American Molosser?

Discussion in 'The Dog Breeds' started by Sweet72947, Jun 26, 2007.

  1. Sweet72947

    Sweet72947 Squishy face

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    In the classifieds I have started seeing ads for American Molossers. Is this some actual breed, or just a mix of big dogs? Aren't Molossers a type of dog? Like the Ovtcharka is considered a Molosser. Confused.:confused:
     
  2. oc_spirit

    oc_spirit Snow Girl

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    American Molosser also known as the American Bull Molosser

    http://www.aspenrare.com/hometwo.html

    http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/a/americanbullmolosser.htm

    http://www.aspenrare.com/AM-breedings.html

    the following is taken from www.molosserdogs.com

    I am friends with the original owner (and I believe breeder???) of the famous Sher Kahn. When he was up for sale I wanted terribly to buy him but knew at the time I couldn't offer him everything he needed to truly be a happy balanced dog.
     
  3. oc_spirit

    oc_spirit Snow Girl

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    And here is the definition of a "Molosser Dog" from Wikpedia:

     
  4. planet molosser

    planet molosser CASSA

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    American Molosser are Bandogs YES mixed breeds.

    Ovcharkas translates from Russian to English ( loosely) to Shepherds dogs or sheep dogs or dogs to graze with sheep.
    Thus when a show is in Russia they will called the OES the a Ovcharka.
    So without the Central asian or Caucasian in front of it you do not have a breed.
    And when you do write Caucasian Ovcharka you are translating HALF the Russian name which is not correct _ but easy I suppose.

    Central Asians as well as Mastiff etc etc are classified as Molosser Group 2 FCI from countries of origin.
    See this link http://www.fci.be/nomenclatures_detail.asp?lang=en&file=group2

    Here is a verifable defination of Molosser direct from History books.
    From the FIRST and most accurate Molosser site on the net.
    WRitten from a noted ethical breeder with whose hobby is RESEARCH.
    http://www.moloss.com For the above click articles.

    We can clearly see by the above that the word Molosser is a misnormer and are originally not describing the breeds now classified as Molosser dogs. Nevertheless is this the word that in modern times describes the breeds in question and I will continue to use this word in lack of a better word that embraces all these breeds.

    Here is a link for a American Molosser dog of the month
    http://www.molosserofthemonth.com/motm/year/2005/05/

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Cassiepeia

    Cassiepeia Chihuahua Mum

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    *sigh* What exactly is the point of this "re-creation"? Don't we already have enough "ultimate working protection dogs" as it is? Designer mutts for men, is how I see a lot of these dogs.

    Not that the dog itself isn't a gorgeous looking animal, but come on. :rolleyes:

    Cass.
     
  6. Sweet72947

    Sweet72947 Squishy face

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    Thanks for all the info guys.:cool:
     
  7. oc_spirit

    oc_spirit Snow Girl

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    Not really, deseigner breeds have no purpose other than to be profitable to the breeder and lap dogs to the buyer. This breed has a purpose: A capable protection and guard dog that has little to no dog-agression. Look at all the qualifications (stated above) that the dog must meet in order to be of breeding quality as an American Molosser and not simply a Bandog. Of course there are some people out there who take this name and slap it on their litter simply to try and improve sales but then they wouldnt be true American Molossers. potential buyers of this new breed need to be very careful when looking for a breeder. Dogs must be titled and health tested.

    ETA: BTW, I double checked with my friend and he actually does still own Sher Kahn, I thought he had placed him.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2007
  8. planet molosser

    planet molosser CASSA

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    [QUOTE=Cassiepeia;744898]*sigh* What exactly is the point of this "re-creation"? Don't we already have enough "ultimate working protection dogs" as it is? Designer mutts for men, is how I see a lot of these dogs.

    Not that the dog itself isn't a gorgeous looking animal, but come on. :rolleyes:

    Cass.[/QUOTE]



    You are correct it is NOT a breed untill they are bred American Molosser to American Molosser for 3 generations.

