GSD biting

Joined
Dec 20, 2003
Messages
94,266
Likes
3
Points
36
Location
Where the selas blooms
#21
Yep, don't let him get the best of you. You can tell him "NO," and if necessary, even use your other hand to close his mouth and hold it shut until he gives up.

If you try to dissuade him from things you don't want him to do by offering a treat, even if it's in exchange for sitting, he just thinks you're pleased with the behaviour and you've reinforced that behavior - exactly the opposite effect from what you're trying to accomplish.

Serena's mentioned the technique of teaching dogs that nothing in life is free (NILF training), where your dog must do something, whether it's sit, or lay down, or give his paw (a good thing in your case, as that is a gesture of submission) before he gets his food, petting, play time, or anything else he enjoys. This could be something to add that will help you guide your dog's behavior into the proper channels and enable him to be a happy, well adjusted companion to you.

The thing that makes it all easier is if you can learn to think like a dog. If you can do that, you'll be able to understand what he will understand and communicate effectively with him.
 
Joined
Dec 20, 2003
Messages
94,266
Likes
3
Points
36
Location
Where the selas blooms
#22
I've never personally held the throat, only used my hand on the chest, and I've never had to physically force a dog to give me its belly, but I can see that Serena has a very valid point here. Using physical force on a dog can be a risky gambit, and it is counter-productive to what you're trying to accomplish, which is affirming your position as the leader for your dog, not challenging him for the position. From your earlier posts, though, it sounds like you're making good progress and not using physical force. You should be able to accomplish your goal without ever resorting to violent actions.
 

MEG126

New Member
Joined
May 18, 2004
Messages
134
Likes
0
Points
0
Age
37
Location
Virginia
#23
i was reading over this thread and some parts stuck out to me from my own experiences...the responses were pretty early on, but i thought maybe my experience could be of help...

Renee:
If you try to dissuade him from things you don't want him to do by offering a treat, even if it's in exchange for sitting, he just thinks you're pleased with the behaviour and you've reinforced that behavior - exactly the opposite effect from what you're trying to accomplish.


this happened with my golden, penny. whenever we'd go out on walks, she'd jump all over us, snipping, etc., so my mom started carrying treats with her on walks, and would use them to bribe penny to stop. as soon as penny saw the treat (or eventually after she caught on, once my mom started reaching for her pocket where the treats were kept) she'd stop and sit down. but once she'd eaten the treat, she'd start the whole jumping routine all over again, so it just became a trick for her. we stopped carrying treats with us and walked her in the field behind our house instead of the neighborhood, and now she's great on walks, no more jumping!! :)

next...

caesar
What is interesting in my case, is that my dog, Caesar, has complete respect for my husband (kind of like your trainer). But, I have learned this is because my husband does not let our dog get away with anything, and our dog knows this. I am sometimes too soft, and so I think Caesar knows that he can push things farther with me. Perhaps your dog knows that the trainer means business and will not put up with any antics, where with you, he thinks it's playtime.


after we had to put our first dog to sleep, we knew we wanted another dog, so we thought we would adopt a grown dog from the SPCA or newspaper ads so we wouldn't have to go through the whole training process. there was a family who had three labs (a black one, a yellow one, and a chocolate one, my mom called them neopolitan labs, one of each flavor!!) who had just moved into a new house that was really close to the interstate, and they didn't want to have to invest in a fence to prevent their dogs from running away and getting hit by cars, so they were giving them away to approved families. we thought this was great, so we went and saw the dogs, the only one left was a yellow lab, scotch (4yrs old), and we liked him and ended up taking him home with us. we noticed, however, at the owner's home that he didn't listen to anybody except the father of the house, but we just assumed it was because he had a whole new territory to explore and was more interested in his new surroundings. we took him home and he seemed to like it a lot. since it was during the summer, when i woke up in the mornings, my parents would be at work, so i was home alone and one morning i got up and went into our living room and scotch was up on the couch (no dogs on the furniture in our house!!). i told him "scotch, down" and used my arm to point him down on the floor and he growled at me and since i didn't really know this dog, i had no idea of his past i didn't know how far he would go, and since i was at home alone i didn't want to risk it, so i left him be. (i know that wasn't a great move in terms of training... but given the circumstances...). later that week we were playing fetch with scotch and our neighbors in the field between our house and our neighbors and scotch had gotten the ball and one of the little boys (i think he was like 7 at the time) tried to get the ball out of his mouth and scotch bit him on the face. now to sum up this story (sorry didn't think it was going to be this long!!!) [B]we figured out that he would only listen to dominant male figures. so i'm guessing with the couch incident he was trying to secure his place in the pecking order, but we continued to see that he wouldn't listen to my mom and i, only to my dad and bro; the same in the previous owners. so yea i think that could be why your dog was listening to the trainer/husband in your situations...[/B] happenned to us too!! so we ended up giving him back to his other owners, and we decided the best route was to start all over again and we got penny!! lol

sorry that story ended up being so long, but i hope it showed the whole dominance issue particularly...
 

opokki

New Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2004
Messages
138
Likes
0
Points
0
Location
NY
#24
For those of you that use training methods other than positive reinforcement how do you reward the dogs for good behavior?

