Setting up rescue dogs for failure?

SoCrafty · Mar 1, 2014

So, I've been browsing rescue sites for Shelties (still not ruling out a rescue!) And I swear, every single dog is marked 'no kids'. And its not even just the local Sheltie rescue. I've seen some in other states doing this too. I've heard plenty of wonderful stories about Shelties and kids. It just blows my mind that all of these Shelties are seriously not good with kids and its such a turnoff. I don't have kids yet, but we will someday, so if we do get a rescue, I'd rather have one that doesn't say 'no kids'. How many of these dogs are getting passed over by what could be wonderful homes, because the rescue is labeling them all this way? I seriously doubt that 30 out of 30 of these dogs in this particular rescue are not kid friendly. I think that the rescue just doesn't want to adopt to anyone with a kid.

So, what has everyone else seen a rescue do that limits their dogs getting adopted?

krissy · Mar 1, 2014

In the greyhound adoption world it's general blanket statements that they will not adopt if you:
1. Do not have a fence
2. Have children under X age
3. Are a student

Those are the worst generalized statements I've seen. In years past I've heard some groups wouldn't adopt to you if you had cats, small animals, or small dogs.

Not all groups have these statements but some do.

Greenmagick · Mar 1, 2014

IME some groups are more gun shy after having bad experiences in the past. I can't always blame them and many will work around some of the criteria if you are willing to work with them and prove yourself in a way...otherwise there are other rescues that have fewer restrictions.

BostonBanker · Mar 1, 2014

While I agree it may be setting them up to be more difficult to adopt, I'd actually consider "setting up rescue dogs for failure" to be adopting them out to anyone who shows up with the fee, rather than being specific about where the dog should be placed.

If 100% of the dogs are labeled "no kids", then yes, I'd assume the rescue has a "no adoptions to families with kids under 'x' years of age" policy. But if a rescue has a dog who, for instance, whips his head around and has hard eyes when his coat is tugged, or has even mild resource guarding, or who seems to get over stimulated by running/loud kids - I get labeling them that way.

So many people already want to hate on rescue dogs. "They all have baggage", "there's a reason they are in rescue", "I'd rather have a puppy so it will bond with me", "I would never rescue because I don't want someone else's problems". If someone gets a rescue dog and it doesn't succeed in the home, the people often say "I'd never do rescue again, I can't handle this" and they go to a breeder next time. Rescues have to be so, so **** careful about placements or the bad stories spread like wildfire - and when they are so careful, people trounce all over them for being too picky. They just can't win.

If I thought I wanted a dog from that rescue, I'd absolutely email them. "Hi, I'm me. I'm interested in a sheltie because ___ and I came across your rescue. This is what we are looking for in a dog ___. We are considering having children in probably ___ or ___ years. I would love to hear from you if you have any dogs that you think would work for our situation."

As Greenmagick said, a lot of rescues have blanket policies that they will be flexible with. If they say "no way do our dogs go into homes where children will ever be present", then don't work with that rescue.

Laurelin · Mar 1, 2014

I always had shelties as a kid and so did my sisters. Overall it went well and I adored those dogs. That said I did get bitten by 2/3 of our shelties just for being a stupid kid and in my opinion the breed isn't as tolerant as some breeds with kid antics. Nor are papillons (though Summer is and Nard is).

Nikki was fantastic and a nanny dog with respectful kids but I don't doubt would bite in other instances (and did bite me once as a kid). Trey... I wouldn't adopt a dog like him to a house with little kids either though obviously he lived with my sisters while they were young.

I can see why rescues are a bit gunshy even if the dog COULD live with kids if the parents have common sense. If they adopt out a dog as good with kids and then it bites they could be in a world of trouble.

Obviously though shelties and kids can go together very nicely.

JessLough · Mar 1, 2014

BostonBanker said:

While I agree it may be setting them up to be more difficult to adopt, I'd actually consider "setting up rescue dogs for failure" to be adopting them out to anyone who shows up with the fee, rather than being specific about where the dog should be placed.

