about certain DFS workers putting their own ideology above what is actually going on. As a non-traditional family in many ways I do worry about this at times...we unschool, dont vaccinate, I am Pagan, etc. I have seen the stories of revenge...a ex, a MIL, a neighbor, etc calls and happens to find a worker who does not like the family's decisions that are against the norm and the kids get taken. But even with those, we dont always know the whole story so its tricky for sure

 

[sparks19]

DCF has now removed all visitation rights from the family citing that they "worry about threats to her
From the
Publicity"

 

[Linds]

I refuse to jump to conclusions seeing how little actual facts are being presented and the way it's very, very one sided.

That being said, I thought this Slate article did a really good job showing more than one side so I thought I would throw it into this thread.

http://www.slate.com/articles/healt...ease_boston_children_s_hospital_suspects.html

 

[joce]

I think its just so shocking for a normal thinking person to believe this could happen. It does. Some people are just very ill in other ways.