I think the NILF training program is a great way to establish leadership. I've used it to train my dog since she was a puppy and its been very helpful with the aggressive toy poodle I adopted almost 2yrs ago. I've also used positive reinforcement in training her but I've never thought of it as bribing her :confused:. Done incorrectly I suppose it could be considered bribing though.
 
Joined
Dec 20, 2003
Messages
94,266
Likes
3
Points
36
Location
Where the selas blooms
#25
Dogs have more complex reasoning that most people give them credit for. One method isn't going to work for everything. I use a combination of things, depending on the circumstance and what I'm trying to accomplish.

They get lots of positive reinforcement when they've done something good, especially if I haven't had to tell them to do it. They must sit and show me that they have good manners before they eat or receive a treat. They always get fed, treated or petted in the dominant order, which right now is according to age (and I don't intend to allow that to be open to challenge - and I AM the boss); Bimmer first, then Shiva, then Kharma. And I never feed them until after Charlie and I have eaten. Ever.

I often share the "last bite" of my food with them. This is a powerful tool for bonding and expressing dominance. The alpha personality eats first (that's me), then shares with the pack, underscoring the position as provider and bonding as a family.

The worst punishment in the world for my dogs is my displeasure, but the reason it's so awful for them is because they set such a value on pleasing me. The worst thing I've ever had to do to any of them was cutting a switch and flicking Shiva's flanks when she didn't come when I called her and I had to go get her. Now all I have to say is "Shiva, don't make me get the switch!" Just like a kid. (groan) When I have to scold, they roll over and present their bellies to me (even Kharma, who won't back down from anything or anyone), staying in that position until I tell them they can get up. Then it's time to talk to them, and afterwards reassure them that I love them.
And of course, I talk to them. They want to be good, and they want to do things that make me happy, so they listen. We have quite a few heart-heart, nose-to-muzzle conversations.
 
Joined
Jun 14, 2004
Messages
15
Likes
0
Points
0
#26
Hi
These days I was working on my puppy. I got a good response from him. But there are still some problems that I am not able to get rid off.

1. Whenever I go to him in the morning I just start jumping on me. I tried saying “NO†but that didn’t help me. This is the same scene when I come back from my office.

2. When I try to put the collar, at that moment he tries to grab my hand. He don’t allow to put on the collar. After a long time I have to get it on. I tried to say “NO†here also but it didn’t work.

3. When we all the members in our family are sitting together, he comes over and just starts jumping on all of us. We thought that he is doing so to get our attention towards him, but we also tried talking with him when we are together, but didn’t help. We tried saying “SIT†and the “STAY†command, but he starts barking a lot, then starts jumping on and biting. I just put my knee in front, but the next time he grabs my leg!!!

How can I get rid of these problems…

Thanks
-Nilesh
 
Joined
Dec 20, 2003
Messages
94,266
Likes
3
Points
36
Location
Where the selas blooms
#27
Well, Nilesh,

It sounds like you've made quite a bit of progress with your pup and have bonded very strongly. He's obviously thrilled to see you in the morning and when you come home.

The German Shepherd is a very loyal, attached dog and his favorite bed is always going to be near you. Your post leads me to believe he is sleeping somewhere removed from you, which is okay, and he will accept it, but he is going to be thrilled and excited every morning when you appear.

He's still an exciteable boy, but will calm down some as he matures. In the meantime, it will help to remember that loud, excited voices are going to excite him more. You want to use a calm, soft voice when you need to calm him down, and always - only one person at a time talking to him! More than one person talking to him is going to confuse him and he's going to get more and more agitated.

His behaviour with the collar is also most likely excitement. Again, a calm voice and firm, but not loud, Sit command, then stroke him a bit to settle him. You may have to spend some time with this, and may even have to go back to rolling him over until he calms down.

Get some toys, a tug rope, tennis balls, etc., and when he bounds into the room to play and bounce on you and your family, use the toys to play with him. At this age he's just overflowing with energy, and coupled with the German Shepherd's desire to interact with his people, it can be a bit overwhelming.

My German Shepherds never fell for the knee trick, either. They decided it was part of the game and made great sport of avoiding my knee and being able to lick me in the face or pull my hair.
 
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
26
Likes
0
Points
0
Location
nova scotia
#28
re gsd

How old is your gsd , focus training , the dog is avoiding you , does what the trainer says,I wouldnt role him on his back and hold him this is challanging to the dog and does not do anything , you need to have your dog focus to you
 

DanL

Active Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
3,933
Likes
0
Points
36
Age
61
#29
did you look at the date of that thread? It's over 3 years old. Hopefully he's worked past that issue with his dog by now.
 

Members online

No members online now.
Top