Black golden retrievers?

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by Fran27, Jul 28, 2005.

  1. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    Someone on another forum just got a litter of supposedly registered golden retrievers... and half of them are black. They say it happens. I've never heard of it, is it true, or did he do something wrong to get black ones? They are adorable though...
     
  2. stirder

    stirder Guest

    grammy??? bubbatd used to breed goldens, she would know better than anyone...but I would imagine a flat coated retriever had something to do with it.
     
  3. EliNHunter

    EliNHunter New Member

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    I've never heard of any purebred goldens having a litter containing some black puppies. Me thinks a black lab hopped over the fence? :D You know, you CAN have two males mate and both "take" and you get a mixed litter of puppies. I did hear quite awhile ago that someone was trying to start a new, recognized breed of "black" golden retrievers, though. Don't remember what they were crossing with to try and achieve it... Newfoundlands, I think (which are part of a golden's heritage). But I don't think a mixed litter of supposedly two purebred goldens can happen unless there are two daddies ;)
     
  4. stirder

    stirder Guest

    I heard of that 2, the folks trying to make black goldens. their were 2 groups at the same time that I heard of...one crossed newfounlands with goldens and then tried crossing back to goldens, dont know if it worked. the other tried flat coated retrievers with goldens and thought they would achieve the goal faster, since fcr's are closer in size, shape, and energy level. that was a few years ago and I havnt heard any more about them so I assume they gave up???
    when we too rory for her vet ceck on monday she told us about a lady whos cat had a litter a month ago or so. there were 9 kittens, guess how many dads/sires??? :) 9. they looked different enough from each other and their mom that the owner had a dna test done. since dna cant tell breed, they dont know who the dads all are but the test did prove each one had a different father.
     
  5. EliNHunter

    EliNHunter New Member

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    Wow! NINE daddies for that cat litter!? She was a little HO, huh??? LOLOL... just skiddin'... :D
     
  6. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    Yeah I thought it was weird too... I didn't want to start arguing with the person though lol.
     
  7. showpug

    showpug New Member

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    I don't believe two gold/red goldens can have black puppies....thats just genetically impossible....I think :confused: With pugs, two fawns NEVER make a black.
     
  8. stirder

    stirder Guest

    yeah, color is genetic and each color is a different gene. two black and tan gsd's, or two black gsd's cant produce a sable gsd. two blacks dont produce a white gsd. two sables produce sables. a black dog of some breed slipped into the woodpile somewhere. though a black golden would be pretty, it would pretty much look like a flat coated retriever.
     
  9. Athe

    Athe New Member

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    It can happen. Remember our Purebred dogs are not that old...they have only been around since the latter part of the 19th century. The Golden Retriever was created from a black water type dog and there was one Golden pup I believe named Nous...he was used as the foundation of the current Golden Retriever.
    Most of our breeds have recessive genes for odd colors frowned apon by the kennel clubs. It doesnt mean they can't happen and they certainly do happen often. Back about 20 years ago so called "reputable" breeders would detroy off colored or undesired colored pups so their kennel name wouldn't have a black mark against it. I also have a friend who breeds BullMastiff's, she has been breeding for years top show quality dogs. She recently had a long coated BullMastiff pup...it was given to a pet home and her kennel name was not attached to it as per an agreement between the new owner and breeder. I have also met a Blue Merle Rottweiler, this was a recessive gene that sprung up in this line years down the lineage.
    When you consider that Purebreds are not that old and they are the result of extensive line breeding and in breeding and cull the off colored pups or undesired it is no wonder that off colored pups can and do spring up. They can go back to the dogs used orginally to create them.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2005
  10. bubbatd

    bubbatd Moderator

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    EliN was right on. I bred to a female once ( not mine ) and she had mixed.. some black, some golden. He finally admitted to me that his neighbor had a black lab !! And yes... they did try to cross goldens with Newfies and they were beautiful !! This was quite a while ago and I haven't heard anything more about them.
     
  11. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    The guy said it's because they were from German lines?

    In any case, they're adorable... I've seen some golden/newfoundlands mixes too, it's my two favorite breeds so needless to say I would love to have one, lol!
     
  12. shredhead (DOG LOVER)

    shredhead (DOG LOVER) Dog Spoiler

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    Wouldn't that be considered a HUGE flaw in this breed's standards? Lol it even has golden in their names.
     
  13. EliNHunter

    EliNHunter New Member

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    Yes. That's why I guess if breeders get them, they destroy them. :mad: Sounds like it is possible... that a recessive gene comes through...
     
  14. Fran27

    Fran27 New Member

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    Poor things...
     
  15. I_LOVE_cInDeR11

    I_LOVE_cInDeR11 I_LOVE_cInDeR11

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    I Have A So Called "black Retriever" It Is Really Called A Flat Coated Retriever. The Reason It Is Called Flat Coated Is Because The Greek Word Flate' Meaning Black In English, And The Word Coated Meaning "all Or Whole" In Other Words The Entire Body. :)
     
  16. well color is genetic butyou can have two white dogs produce all black puppies because black is dominant but i have never ever heard of a golden producing black lol...
     
  17. bubbatd

    bubbatd Moderator

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    I'd love to meet a flat coated ! They've only been recognized for 15 years.
     
  18. BlackDog

    BlackDog Guest

    ''I also have a friend who breeds BullMastiff's, she has been breeding for years top show quality dogs. She recently had a long coated BullMastiff pup...it was given to a pet home and her kennel name was not attached to it as per an agreement between the new owner and breeder. I have also met a Blue Merle Rottweiler, this was a recessive gene that sprung up in this line years down the lineage.''

    Well, I can understand a bullmastiff having a long haired pup because originally weren't all mastiffs today started from the Tibetan mastiffs that are long a long haired breed? But even still I would imagine that by now it wouldn't be common and if it was there's obviously something very wrong. I think its more likely to be a mutt than a purebred showing a recessive trait that's from 100+ years ago.
     
  19. Love4Pits

    Love4Pits Playful Husky Pup

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    A flat coated retreiver is pretty much a black golden retreiver. My dad has a friend of his who has an old Flatty named Bert and I always thought he was a golden mix but he informed me of what he really was and i even met a breeder of flattys once.
     
  20. I_LOVE_cInDeR11

    I_LOVE_cInDeR11 I_LOVE_cInDeR11

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    IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO SEE A LARGER PICTURE OF A FLAT COAT, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO SEND IT TO YOU. JUST EMAIL ME @ jenelljacobson@earthlink.net. I WILL SEND YOU SOME INFORMATION AND THE PICTURE OF A FLAT COAT SO THAT YOU CAN NOTICE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN GOLDENS AND FLAT COATS!!! :D
     

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