Cocker with natural tail

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by Shannerson, Jul 19, 2007.

  1. Shannerson

    Shannerson New Member

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    Hi all, I am such a nut, researching so many breeds. I've got over 100 dog breed books and I just know I will end up with another rescue anyway which is fine, but I just laugh at myself. I guess I enjoy learning about them all.
    Does anyone know of a breeder of cockers (am or engl) that leaves the tails natural? I am curious to see how they look. Or anyone have any pictures?
     
  2. Zoom

    Zoom Twin 2.0

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    I found this breeder who leaves the tails, though the pictures aren't very helpful. I didn't look too closely as to how reputable they are though.
     
  3. HugABull

    HugABull Bully Breed Advocate

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    If you request, they may leave a puppy for you with the tail intact. I know of several breeders of other docked breeds that will do this if requested reasonably.
     
  4. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    You'll find more english breeders that leave the tail natural.. or look at dogs in rescues.. In north america, no decent american cocker breeder leaves the tails.. the ones who do you really wouldn't want to be buying from..
    English tails most look like very small setters.. flowy (there's a bunch that compete in AAC agility here).. The few americans I've seen with tails were random, didn't look the same.. One's tail had like an inch of fur and curled upward.. Since not bred for tail qualities.. they might all be a little different.
     
  5. Dekka

    Dekka Just try me..

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    The problem with leaving a tail (speaking as a breeder with a breed with shortened tails) is that at 3 days you don't know which pup (if any out of that litter) will be suitable for that particular person.

    So yes try rescue..
     
  6. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    I know no breeder that will do that. At three days it's near impossible to decide what puppy is going to what person to leave one undocked in any breed.
     
  7. PWCorgi

    PWCorgi Priscilla Winifred Corgi

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    I think Tessa has a cocker with a natural tail, maybe you could ask her for some pics :)
     
  8. FoxyWench

    FoxyWench Salty Sea Dog

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    youll find more breeders in the uk who leave their tails natural because docking is illegal on pet dogs. (its insane yes i know because one never knows at that age who will be going to pet homes and who will go to show homes) and because of this most dont crop any of their pups.

    in the US because the practice is legal, most cocker breeders (of weither am or eng cockers) will dock because thats whats expected in the ring and by most buyers.
     
  9. taratippy

    taratippy New Member

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    Sorry but you've got that slightly wrong! Its illegal to dock any pups for pet or show homes! Only pups that will go on to work may have exemption.
     
  10. tessa_s212

    tessa_s212 Guest

    I don't know of any breeders, but I do have a cocker with a natural tail. Alot of natural tailed cockers seem to have nasty, skinny, bony tails..but Summer's tail is thick and not ugly. :)

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Psyfalcon

    Psyfalcon Fishies!

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    The one I have seen has sort of a scraggly setter- tail. Its as if you are seeing the lineage between setters and spaniels, but its clear that no one has been breeding for a spaniel tail for a long time, while the setter tails have been refined (or at least not accidentally genetically abused.)
     
  12. elegy

    elegy overdogged

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    the only cocker i've known who had a full tail had a really nice one. i think they're quite attractive with tails, really.
     
  13. Sapphire-Light

    Sapphire-Light woof!

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  14. HugABull

    HugABull Bully Breed Advocate

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    Note, that is why I said *may*.
    Some people have a puppy reserved regardless of it's age.


    I also do not get where 'no decent breeder leaves tails intact' comes from. I know plenty of breeders who do not dock tails who are extremely responsible.
     
  15. MafiaPrincess

    MafiaPrincess Obvious trollsare Obvious

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    At three days, no breeder knows what each puppy is going to be like. Making it irresponsible to randomly choose one to leave. Being the cocker breed standard in north america makes it irresponsible to choose not to dock. Good breeds will tell you a flat out no if it isn't a choice in the breed standard including fabulous people on this site with docked breeds. It's not as simple as saying gee lets not dock that one. A good breeder wouldn't want their name on that puppy.
     
  16. HugABull

    HugABull Bully Breed Advocate

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    And if a breeder chooses not to dock at all does that mean they are irresponsible?
    That is clearly saying that it is irresponsible to even think about owning an undocked dog of a traditionally docked breed.
     
  17. Miakoda

    Miakoda New Member

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    I think it's a **** shame that any working standard has been tossed out the window and in it's place came a standard of tail docks.

    I would much rather take a spaniel that could actually hunt than one with a pretty nub.

    While I won't ever push to make cropping and docking illegal (because we've got enough laws), I will push for people to quit doing some meaningless and money wasting surgeries.
     
  18. Psyfalcon

    Psyfalcon Fishies!

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    Agreed. The biggest problem is that they are potentially "throwing out" a show dog. If the breeder is willing to take that risk, why should anyone care that they have a tailed dog running around?

    Yes, it is out of standard, but it has NOTHING to do with the actual breeding. If one could prove its correctness another way, I wouldn't care if it was bred, since the tail has genetically nothing to do with the dog.

    Show people might not want to loose the potential show dog/breeder, but those who still hunt the dogs (there must be a few) would likely be much more willing, they are in some other breeds.
     
  19. 4WheelVFR

    4WheelVFR New Member

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    Here's a couple pics of Toby (RIP buddy) with a full tail. Not the best pics, but they're some of the few digital photos I have of him. He liked his tail and wagged it profusely! It did look like a rat tail when he was swimming though.:)
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  20. Dekka

    Dekka Just try me..

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    Ok here's the thing with not docking on request... If say you don't dock a pup and what if the its not the right match for the owner. Not every litter is going to have a pup for every person. I have one person waiting on a pup. The last litter didn't have what she was looking for, so now she is waiting 2 years to see if my next litter has what she is looking for.

    What if the pup you don't dock turns out to be a great working dog, or conformation prospect? What if you end up having to keep the pup, or greatly reduce its price because the people looking are looking for a traditional dog? (and that is why people often go with pure breds, yes the like the temperment, but also the look)

    At 3 days they look more like guinea pigs than dogs, and you have no idea about temperement, so IMO it is very irresponsible to decide at 3 days what pup should go to what owner.

    Now if a breeder doesn't dock the whole litter, my question would be why? Are none of the dogs suitable to be conformation, or working dogs? If so then why breed the parents?
     

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