not for beginners

That is the problem with many working breeds today. People see the "show" dogs and expect that is what all the dogs of that breed are like. GSD's were created as WORKING DOGS and over time their temperaments have changed drastically, and most "GSD's" can be compared to labs and goldens, but they are not true representations of the breed. People underestimate GSD's and it upsets me. I see my breed getting destroyed because of people false perceptions. I am in no way making them out to be monsters, but they are not cuddly, social, couch potatoe dogs. They are a very stable minded breed but are protective, drivey, and can be agressive at times.

Showdawgs, but that is the same with anyworking breed that is popular. A working lab is NOTHING like those huge ponderous dogs you see in the show ring. A confomation lab makes a great first dog. A field lab can make some of my JRTs look laid back.

ACD's and they are not for people experienced with calmer breeds only either. You need to understand a far more intelligent thinking and working dog to own these and understand that nipping is what they do.
You can not own one and strive to change that which was bred into it.

If you care to use the search button, you will find that a great number of people feel the same way. That said, most American GSDs are very different than the German Working lines or the Czech lines. There are are likely to be very few first time dog owners looking into those lines.

The majority of GSDs with American breeders, shelters, or rescues, are not working lines and could make a good pet for the first time dog owner. No matter what we think the breed should be, there are many show type GSDs who need homes and may be fine. We can all hope that that first time owner sees the potential in that dog and "upgrades" to a proven working line dog in the future though.

I understand that, but my focus is the GSD not any other breed. My concern is people, who think all GSD's are great family pets, then they go overseas and import a GSD (not knowing the difference between lines) and get a dog they weren't expecting. I've seen this happen too many times. Two of my dogs, Mace and Sasha came to me as a result of that. People importing dogs because they were not aware of the gap between working and show dogs. It kills me to see wonderful GSD's in shelters because the owners were unaware of the GSD's true temperament. People (non-dog people) do not understand the difference between working lines and show lines in any working breed, and unless they are told about the different lines and such they will assume that all dogs of the same breed are the same.

So why don't these breeders of working dogs, explain to, or refuse, the prospective owners. I don't sell JRTs to pet homes (for the most part) because they are not your typical pet dog. To me the breeders should educate the buyers. I have turned many people away from my breed.

And I would be soooo picky if I was to sell a pup out of country, as its harder to get it back if something goes wrong.

The average person does not know that there is a difference. If you want to go ahead and say GSD's are great for first time owners, fine, but make sure you explain the difference between showlines and working lines.

I know, and alot of that falls back on the breeders. I dont know how any responsible breeder would place my Mace in a home with 6 bratty children. His behaviors and tendencies didnt just magically appear one day . Alot of breeder overseas have incredible dogs but are more concerned about the profit, IMO and improving their own breeding program, not concerned with the ones they dont need. but then again people can be very sneaky and can pass extensive screening. And if you have all the money in the world you can get whatever you want.

The average person also does not have access to the working lines. The majority of them are tightly controlled by the breeders who do take the time to turn down unsuspecting homes. There are very few in shelters or rescues and probably none in pet stores. Worrying about the 1% in a thread like this is really just wasting time and energy...

A dog is a dog is a dog. I don't think a universal "beginner dog" exists. Are there dogs that are easier to manage in terms of intensity? Yes, definitely. But every dog has something that's intense and difficult about them, and it depends on what kind of traits the new owner wants to deal with. Some people would rather deal with dog-aggression than an overabundance of energy. Some would rather have a dog prone to being nervous rather than over-protective. Everyone wants to say that their breed is not for beginners because I think all of us have seen our breed in shelters because it was "too much" for some people - but in reality, dogs in general aren't easy to own with very little knowledge of animals. It has less to do with the breed, and more to do with how prepared the new owner is.

i don't think any first time dog owner should have a dog that big, because a larger dog IS harder to control in an emergency.

if someone was absolutely SET on getting a large dog, i'd say a Newfoundland.

The average person with money does have acess to working lines. Like I said, 2 out of my 6 dogs cane to me as a result of this. There are many more working lines available than you think. And I apologize that my passion for this breed is useless and a waste of time .

Sadly this is no longer true.
There are more and more BYB of DDR and Czech GSDs popping up every day and more and more are showing up in rescue all the time.

Though I don't see the GSD as showdawgz does and don't quite agree on how they paint the GSD, they are right on the availability of working line GSDs to any joe that wants a sable dog

Cruiser is the first dog that I have had COMPLETE responsibility for. I had dogs growing up, one as a very young puppy, but the responsibility of those were on my parents. Cruiser is part great dane/part lab but his mannerisms are ALL dane and I couldn't ask for a better pup!

Training is a MUST though because of his size. I'm a small girl and I have to be able to control him when he is 100+ pounds. Lucky for me, he is EXTREMELY smart!

Terriers.... Fila's for sure.

Sorry, I'm one of those owners who talks to their dogs and expects them to understand me . . . It's worked for all of my Sheps, even the adult male GSD/Akita from the pound (Bear ended up being a certified therapy dog). It works with Bimmer (a GSD/wolf rescue) and it absolutely works with my Filas (now there's one that's not for most owners - first time or not). And there are several here who can attest to the fact that it works. I'm one of the few who has a full working line Fila who can function out in the public.

Well, I keep thinking of more and more breeds that wouldn't be right...so I'll be different and post the three breeds that I most commonly recommend to first time owners:

Golden Retriever
Labrador Retriever
Poodle (Standard)

But hey, my first dog that was really and truely mine was a Rhodesian Ridgeback.

-Rosefern

Me too Renee. I talk to mine and darn it they do understand. I do not get why someone would say that. If dogs did not understand us then how do we communicate with them ? I do not just always use the same commands ie sit say etc. They do as I ask them to do. I think that comes from me spending numerous hours in fact all day with them and talking to them.

By that I meant the people who bend down to their dogs level in a baby tone saying "please dont act like this, please stop. ur going to get a timeout when we get home for this behavior" (a direct quote from a lady who had a HUGE GSD trying to kill my dog). I talk to my dogs and we all communicate very well but that lady handled her situation like an idiot. Now one thing I dont do is beg my dogs for a behavior. If my dog chooses to act out like that I IMMEDIATELY remove it from the scene, or tell em im a stern voice to knock it off. I see no need for baby talk and begging a dog to comply. I dont care if its a 2lb chihuahua or a 200lb mastiff.

Yes I am well aware of that. Dogs read body language and listen to tones rather than the actual commands. All commands have a different tone so your dog will understand what you mean, and dogs pick up on you body language as well. All my dogs automatically down if I bend down or reach down (even to the slightest degree). I actually sit with my puppies and read to them in a calm collected voice while petting them. I do this from the time they are 8 weeks and still continue to do it. In alot of ways dogs are like children, but I draw the line when it comes to BEGGING my dog to do something and allowing the dog to hear the stress and fearfulness in my voice.