Fenzi Courses

I haven't taken them yet, but I have heard nothing but good things about the Shaping class. I've also heard great things about Denise's heeling classes ( I think the first is precision heeling, then heeling games) and I will take those two as soon as they come up (I think in Oct).

After you sign up for a class you should join the Fenzi students facebook group. I get a lot of good info from there.

Just curious, why so much interest in the FCI and IPO classes?

If you really want to work on heeling, I would do Precision Heeling followed by Heeling Games. Those two classes will set you up for beautiful heeling. Denise is a great teacher and has done IPO and AKC obedience, so I think they will have what you're looking for. I've taken both and they were fantastic. To do Heeling Games you need to have a fairly decent heel already, but nothing polished. I should have waited to take it later because our heeling was not up to the level where I could get the most use out of the games.

If you're interested in obedience behaviors, I would look into the Obedience Skill Building classes (they are a series) or Obility.

I've heard great things about the shaping classes. I've also heard great things aouut Performance Fundamentals for a new dog or puppy and I plan to take it in June with my new pup.

Haha, yes, still hoping we can be 2017ish koolie pup owners together!

Good to know about the performance puppy and the performance fundamentals.

For the shaping class, is there specific tricks you are supposed to work on each week, or you get to decide what you want to try and shape and then get critiqued by the videos submitted? This does sound like one that would be useful to do at the gold level as far as reward placement/timing/correct criteria and timing of increasing/decreasing criteria.

Yes, I have heard good things about the precision heeling and heeling games!

Good to know there is a facebook group! Maybe I could ask someone to ask a question if I take the bronze level and no one seems to be asking the question I am wanting an answer to.

I am really nervous about paying so much $$ for courses that I may already know the information, do the exercises or know of the exercises, or could find easily enough online.
Such for the conditioning one, there is a facebook group that is excellent about this topic and has excellent files. But what I am wanting more help with in this area is more learning the muscles/anatomy of dogs, what should be strengthened and why, what exercises target certain muscles or are good for certain sports, etc. I would find it super helpful basically if I could get my own training exercises and progressions for when they get more conditioned. Like if it would be listed as different levels for various types of things like core work, or strengthening or endurance and such.
I will probably take bronze for most classes, plus my aunt has her own training facility and is very good, and I could just ask her questions if I got stuck with something.

I don't really know, I have this love for the style of obedience in schutzhund/IPO. I love the precision, speed and eagerness that I have seen. I think it is more "flashy" style of obedience and I don't know, maybe I am being superficial but it just looks good/impressive to me.

For a long time I wanted a German Shepherd or Dutch to do IPO with, but was talked out of it. I really do want to start up in agility again and also really get into disc, and a shepherd probably isn't the best for this sport. I also admire Malinois.

Since I am planning on getting a Koolie, and won't be doing IPO, I still would like to get that precision/speed/enthusiasm obedience just for the heck of it. Watching AKC obedience trials just don't seem to wow me as much usually? I don't know if any of this makes sense..

Ok, So now I have read through this entire thread. I don't remember who posted it, but someone said if you buy 1 bronze level class a year, you can see all the classes you have taken- with the updated material since the time you have taken it- in your library.

Is this true? Then it seems totally worth it to take at least one class a year!

On the website it seemed more like you will only get access to it for so long and then it disappears even if you take a different course.

Nonsense! There are some incredible GSD and Dutch agility and disc dogs.

I also know a pretty bad ass Koolie that plays IPO.

(I am with you on the heeling front. AKC obedience does not appeal to me whatsoever compared to IPO. It's a whole different beast, looking for two different types of dog.)

Would this koolie be owned by Sara? I was so excited to find out she was going to IPO training!

I was like OMG! Maybe I could.. try.. IPO with my future koolie! !

But yes, the AKC obedience vs IPO is way different and I don't have the desire to work hard on AKC obedience but would for something I find more impressive (at least looking, not trying to diss AKC obedience folks) like IPO.

Can you answer my question of what the difference in heeling is in FCI vs. IPO in the Fenzi courses?

As I mentioned, Denise has done IPO so I think you'll find the heeling she teaches to be very precise and flashy. Not everybody in gold spots will be in the same place. For the IPO classes I would only do them with a high drive dog with a lot of toy drive. Not that you couldn't do it with another dog, but there are other classes that would probably be a better fit to cover the same topics.

You may not like akc obedience because a lot of dogs look pretty low energy and a little shut down. You'll find that Fenzi classes teach the complete opposite of that and enthusiasm and speed is a priority.

From the FAQs page:

What is a library pass and how do I get one?

Each student is automatically given a library pass for one year from the point of enrollment in a course. A library pass allows you to log onto the site and review all of the lectures and videos posted by the instructor over the course of the class. The lectures are updated every time the class is offered (with the same instructor), so you always have the most current version. Library passes do not allow you to review courses that you have not previously enrolled in. Library passes also do not give you multiple versions of a class if it is taught by multiple instructors.