If 100% of the dogs are labeled "no kids", then yes, I'd assume the rescue has a "no adoptions to families with kids under 'x' years of age" policy. But if a rescue has a dog who, for instance, whips his head around and has hard eyes when his coat is tugged, or has even mild resource guarding, or who seems to get over stimulated by running/loud kids - I get labeling them that way.

So many people already want to hate on rescue dogs. "They all have baggage", "there's a reason they are in rescue", "I'd rather have a puppy so it will bond with me", "I would never rescue because I don't want someone else's problems". If someone gets a rescue dog and it doesn't succeed in the home, the people often say "I'd never do rescue again, I can't handle this" and they go to a breeder next time. Rescues have to be so, so **** careful about placements or the bad stories spread like wildfire - and when they are so careful, people trounce all over them for being too picky. They just can't win.

If I thought I wanted a dog from that rescue, I'd absolutely email them. "Hi, I'm me. I'm interested in a sheltie because ___ and I came across your rescue. This is what we are looking for in a dog ___. We are considering having children in probably ___ or ___ years. I would love to hear from you if you have any dogs that you think would work for our situation."

As Greenmagick said, a lot of rescues have blanket policies that they will be flexible with. If they say "no way do our dogs go into homes where children will ever be present", then don't work with that rescue.

This. I was really confused at first as to how this is setting dogs up to fail.

That said, the rescue you are talking about... are you sure they are just a normal rescue, and not one that takes in more "troubled" cases, ie cases that just... won't be good with kids?

Laurelin · Mar 1, 2014

Also, one of my friends runs a sheltie rescue here. I'm not sure where you're located but if you're in TX and OK I can point you in a good direction.

A lot of their rescues are hard cases it seems. She's always on the look out for agility type dogs since she does agility (and is always telling me she'd find me one if I want). But most their rescues are seniors with health problems or really really shy dogs. It doesn't seem like many shelties end up in rescue in the first pace but the ones that do are very often seniors or maybe mill dogs with a lot of baggage. Papillon rescue is very similar as far as what they get in. I know one of the main papillon rescues generally refers people to breeders for that reason because the few dogs they get in don't fit the average pet dog mold. It seems very rare you find a young healthy papillon in rescue. With other breeds though young healthy rescue dogs are common.

SoCrafty · Mar 1, 2014

Oh, I understand that rescues can be gunshy and I get that they have to do what they have to in order to assure that the dog doesn't keep winding up in the system. I just wish that there was a better way to label it. Otherwise, a dog that is good with older children, but has a label that says no kids, is just going to get passed over.

I know that rescue dogs have baggage, and I know that most of it can probably be overcome once they are in a stable environment and learn obedience etc. Most of the people that I've heard WANT to rescue, choose not to because of the demands from the rescue center itself (a lot of times its because of the application. Heard about one from someone that wanted the last 2 jobs you had worked at, several personal non-related references and a couple other things). That is so sad to hear.

And I was mostly just curious if this was just happening in this breed or if other types of breeds faced restrictions.

crazedACD · Mar 1, 2014

SoCrafty said:

Yeah, I don't really think anything of it when every dog is listed as no kids. But as an adopter with no kids, and I will never have any, I probably wouldn't give a 'no kids' dog a second glance, to be honest. That automatically makes me think the dog is a bite risk. It would have to be a really interesting dog for me to look closer at it.

SizzleDog · Mar 1, 2014

Greenmagick said:

Basically this. The rescue I volunteer for has a "no kids under X" rule, but it's because the #1 reason for return is.... kids. #1 reason for dogs coming into our rescue in the first place is..... kids. But we have waived the kid rule in certain instances.

sassafras · Mar 1, 2014

crazedACD said:

Honestly, I feel the exact same way. To me a "no kids" designation on a dog's Petfinder or other profile says THIS dog isn't good with kids, not that the group has a policy about kids of a certain age, and I would probably pass by. I might be suspicious if every single dog from a particular rescue had the designation, but still... there are better ways to communicate that policy, I think.

sillysally · Mar 2, 2014

BostonBanker said:

While I agree it may be setting them up to be more difficult to adopt, I'd actually consider "setting up rescue dogs for failure" to be adopting them out to anyone who shows up with the fee, rather than being specific about where the dog should be placed.