    Bandogs have been around for centuries .
    See this thread on chaz
    http://www.chazhound.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20392&highlight=bandogs

    This applies to all breeds or designer or bandogs ,Work vs Show.
    All dogs need to be screened for inherited genetic issues and in this case performance tested in all venues.

    Proven is as Proven does.

    IF not it looks like a backyard breeder, guess what it is a backyard breeder.

    BTU I agree this dog is the best looking AM ive ever seen on the net.
    hell dam nice dog no matter the breed or cross there of.
    Sad he is giving up his dreams.
     
  9. Cassiepeia

    Cassiepeia Chihuahua Mum

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    I disagree in part....a designer dog/mutt is a dog created for profit and selfishness, in a world already too overcrowded, that serves no unique purpose (ie: the niche has been filled several times over already). I include a large number of re-creations and, indeed, bandogs in this. I can except and exclude dogs that are already now established breeds and have strict ethic of genetic testing.
    I do understand that on occasion a purpose bred cross is needed and helpful, however we have enough breeds to cover every job imaginable and I see no reason why these "re-creations" are anything unique that the world needed.
    I also believe that a large number of people who breed these dogs simply believe their own hype and can't see past their own ego. Especially if they have a bunch of people around them who don't know any better (or just don't care) telling them how fantastic it is.

    There are already too many dogs in the world to be so flippant about breeding, IMO.

    Cass.
     
  10. oc_spirit

    oc_spirit Snow Girl

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    Their reasoning is that yes there are breeds that can serve protection purposes, but they find some areas lacking with those breeds so they create this mix to suit those needs.

    Just like with the Alaskan Husky. There are many freighting breeds already available (Siberian Husky, Alaskan Malamute, Canadian Eskimo Dog, Greenland Dog, Samoyed, so on so forth) but somebody decided that speed was lacking as well as trainability so they cross in German Shorthaired Pointer or Greyhound or Saluki, or whatever breed when crossed with Siberian Husky they believe will fill the niche and Tadaa you get the Alaskan Husky!

    Perhaps it takes getting to know a breeder and their dogs to get a full appreciation of what they are doing/creating?

    JMO :D
     
  11. planet molosser

    planet molosser CASSA

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    I have met American Molossers, attended PP events and held them as well.
    My opinion is based on results or lack there of.

    However I have seen PROVEN Bandogs from breeders who performance test and PROVE their dogs in work and health testing.
     
  12. Cassiepeia

    Cassiepeia Chihuahua Mum

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    Perhaps this can also create a bias towards the breeder? And blind someone to the big picture? People can be very persuasive, especially when you like them as a friend. ;)

    Cass.
     
  13. planet molosser

    planet molosser CASSA

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    :hail: :hail:

    Hitting ones nail on ones own logic head ..
    The dog world is filled with these type of "politics".
    Even someone like this could decide you are a "bad breeder" based on what the lack of competition their friends do or in this case DO not do with their dogs.

    I think it is sad when somoene takes someones bias WORD over facts .
    About how a breeder or breed develops.

    What makes a breeder or in this case a breed is well documentad here nd thru out the Net. We did not make it up and when people dont fit the bill they become "friends".

    I am not friendly with any miller, commercial or backyard breeder.
    I would NEVER call them friend.
    But I do know some and I cant recommend them if they do not DOT the I and cross the T's in dog breeding.
    I however dont HUNT the above down either or talk sales away from them on whim or personal reasons or preferences _of not liking them.

    UNLESS they attack my hard work or any hard work of a real breeder of a breeder really trying to found a new breed.
    Or come here to Chaz or post on the Molosser board I help with.

    Then no holds barred WW 2 style in which they are exposed for what they are.

    Ok enough rant got to get some coffee.

    No reason to create mutts period FI hybrids.
    Unless a need is filled in creating a new breed, or helping a established breed with a low gene pool . A breed is NOT a breed until bred true for 3 generations.
     

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