Silken Windhounds

I've really been caught in serious sighthound fever it seems. I'm still planning on getting an Ibizan for my next dog. Very set on that in fact. I'm starting to gain a lot more interest in other sighthounds as well and came across a dog that looked so much like a borzoi only smaller. It's called the Silken Windhound. Anyone ever heard of them? I literally just heard about them for the first time last night and I don't know anything about them other than that I think they're absolutely gorgeous. In some pics they sort of remind me of longhaired whippets too.

Has anyone ever met one? Like I said, I'm still getting my Ibizan as my next dog, but I may end up getting another kind of sighthound as well even further down the road so I'm trying to learn about different ones.

Here's a Silken Windhound standing next to a Borzoi so you can see the size comparison




coursing






and of course this thread wouldn't be complete without a couple puppy pics

I know a few. They are looks wise and size wise the same as the LHW except the more Zoi face and the double coat. They are a good percentage whippet (even though the sites don't say it, but they used W. Wheeler's whippet stock.. which is the same as the LHWs), but are less out going than the whippets.

Yes, I have heard of them and there is a lot of controversy going on with the silken Windhound/Longhaired Whippet debate.

I think they are lovely...

huh I don't know of any debate really. (at least not with the LHW people, maybe with the ILHW people..) The only thing I have heard is that they closed the stud book too soon and have some health issues, but not in a snarky or debate way... as some of those people still own them.

I met a whole bunch of them last month at a lure coursing trial and have seen a few elsewhere. They act like...sighthounds They are not as primitive as Ibizans or Pharaohs, less independent. At the coursing trial quite a few were outgoing or aloof but I've met a few shy ones too - seems to be the case with most sighthounds. They seem to really enjoy lure coursing. There seems to be an issue keeping them in size though, as some were much larger than Whippets. It's a breed still in development and from websites I have seen, some still have Borzoi fairly close in their pedigrees.

When I was researching for our next pup (which turned out to be Watson) I came across lots of stuff about both SW and LHW...as with any "new" breed some people had strong opinions about what should and should not have been done About the snarkiest I saw was on a Whippet board. You know the old opinions are like... I was considering a SW myself, but they seemed all to be way south of us.

The LHW is definitely another one I'm interested in as well and honestly Kerri... I had never even heard of LHW until I first read your posts about yours. I also really like Borzoi as well and I think that's partly why I'm looking into Silken Windhounds since I think they look a lot like smaller Borzoi. I definitely want to do lure coursing for sure. I'm going to be coursing my Ibizan as well.

I looked at them a bit (not a lot, just a bit of online reading) after finding a super pretty one on Petfinder. I really love the look of them, but that's no surprise as I've always thought Borzois are the most gorgeous dogs ever, LOL.

This dog

is absolutely jaw dropping, oh my gosh. WANT.

They have borzoi, Walter Wheeler's stock, and sheltie in them. A lot of folks blame Walter Wheeler's LHW for sheltie, and that's where the controversy comes from. The LHW folks insist their dogs are pure whippet, and everybody else insists not.

Regardless, silkens have an extremely high occurence of the MDR1 gene (drug sensitivity) which is comparatively rare in both purebred borzoi and whippets, but very common in shelties. So sheltie got in there somehow.

Also, some folks have told me it can be a challenge to find venues for lurecoursing with them if that's something you'd like to do competitively. Same deal with LHW though.

I've met a bunch, and really they are very lovely dogs. Pretty typical sight hound temperaments, quiet, sensitive, etc. They all made really good house dogs.

I know nothing about them but I just had to echo this!

Actually if we wish to be factual there is no evidence of sheltie in the lines. Not saying its not there... just never been sure why people picked shelties as LHW (of the non ILWA) never have double coats. The MDR1 gene HAS been found in regular pure whippets. Its not often looked for, but its there. Same with an eye issue typical to herding breeds. Now this could be because other things were added, or it could be its in the foundations stock and both LHW and Silkens are VERY inbred (thus greatly increasing the chances of finding those issues) How do regular ch. AKC or CKC whippets have these issues then if one MUST have sheltie in there? (other than the fact all whippets have a 'farm dog' ancestry)

as no one argues they were created about that time frame (or at least not a closed breed and people still 'making their own') then why would one not expect them to have it. I have heard of some terriers testing positive. (I won't use ivermectin on ANYTHING not tested)

The controversy is much less than it used to be. The LHWA finds no problems finding ch. smooth whippets to breed too. Sure there are some vocal people, but you find that everywhere. Seems some of the vocal few have come to say they wish they could have apologized to Walter as they now believe him.

I cant say I care one way or another. Whippets are a relatively new breed, greys were bred to terriers, spaniels and the like to make whippets. Basically whippets were a poor mans dog, so there are loads of things behind whippets... ALL whippets. But saying that "The LHW folks insist their dogs are pure whippet, and everybody else insists not. " IME isn't true. The geneticist in me says it could easily go either way.. there is no evidence to believe one way or another.

As for venues, at least here the Canadian Amateur Racing Assoc recognize LHW (not sure about silkens). That is straight racing and ovals, not coursing though. The LHW course at their own events. (I assume Silkens do the same)

Bolding mine, sorry that was poor wording. I meant some folks, not all. I don't really have an opinion either way, except that the evidence like you posted suggests they are pure. I think that if sheltie got into the silkens somehow it probably came from someone who had dogs from Walter and did an outcross to shelties with their own stock, and then their dogs were used in silkens. I have no idea though, as that's just speculation. There was another club (can't think of the name!) that did start with his dogs and outcrossed them to various breeds to get different coats, like wirecoats.

Either way, both are really nice though. If I ever had to downsize, I'd probably look into either one as an option.

Ohh La la I have heard of them, but never did any research on them.

But one things for sure thats one sexy looking dog. I want!

The thing is no one (other than the vocal few) think that there is sheltie in silkens. I have no idea why they picked shelties to claim ancestry. I would think you should pick a border collie or maybe a spaniel to have the same type of coat. Neither breeds share coat patterns, texture, etc with shelties...

There are two LHW registries. One openly crosses various things in and has 'percentage' whippets (ie how much is whippet) The other one has bred only to whippets since the 50's (regardless of whether they started out pure or not)

Ya either way they are fun breeds. LOL this is why I like JRTs, far less getting all upset about such things. How ever they happened they are here now.

Their name always seems like a fairy tale creature to me, lol.

WOW! They are very beautiful.

I really like silkens! I have met several at ASFA events and they are nice little dogs, very pretty and most have great temperaments that I've met If it were something you were to lure course with, last I knew they still are not allowed to run AKC

I met two at a dog show in Tulsa this past spring. They were both wonderful little dogs. One of them took Reserve BIS in altered conformation. They were very sweet and seemed pretty confident.