If 100% of the dogs are labeled "no kids", then yes, I'd assume the rescue has a "no adoptions to families with kids under 'x' years of age" policy. But if a rescue has a dog who, for instance, whips his head around and has hard eyes when his coat is tugged, or has even mild resource guarding, or who seems to get over stimulated by running/loud kids - I get labeling them that way.

So many people already want to hate on rescue dogs. "They all have baggage", "there's a reason they are in rescue", "I'd rather have a puppy so it will bond with me", "I would never rescue because I don't want someone else's problems". If someone gets a rescue dog and it doesn't succeed in the home, the people often say "I'd never do rescue again, I can't handle this" and they go to a breeder next time. Rescues have to be so, so **** careful about placements or the bad stories spread like wildfire - and when they are so careful, people trounce all over them for being too picky. They just can't win.

If I thought I wanted a dog from that rescue, I'd absolutely email them. "Hi, I'm me. I'm interested in a sheltie because ___ and I came across your rescue. This is what we are looking for in a dog ___. We are considering having children in probably ___ or ___ years. I would love to hear from you if you have any dogs that you think would work for our situation."

As Greenmagick said, a lot of rescues have blanket policies that they will be flexible with. If they say "no way do our dogs go into homes where children will ever be present", then don't work with that rescue.

This!

Aleron · Mar 2, 2014

Being against placing dogs in homes with kids is one of those blanket policy issues in the rescue world unfortunately. If a rescue always has every single dog listed as no kids, I'd assume they are a rescue who thinks dogs shouldn't be placed in home with kids.

I'm sorry but I don't buy the "they had a bad experience with someone who had kids, so now they just have a blanket policy about it". They're a rescue and finding dogs good homes should be a priority. Not "well that home with kids didn't work so let's never adopt out to anyone with kids". One home with kids is no more the same as the next as one person of a certain race or gender or age is the same as the next. Could you imagine if rescues started discriminating based on those things? "Well that one person was foreign, I could tell by the accent and they didn't work out so, only people born in America can adopt from us" or "Well that 21 year old girl seemed nice then she ended up pregnant and returning the dog, so no one under 30 any more". I don't know here's an idea for rescues - how about evaluating the individual people rather than the stereotype you have of them?

Good Homes Need Not Apply:
http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=6359

Brattina88 · Mar 2, 2014

I agree that some of the 'blanketing rules' are failing some dogs. I was turned down from sheltie rescue because of the no fence rule, the kennel didn't count. Now I have a beautiful sheltie regardless and I could not have asked for a better match. But what breaks my heart is two of the dogs that were in the rescue then, are still there now. I'm not saying those two would've been a good match for me, but it was never even considered, so I do find that sad. At least they're in foster homes and not sitting in a shelter or pound.
But for the cocker rescue I volunteer for, they don't do blanketed rules and look into every application. They don't approve every one, of course, but for us if the foster homes are full/taken then that's fewer dogs can be rescued. And when I think about reasons dogs have been returned, it's rarely Ever for something a blanketed rule could prevent. I do think that's different for every breed, though. (Like Kids) we've had dogs returned for people illness (cancer, eating disorders). And the fence rule still upsets me. You can be an irresponsible owner with a fence. I see it all the time.

If I was searching on PF, if the dog was marked "no kids" I would assume it's because that individual dog needs a home without kids. Some shelties do get very skittish or reactive around kids. Their running and sporadic movements do make them want to nip at heels. My childhood sheltie. Nikki used to "herd" us away from the pond all the time

she was a great nanny dog. Bailey loves well behaved kids one at a time. But she can be very skittish

Setting up rescue dogs for failure?

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