You can keep your library pass current by enrolling in at least one course a year. Alternatively, you can purchase a library pass for $50 per year for as long as you wish to have access to prior class materials. Please note that the forum portion of classes is not included in your library pass; that material is removed two weeks after class ends. If you wish to keep access to your personal Gold level forum thread, you will be given instructions on how to do so at the end of class.

It really just comes down to preference in training styles and the students that the trainers are putting out. I simply don't find fenzi's heeling to be of the same calibre as Micke- so I am taking a seminar with him over her. I like shade's heel training better than Fenzi, too. Everyone has their own goals and preferences for one reason or another.

And I see no reason why an IPO class should be done with high drive dogs hot for a toy? Most IPO obedience that yields these awesome flashy dogs is started with food. You can't learn how to bring out those drives with a trainer that is expecting a dog to stay low in drive.

As someone who has taken Fenzi's precision heeling and Kamal's FCI heeling I can tell you the main technique they use to teach it is different.

The FCI class uses a sustained hand touch vs Fenzi doing a lot of stationary finding heel exercises. I'm Happy I've taken both, I find that I take bits and blurbs from everywhere to create an overall picture.

That aside, I think taking a class from someone used to online teaching is key. Denise's classes are set up very clearly, I've taken some that were not.

Thanks everyone! You all have been a big help!

I think I will probably take obedience/heeling courses from several of the trainers to see the various techniques/styles they use. I like seeing a variety and picking and choosing what works for my dogs best, and my next dog, a koolie, will probably be a lot different than my schnauzers. Well, maybe not on the barking aspect? lol. Although, I think I am pretty good about controlling/managing this and have had 3 fairly quite schnauzers. Although Chloe definitely was not quiet to begin with, but she is quieting down a lot with training/managing her triggers/alert barking attitude.

Denise definitely sounds like she has well thought out/organized/a lot of info in her courses and I think she is someone I would try and take a lot of courses for that reason as well!

I'm still trying to figure out what I want to take this semester, and how much I want to take.

I was super displeased with the Prey Drive class, and since I spent $260 on it, kinda POed at that one. I didn't like the instructor and the class was very disjointed IMO. I will put a lot more effort into finding out if the instructors fit my training style from here on out.

Thought about Boogeyman, but a friend took it and wasn't super happy.

Now on the list is:
Sensational Stays (I've taken classes from her, and like her style)
Bridging the Gap (love Fenzi's style, just not sure if we're there yet)
Tracking (Megan helps me with tracking, but I feel like if I took a class, then I might be more likely to get out there and follow the step by steps.)


I don't think I'll be fronting for another Gold spot anytime soon, unless I know that I'll love the class. I'm a tad bit bitter right now

I feel You. I almost didn't take anything this term because the prey class : / It was incredible disjointed and despite doing every single activity made zero progress : ( Luckily I've heard nothing but amazing things about Sue's rally class so I feel pretty good about that.

I'm really sorry to hear you guys didn't like the Prey Drive class! I would be a little PO'd too and bitter, especially paying gold for something I didn't like.

Has anyone taken the Bridging the Gap class? I feel like I use too many treats too frequently. I should start using more toys and having random reward schedules and such.. so I feel like this class may be good for me!

I am thinking of POSSIBLY:
April 1st-mid july- (Wow, long class?)
Bridging the Gap- Reducing Reinforcers, Proofing and Generalization (Bronze)

October 1st: So many class wants.. not sure what I will decide.
-Canine Fitness Trainer 1-4 series ($200 total at bronze level for all 4.. so that is 8 months of classes!)

MAYBE one more class, if I had the funds:
-Precision Heeling (Bronze)- Probably would take this one
OR
-Shaping- (Gold?)


Dec 1st:
-Heeling Games (if I took Precision Heeling) (Bronze)

How often is the precision heeling or shaping ones offered? If the shaping one is offered fairly regularly, I would just take the precision heeling and take the Shaping the next time it came around as I want to spend more money for the Gold level for that class.

Has anyone done Forrest Micke's programs? The Leerburg Heeler's Toolbox?

If I had any reason to actually have a real heel, I would totally sign up for that in a heartbeat. I took his engagement skills course and for how short and simple it is, there was a ton of good info.
And I love watching his dogs heel lol, I bet that course is oozing with good stuff.

I totally was not going to take anymore Fenzi classes.... I just stopped doing anything with the last 2 I took. BUT I am getting tempted to take bridging the gap because I struggle hardcore at reducing rewards.

I am writing a letter to the academy about my disappointment, you should do the same

That is next on my list.

I may write one as well. I felt it started off great but then it never actually progressed into anything and being on a very tight budget every dollar I spend counts. I keep thinking maybe she pulls things together in 2, but I'm going to spend money on it at this point. I have really loved all my Fenzi classes this far so I kept thinking it would pull together... But nothing.



Other than that, I applied for the scholarship and am using it for heeling games this semester. I've wanted to take that class for a while so I'm pretty excited about it.

I think I will. I think I see a few e-mails for them. Let me know where you send it.